Player Discussion Jesse Puljujarvi Discussion Part 4 [UPD: Nov 24th Recalled]

[HugginThePost]

As someone who has watched him play over the years, but hardly at all this year due to me working in Oman and having shit internet, can someone smarter than me explain why be was drafted so high?

I look back at his stats and in every league he's been in as far back as 2012 he's never scored at a PPG.

He did have a monster 2016 WJC, but I wounder if that was box score "monster" vs actual "monster? By that I mean did he feast on the China and Japan's of the world or did he produce against the top clubs?

I'll assume that some of it can be due to him being very young or possibly him growing into that large frame of his. But what say you?

When I went to look at his stats from his younger days I was expecting to see huge numbers. Is this more due to the fact that he never played in the junior system over here? Would he have been better served playing over here vs staying in Finland?

Anyway, just curious. Hope he turns it around.....seems to be a very likable guy.

 

[Panda Bear]

Check again.

As a 16 year old in 14-15, he put up 18 points in 11 games in Finland's U20 junior league before going on to make his Liiga debut that year. Every year prior he put up more than a point per game in the top junior age group against kids who were two years older or more than him. He killed it at both the WJC-18 and the WJC-20. He literally scored a hat-trick against Sweden in the WJC-18 final.

Puljujarvi's where he's at because our development sucks.

 

[Barrsy]

Check again.

As a 16 year old in 14-15, he put up 18 points in 11 games in Finland's U20 junior league before going on to make his Liiga debut that year. Every year prior he put up more than a point per game in the top junior age group against kids who were two years older or more than him. He killed it at both the WJC-18 and the WJC-20. He literally scored a hat-trick against Sweden in the WJC-18 final.

Puljujarvi's where he's at because our development sucks.

Yeah, cause he might be the 1st guy who peaked when he was a teenager.
Thats never happened before has it?

 

[Bank Shot]

As someone who has watched him play over the years, but hardly at all this year due to me working in Oman and having **** internet, can someone smarter than me explain why be was drafted so high?.

Same reason a guy like Elias Lindholm or Ryan Johansen was drafted high. Projection.

 

[nabob]

Yeah, cause he might be the 1st guy who peaked when he was a teenager.
Thats never happened before has it?

Yakupov, Gagner, Eberle (maybe he was 20). And every single other player who failed to be properly developed by the team that drafted them. Lots of Oilers on that list.

 

[nabob]

Then I guess yours is likely the most obtuse fanboy account ever.
I guess its all a matter of perspective.

Been here for over a decade and have over 10,000 posts. You created an account specifically to fight with other posters about a prospect you hope fails.

Pretty sad on your part. Maybe you should get out more.

I’ll put you back on ignore though seeing as how the mods are afraid to thread ban your obvious trolling.

If this was a thread about a Leafs fan on the mains you would have been banned a long time ago.

 

[Dan Kelly]

How's about we trade Jesse straight up for Pavel Zacha?

 

[GameChanger]

What, were my posts really removed? That was the first time it's happened as I always try to be at least somewhat respectful towards anyone. I even felt the tone of the discussion was fine from both sides. I'm surprised it's okay to have an account that seems to be mainly for just attacking one player (at least currently, don't think it was actually created for that), but not okay to mention that here.

I understand and appreciate the mods are trying to keep this place clean, but I feel I've personally received much stronger messages over here. I guess it's time to step aside again to avoid writing things that are not allowed.

 

[nabob]

What, were my posts really removed? That was the first time it's happened as I always try to be at least somewhat respectful towards anyone. I even felt the tone of the discussion was fine from both sides. I'm surprised it's okay to have an account that seems to be mainly for just attacking one player (at least currently, don't think it was actually created for that), but not okay to mention that here.

I understand and appreciate the mods are trying to keep this place clean, but I feel I've personally received much stronger messages over here. I guess it's time to step aside again to avoid writing things that are not allowed.

Troll posts attract site hits which creates revenue. Easiest just to put posters like Nose on ignore. It’s not like you’ll miss anything they say on other threads as 90% of his posts are dedicated to trashing one player and trying to argue with other fans.

 

[Barrsy]

Been here for over a decade and have over 10,000 posts. You created an account specifically to fight with other posters about a prospect you hope fails.

Pretty sad on your part. Maybe you should get out more.

I’ll put you back on ignore though seeing as how the mods are afraid to thread ban your obvious trolling.

If this was a thread about a Leafs fan on the mains you would have been banned a long time ago.

You should look back a bit more. Its nowhere near all about JP.
And you appear to be the self appointed Mod who seems to think its ok to gush and make excuses for JP 24/7 , but if one does the flipside its trolling.
You should be banned for constantly calling others a troll if they don't agree with your fanboyisim.

 

[GameChanger]

Troll posts attract site hits which creates revenue. Easiest just to put posters like Nose on ignore. It’s not like you’ll miss anything they say on other threads as 90% of his posts are dedicated to trashing one player and trying to argue with other fans.

I guess you're right, that would actually make some sense I think. But when someone is clearly against one specific player I like to take a closer look and try to find reasons for it. Often there's something like defending Chia and maybe TM in earlier messages (like in this case), which makes me understand better how many fans not being happy about the way TM used Pulju or the Oilers have developed him can get into someone's head. I can understand and accept that and I'm not always perfect either, but there's a point when I feel too much is too much. Lately I've felt like that quite a few times and now I finally reacted a bit.

 

[GameChanger]

You should look back a bit more. Its nowhere near all about JP.
And you appear to be the self appointed Mod who seems to think its ok to gush and make excuses for JP 24/7 , but if one does the flipside its trolling.
You should be banned for constantly calling others a troll if they don't agree with your fanboyisim.

I actually took a closer look as I feel you are the strongest writer against Puljujarvi. The one who hasn't obviously ever(?) seen anything good in his performances. It doesn't look like you created the account for this purpose, but it looks like Pulju has had a big place in your thoughts for quite a while.

Earlier you were defending Chia and to some extent McLellan and strongly against Katz, so I wouldn't be surprised if you have some kind of a connection that affects your view. But I always want to trust everyone's word so if you said that's not the case I'd believe you.

To be honest I just don't understand how you can be so strongly against one player who after all plays in your team. I let you have your opinion, but would like to challenge you to think about this a bit. I've done the same when some writers have felt I've reacted too strongly here. But it's your account naturally. I'll leave this now and wish you all the best anyway.

 

[tellermine]

Check again.

As a 16 year old in 14-15, he put up 18 points in 11 games in Finland's U20 junior league before going on to make his Liiga debut that year. Every year prior he put up more than a point per game in the top junior age group against kids who were two years older or more than him. He killed it at both the WJC-18 and the WJC-20. He literally scored a hat-trick against Sweden in the WJC-18 final.

Puljujarvi's where he's at because our development sucks.

He did have good scoring at j20 as really underaged.

He has allways had huge physical tools, nice hands and good passes. Shot is hard but he is not a sniper.

Problem is he does not have the toolbox for these. He just cant play same game in NHL level.
Also his Fel performance had marks of these faulties but hype got over it.

Though Kekäläinen and his crew sae trough it. Maby others to as these Buttos lists etc. are just for media.

So. Great promise and luck with good playing mates that pumped him even more.

 

[agent082]

This thread is getting closer to Sami Vatanen sing along keerole thread on Ducks board years ago.

 

[tellermine]

How's about we trade Jesse straight up for Pavel Zacha?

What I saw earlier Zacha was better than Pulju

 

[HockeyHistorian]

This thread is poisonous. Better to stay away (I just hope I have the willpower).

 

[GameChanger]

This thread is poisonous. Better to stay away (I just hope I have the willpower).

I feel this thread has been quite poisonous for quite a while already, which is why I finally felt too much is too much today. I haven't written that much here lately, but dozens of similar posts from one writer made me react this once and to be honest I feel I wasn't that bad or impolite. I've certainly received much harsher messages myself.

However, I do apologize if I played a part in making this thread worse! I'm ready to move on and try to do my part to keep this thread readable so please don't stay out. I can do that myself if needed.

As I wrote for myself Pulju's season kind of started when Jesse was put with Nuge. I'll draw conclusions after a few more games, but right now I'm reasonably happy as long as the line is a net positive or at least not a negative and as long as Pulju looks solid enough. I still expect a goal once in a while, especially once he gets more PP usage. I'm hoping a couple of goals would get him going like at the start of the last season, but time will tell.

 

[GameChanger]

I'll try to stay away for a while now, but before that I'd like to mention this:

Mikko Koskinen challenging Connor McDavid for top-performing Edmonton Oiler right now

I know it's just one opinion, but it's quite different (Pulju being placed the 2nd out of the team's natural wingers recently) from some people saying Puljujarvi wouldn't belong to the NHL.

I'm not stating my personal opinion and not saying any opinions are better or worse, just thought I'd bring that one here as one take before leaving this thread.

 

[Delicious Pancakes]

Troll posts attract site hits which creates revenue. Easiest just to put posters like Nose on ignore. It’s not like you’ll miss anything they say on other threads as 90% of his posts are dedicated to trashing one player and trying to argue with other fans.

Agreed. If somebody is just going to be a dick and try to stir stuff up all the time why waste your time and energy with that. Lots of other good posters on this board to have actual dialogue with.

 

[elmaco]

The other side of that coin though is that when you can no longer hold a players draft position against him, you can't also simultaneously use it as an excuse to play him endlessly in the top 6 and demand PP time.

If we're being perfectly honest, the only reason why Puljujarvi has ever gotten anything more than a cup of coffee in the NHL is because of his draft position, and his draft position alone. His draft position is the only thing he's got going for him at this point.

He doesn't belong in this league.

LOL the hot takes, hit the showers buddy.

 

[Spawn]

LOL the hot takes, hit the showers buddy.

You're right, his body of work in the NHL definitely suggests he belongs in this league.

Those 2 goals in 18 games this year scream real NHL player.

 

[Panda Bear]

You're right, his body of work in the NHL definitely suggests he belongs in this league.

Those 2 goals in 18 games this year scream real NHL player.

Oh, go do one.

You continue to prove you don't know hockey ranging from how to evaluate prospects to what defensive positioning is.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

A few things I want to address Pulju I think has been playing better under Hitchcock, it doesn't feel like a rollercoaster ride to me at the moment like it did before with all the highs and lows, he's been fairly steadily above average. Second thing is the notion that McLellan was holding down a young superstar in the making and would explode in offensive production the second we got rid of McLellan isn't holding true, he was a project before McLellan left and he remains a project now. Now there are arguments to make that Hitch is doing a better job with developing our project player than McLellan was and with the fact his consistency seems to be improving and he's in better position a little more frequently I can't disagree with that hot take, but given Pulju's struggles to learn english I'd hazard a guess it still would of been a bumpy ride even if Hitch was the only NHL coach he ever knew.

So what is Pulju contributing to the roster right now? I'd say we are getting on average (per game)- 2 dangerous looking rushes that tend to fizzle out more often than they result in a quality scoring chance, 2 hard perimeter shots that have a very slim chance of going in, 1 dangerous pass to set-up a good chance on net, and a guy who is trying to get to the front of the net, but tends to arrive just a little too late. We are 7 games into the Hitch+Pulju era and he has a single point despite playing predominantly on the 2nd line, where as Khaira and RNH both have 5 points over the same time frame.

How long can we roll with Pulju on the 2nd line? Development is important, but I like prioritizing winning more and his production level has not been 2nd line caliber. When we are fully healthy I don't think I could condone him staying with the big club, for the moment though I'm fine with the status quo.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Right now it seems we are operating with 3 functioning duos up-front:

McDavid- Drai
Khaira- RNH
Brodziak - Kassian

Given the need for Pulju to continue developing I'd prefer the AHL route over 4th line minutes, so IMO if he isn't factoring into the top 9 he shouldn't be on the team. So as I see it we have Chiasson, Rieder, Caggiula, Zykov, Rattie, and Pulju competing for those 3 spots; I think Chiasson should be a hard lock for a spot in the top 9 given his production and I see Rieder as a proven quality 3rd line forward so I'd likely consider him a near lock as well, leaving 4 names competing for that last spot.

My preference would be-

Zykov/Caggiula - McDavid - Drai
Khaira -RNH - Chiasson
Rieder - Brodziak - Kassian

 

[GOilers88]

A few things I want to address Pulju I think has been playing better under Hitchcock, it doesn't feel like a rollercoaster ride to me at the moment like it did before with all the highs and lows, he's been fairly steadily above average. Second thing is the notion that McLellan was holding down a young superstar in the making and would explode in offensive production the second we got rid of McLellan isn't holding true, he was a project before McLellan left and he remains a project now. Now there are arguments to make that Hitch is doing a better job with developing our project player than McLellan was and with the fact his consistency seems to be improving and he's in better position a little more frequently I can't disagree with that hot take, but given Pulju's struggles to learn english I'd hazard a guess it still would of been a bumpy ride even if Hitch was the only NHL coach he ever knew.

So what is Pulju contributing to the roster right now? I'd say we are getting on average (per game)- 2 dangerous looking rushes that tend to fizzle out more often than they result in a quality scoring chance, 2 hard perimeter shots that have a very slim chance of going in, 1 dangerous pass to set-up a good chance on net, and a guy who is trying to get to the front of the net, but tends to arrive just a little too late. We are 7 games into the Hitch+Pulju era and he has a single point despite playing predominantly on the 2nd line, where as Khaira and RNH both have 5 points over the same time frame.

How long can we roll with Pulju on the 2nd line? Development is important, but I like prioritizing winning more and his production level has not been 2nd line caliber. When we are fully healthy I don't think I could condone him staying with the big club, for the moment though I'm fine with the status quo.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Right now it seems we are operating with 3 functioning duos up-front:

McDavid- Drai
Khaira- RNH
Brodziak - Kassian

Given the need for Pulju to continue developing I'd prefer the AHL route over 4th line minutes, so IMO if he isn't factoring into the top 9 he shouldn't be on the team. So as I see it we have Chiasson, Rieder, Caggiula, Zykov, Rattie, and Pulju competing for those 3 spots; I think Chiasson should be a hard lock for a spot in the top 9 given his production and I see Rieder as a proven quality 3rd line forward so I'd likely consider him a near lock as well, leaving 4 names competing for that last spot.

My preference would be-

Zykov/Caggiula - McDavid - Drai
Khaira -RNH - Chiasson
Rieder - Brodziak - Kassian

They have been winning though. Other players have been scoring and they've been bit by the injury bug a bit. But they're stilling winning, and JP may not be scoring but he's looking more confident consistently in spite of it. I think that's real good progress and should continue as is. The scoring will come. Have patience. This franchise has lacked it for far too long.

 

[BudBundy]

If nothing else, Puljujarvi is doing a really good job with his speed and reach at pressuring puck carriers. You’ll also notice Hitch has him going to the front of the net without the puck on a regular basis. Nothing is really rhyming with Nuge yet, but I like what I see and hope it keeps building. Honestly when you see the likes of Spooner and Rattie and Russell and Lucic bumbling along at the top end of their low ceilings it’s hard not to be excited for what Puljujarvi could be one day if we are patient with him. I’d sure like to dig up old footage of what Blake Wheeler looked like as a 20 yr old nowhere near the critical eyes of the NHL. Patience. I’m looking at you, so and so’s nose.