Player Discussion Jesperi Kotkaniemi - Part 13

[Ozmodiar]

I don't think he's missing something in his toolbox, because he has it all to some degree. He does need confidence (as most players, especially rookies/younger ones, need) and he needs consistency. Sometimes he plays with good pace, but there are other times he lacks pace, he still needs that 0.5 second more that you do not have in the NHL. IMO he'll be fine, it'll come sooner than later, he's playing well despite not having the best production. Habs will get through this slump and I think KK will help in that regard.

Yep, true.

 

[Mrb1p]

Yep, true.

I guess that didn't stop him from producing as much as Suzui anyway

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

Lets see you move the goalpost on that one.

AND ANYONE CLAIMING THAT SUZUKI BULLSHIT SHOULD READ THIS BECAUSE IM f***ING SICK OF YALL

Kotkaniemis and Suzukis first 20 games.

Suzuki got 16:49 after his 20th game and only played under 14:59 4 times since then.

Position	Games	Goal	Assist	Points	..+ -..	PIM	P/GP	EVG	EVP	PPG	PPP	shg	shp	otg	gwg	Shots	SH%	TOI	FO
C	20	5	4	9	3	4	0.45	4	7	1	2	0	0	0	0	27	18.5	13.58	44.2
C	20	2	7	9	7	6	0.45	2	7	0	2	0	0	0	0	33	6.1	13:54	45.2

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Why would they favor Suzuki over KK for any other reason than he’s been playing better (which is clearly what the eye test says)? How long until we hear about the anti Finn conspiracy? It was the anti Russian conspiracy that did Galchenyuk in remember (not the fact he just wasn’t the hockey player they thought he was when he was drafted)...

 

[Mrb1p]

Why would they favor Suzuki over KK for any other reason than he’s been playing better (which is clearly what the eye test says)? How long until we hear about the anti Finn conspiracy? It was the anti Russian conspiracy that did Galchenyuk in remember (not the fact he just wasn’t the hockey player they thought he was when he was drafted)...

Right, not one statistic in favor of Suzuki but hes been better on the eye test.

 

[The Great Weal]

Why would they favor Suzuki over KK for any other reason than he’s been playing better (which is clearly what the eye test says)? How long until we hear about the anti Finn conspiracy? It was the anti Russian conspiracy that did Galchenyuk in remember (not the fact he just wasn’t the hockey player they thought he was when he was drafted)...

Don't argue with the hockeydb scouts...

 

[Ozmodiar]

I guess that didn't stop him from producing as much as Suzui anyway

I don’t know about you, but I’d rather play on the 3rd line with Yo-Elle Armia (+ Byron/Lehks) than on the 4th line with Nate Thompson (+ Cousins/Byron). KK had the former, NS the latter.

stat watching 20 games isn’t going to tell the story.

 

[The Great Weal]

I don’t know about you, but I’d rather play on the 3rd line with Yo-Elle Armia (+ Byron/Lehks) than on the 4th line with Nate Thompson (+ Cousins/Byron). KK had the former, NS the latter.

stat watching 20 games isn’t going to tell the story.

That's also the good Byron and not the current one. Seems like linemates excuse don't matter unless KK is the one getting the worse wingers.

 

[Mrb1p]

I don’t know about you, but I’d rather play on the 3rd line with Yo-Elle Armia (+ Byron/Lehks) than on the 4th line with Nate Thompson (+ Cousins/Byron). KK had the former, NS the latter.

stat watching 20 games isn’t going to tell the story.

Yes, same Armia that has points in 3 games this season, you'd much rather play with him, right, he's not been total ass this year, not at all.

Im also in every single GDT, so IDK how anyone can say I statswatch.

 

[BushFireRecordsRedux]

Age is the most important part of development but it isn't the only variable, experience is important. Suzuki's first 20 games last was his first taste of pro hockey (*1 AHL playoff game). Jesperi was over 200 pro games coming into this season. You'd expect him to be a lot further along than Nick was out of major junior.

I'm not saying who will be better long term, Nick has a higher offensive ceiling (IMO) but him and Jesperi have been pretty similar this year. I don't really understand why 2 coaches now have been so much higher on Nick this season (as seen in TOI). I honestly don't think either have been that good of late and I think the best course of action is to split their ice time evenly (with our best wingers) and use Danault as a clear checking line/DZone C. Then we'll see if one of Nick or Jesperi can separate themselves and start developing into a true #1 C.

 

[The Great Weal]

Age is the most important part of development but it isn't the only variable, experience is important. Suzuki's first 20 games last was his first taste of pro hockey (*1 AHL playoff game). Jesperi was over 200 pro games coming into this season. You'd expect him to be a lot further along than Nick was out of major junior.

I'm not saying who will be better long term, Nick has a higher offensive ceiling (IMO) but him and Jesperi have been pretty similar this year. I don't really understand why 2 coaches now have been so much higher on Nick this season (as seen in TOI). I honestly don't think either have been that good of late and I think the best course of action is to split their ice time evenly (with our best wingers) and use Danault as a clear checking line/DZone C. Then we'll see if one of Nick or Jesperi can separate themselves and start developing into a true #1 C.

Suzuki was killing it on the bottom 6 when he played there, KK is not. I think Suzuki has been very good this year. He's helped Drouin and Anderson perform much better than expected. It's his 2nd NHL season and many have slumps in their 2nd season. He hasn't been as good as his first 10 games, but he also looks that he's injured by him squirming in pain on the bench.

 

[gillyguzzler]

It's too bad some are incessant in their KK praise at the detriment of many of our other players.

KK is a good player with his obvious faults but to incessantly bash guys like Armia and Suzuki to prove that KK is so hard done by is childish.

Armia's point per game production is pretty good considering the injury. Suzuki is a hell of a player that will only get better. KK will get there sooner rather than later but lay off our other players while just to prove an incessant 25 times a day point.

 

[Supersonic]

I thought the whole thing around KK pre draft was that he’s a project

Why can’t we wait until he’s 22 before we start complaining or am I entirely unreasonable?

 

[Gravity]

I thought the whole thing around KK pre draft was that he’s a project

Why can’t we wait until he’s 22 before we start complaining or am I entirely unreasonable?

I believe that most of the complaint has been the refusal of this organization to actually develop young raw prospects like KK.

 

[Mrb1p]

Age is the most important part of development but it isn't the only variable, experience is important. Suzuki's first 20 games last was his first taste of pro hockey (*1 AHL playoff game). Jesperi was over 200 pro games coming into this season. You'd expect him to be a lot further along than Nick was out of major junior.

I'm not saying who will be better long term, Nick has a higher offensive ceiling (IMO) but him and Jesperi have been pretty similar this year. I don't really understand why 2 coaches now have been so much higher on Nick this season (as seen in TOI). I honestly don't think either have been that good of late and I think the best course of action is to split their ice time evenly (with our best wingers) and use Danault as a clear checking line/DZone C. Then we'll see if one of Nick or Jesperi can separate themselves and start developing into a true #1 C.

its not about where Kotkaniemi is, its about people that keep claiming Kotkaniemi will play when he gets better when both Danault and Suzuki were worse than him when they got their shot.

To top it all off, Kotkaniemi had 10 points in his first 20 games in his rookie season, Suzuki got increased ice-time, KK did not.

There's some kind of disconnect between how Suzuki (And Danault) have been treated and how Kotkaniemi has been treated.

I recall Julien being quite disappointed at the table when they grabbed Kotkaniemi, is he trying to prove a point ? I also recall rumbling that Bergevin and Julien had a falling off on the ice-time of centers in 2019.

It's too bad some are incessant in their KK praise at the detriment of many of our other players.

KK is a good player with his obvious faults but to incessantly bash guys like Armia and Suzuki to prove that KK is so hard done by is childish.

Armia's point per game production is pretty good considering the injury. Suzuki is a hell of a player that will only get better. KK will get there sooner rather than later but lay off our other players while just to prove an incessant 25 times a day point.

Its small brain energy to understand this as bashing Suzuki, its saying that Kotkaniemi deserves more ice-time, just like Suzuki did and that he will be better for it, just like Suzuki and Danault before him.

Armia has points in three games, his PPG is only good because he had a four point game.

Theres no reasons why Kotkaniemi cannot get more ice-time than what he's been getting so far

 

[gillyguzzler]

... And it continues... Blah blah blah

 

[Ozmodiar]

Yes, same Armia that has points in 3 games this season, you'd much rather play with him, right, he's not been total ass this year, not at all.

Im also in every single GDT, so IDK how anyone can say I statswatch.

Well, you’re citing stats.

and yes, still taking Armia over Thompson.

 

[Colezuki]

I thought the whole thing around KK pre draft was that he’s a project

Why can’t we wait until he’s 22 before we start complaining or am I entirely unreasonable?

It was and you are right, he’s 22/23 is when will see it, just like schiefele

 

[sandviper]

Right, not one statistic in favor of Suzuki but hes been better on the eye test.

Suzuki averages about 5 minutes more ice time, has superior line mates but only has 5 more points than KK. I’m not trying to bash Suzuki, but this is more of a testament of how they need to find a way to get KK more ice time. Take it away from Danault. Seriously, if KK was more consistent on his FO, he’d be our #1 center.

I get people want to bash him for falling down a lot and looking off balanced at times. However, when Kotkaniemi is on, he’s so dominant on the ice.

 

[Habs178]

Suzuki averages about 5 minutes more ice time, has superior line mates but only has 5 more points than KK. I’m not trying to bash Suzuki, but this is more of a testament of how they need to find a way to get KK more ice time. Take it away from Danault. Seriously, if KK was more consistent on his FO, he’d be our #1 center.

I get people want to bash him for falling down a lot and looking off balanced at times. However, when Kotkaniemi is on, he’s so dominant on the ice.

So much this

 

[montreal]

I think Suzuki is the better player, smarter, but the hope is that once KK gets his skating, lower body strength, confidence, going and improves on his shot, he will be a very solid NHLer. I would love to be wrong and have KK end up better cause it would just mean we are in a great position as I have no doubt about Suzuki and KK I'm willing to wait as I think he will get there in 2 or s0 years as long as he keeps improving his skating, lower body strength.

I yell at my tv when he's skating and starts leaning forward, no KK don't do that, bad KK but he doesn't listen.

 

[gillyguzzler]

Although it doesn't seem to mean much here, if KK gets a four points game tomorrow night, I'd bet Ducharme would notice and might just give him 15 minutes the next game.

Notwithstanding, I do believe that if KK does step it up a bit, he will indeed get more ice. And when Anderson comes back, he'll likely get Toffoli (top scorer) back on his line. He won't get up to 19 minutes a game because our D gets too many penalties and he doesn't play the PK. But 15+ minutes would be good.

 

[Saxon]

I thought the whole thing around KK pre draft was that he’s a project

Why can’t we wait until he’s 22 before we start complaining or am I entirely unreasonable?

That's about as reasonable as having two talented young centres.. . And actually being happy about it ...... ridiculous!!

 

[Mrb1p]

Suzuki averages about 5 minutes more ice time, has superior line mates but only has 5 more points than KK. I’m not trying to bash Suzuki, but this is more of a testament of how they need to find a way to get KK more ice time. Take it away from Danault. Seriously, if KK was more consistent on his FO, he’d be our #1 center.

I get people want to bash him for falling down a lot and looking off balanced at times. However, when Kotkaniemi is on, he’s so dominant on the ice.

I don't even understand how coaches look at this kid and don't want him to give him the world, kids always smiling and he's always doing everything he can.

 

[Mrb1p]

I think Suzuki is the better player, smarter, but the hope is that once KK gets his skating, lower body strength, confidence, going and improves on his shot, he will be a very solid NHLer. I would love to be wrong and have KK end up better cause it would just mean we are in a great position as I have no doubt about Suzuki and KK I'm willing to wait as I think he will get there in 2 or s0 years as long as he keeps improving his skating, lower body strength.

I yell at my tv when he's skating and starts leaning forward, no KK don't do that, bad KK but he doesn't listen.

It doesn't really matter whos better now or in the future, all that matters is that theyre both good now and will both be good in the future, but only one of them is getting opportunities to actually achieve that.

 

[montreal]

It doesn't really matter whos better now or in the future, all that matters is that theyre both good now and will both be good in the future, but only one of them is getting opportunities to actually achieve that.

agreed, i said all off-season I was afraid that Julien would go back to the top line, he did and imo it cost him his job. He should have gone Toff/Tatar KK Gallagher and told Danault to suck it up and face facts, you are a 3rd line center, help this team win in that role or f*** off.