Value of: Jeff Carter to Carolina

[member 88115]

Nor does it matter to you. It might however matter to a team such as Carolina looking to trade for him.

If you want to ignore/minimize what Carter did in Columbus, you may do so. But I can guarantee you that an NHL GM is going to be more thorough and cautious.

As a Canes fan who remembers Keith Primeau too well, don't even try to suggest that stuff like that is not an issue when it comes to acquiring a player.

I already said Carolina is not a good fit because of they are still rebuilding and LA won't be trading him without him knowing like Philly did. So its a mute point.

 

[Chan790]

I already said Carolina is not a good fit because of they are still rebuilding and LA won't be trading him without him knowing like Philly did. So its a mute point.

You're wrong (still) about fit, but it's okay. Carolina isn't so much still rebuilding as trying to cross the finish line on their rebuild.

They have 3 problems.

1.) Their goaltending is bad. *Half-solved: McElhinney is a pleasant-surprise above-average starter, but at age 35, having never carried a starter's workload, he's probably not going to be able to start 60 games...so, in need of a 1B goalie.
2.) Need more goal scoring.
3.) Need a top-6 C.

So, Jeff Carter solves 2 of 3 problems between Carolina and competitive. I don't see him having a problem with a trade to Carolina; I would think getting traded to a team leaving the rebuild stage would be more appealing than staying with a team entering tear-down rebuild.

 

[Roboturner913]

It's 'moot' not 'mute'

And Carolina isn't really rebuilding. They're in a playoff spot right now and need to add a little bit of scoring to make sure they stay that way.

 

[member 88115]

You're wrong (still) about fit, but it's okay. Carolina isn't so much still rebuilding as trying to cross the finish line on their rebuild.

They have 3 problems.

1.) Their goaltending is bad. *Half-solved: McElhinney is a pleasant-surprise above-average starter, but at age 35, having never carried a starter's workload, he's probably not going to be able to start 60 games...so, in need of a 1B goalie.
2.) Need more goal scoring.
3.) Need a top-6 C.

So, Jeff Carter solves 2 of 3 problems between Carolina and competitive. I don't see him having a problem with a trade to Carolina; I would think getting traded to a team leaving the rebuild stage would be more appealing than staying with a team entering tear-down rebuild.

LA will be looking for solid piece, which will most likely be a 1st +. I don't see Carolina giving it up or a prospect with that type of value. That is where I don't see the fit.

And if the Hurricanes are willing, then I do see a fit

 

[Viqsi]

Their are many ways to find view points. Some folks will defend Carter because that is not the player they see now. Everyone knows he did not play well in Columbus cause he hated the org/city (whatever) or was injured. It was also confirmed he was playing through an injury, so its not out of this world he was not ready to play during his time in Columbus. Simple hypothesis that folks should not get bent out shape, that OMG: That is way of line. To you its an excuse, but to another its a probable reason. Like I said, its time to move on cause its seems every time Carters name comes up, we have to relive this Columbus thing like its yesterday.

The easy way to prevent it from being relived is to not start making excuses.

 

[KingsOfCali25]

You're wrong (still) about fit, but it's okay. Carolina isn't so much still rebuilding as trying to cross the finish line on their rebuild.

They have 3 problems.

1.) Their goaltending is bad. *Half-solved: McElhinney is a pleasant-surprise above-average starter, but at age 35, having never carried a starter's workload, he's probably not going to be able to start 60 games...so, in need of a 1B goalie.
2.) Need more goal scoring.
3.) Need a top-6 C.

So, Jeff Carter solves 2 of 3 problems between Carolina and competitive. I don't see him having a problem with a trade to Carolina; I would think getting traded to a team leaving the rebuild stage would be more appealing than staying with a team entering tear-down rebuild.

LA can help all of your problems in one trade...

Carter+Quick for one NHL RHD+picks+prospects

 

[Unsustainable]

LA can help all of your problems in one trade...

Carter+Quick for one NHL RHD+picks+prospects

Ok:

Pick one:
Pesce, Hamilton, TVR, Faulk
+
Pick one:
1st, 2 2nds
+
Pick 2:
Gauthier, Saarela, Kuokkanen, McKeown, Ned, Booth
+
Darling....

For Quick + Carter

 

[member 88115]

The easy way to prevent it from being relived is to not start making excuses.

We can all go about it a better way

 

[King'sPawn]

The easy way to prevent it from being relived is to not start making excuses.

Refresh my memory, please. Did Kings fans start making excuses, or did Kings fans respond to you joining in this thread saying Carter was dogging it in a thread about Carter's value to Carolina?

And again, failing to acknowledge you may have a skewed interpretation while telling Kings fans they are making excuses and don't see it your way is hypocritical and non-constructive to having a conversation.

You haven't shown a capability to have an honest, rational discussion about the topic, and you expect people to take you seriously. You instead accuse Kings fans trying to engage you politely as "making excuses" and refusing to accept your perception as fact.

This thread has successfully been derailed.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

A top 10 protected 1st, and a B prospect.

It's a good match with Carter's real money salary being so low.

 

[tomd]

A top 10 protected 1st, and a B prospect.

It's a good match with Carter's real money salary being so low.

Carter is playing like he is 80 years-old and his contract runs until he's 84. Why would Carolina want any part of that at this point? Seems like they are just adding a 3 1/2 year problem instead of solving one.

 

[Viqsi]

Refresh my memory, please. Did Kings fans start making excuses, or did Kings fans respond to you joining in this thread saying Carter was dogging it in a thread about Carter's value to Carolina?

Someone suggested he might be better suited to come here. I explained why that was astronomically unlikely. That prompted the usual mix of "yeah but you suck so you deserved it" and "well, maybe, maybe not" nonsense in response.

And again, failing to acknowledge you may have a skewed interpretation while telling Kings fans they are making excuses and don't see it your way is hypocritical and non-constructive to having a conversation.

That's largely because there's no honest conversation to be had about whether or not he dogged it here. He did. End of story. It's not some kind of vague opinion; it's documented fact. I'm happy to acknowledge that someone can honestly be uninformed, but the facts are indisputable.

You haven't shown a capability to have an honest, rational discussion about the topic, and you expect people to take you seriously. You instead accuse Kings fans trying to engage you politely as "making excuses" and refusing to accept your perception as fact.

I see no reason why I should accommodate comments of "y'know, maybe you're just being bitter and deluded" no matter how "politely" it's delivered. News reports confirmed it. Eye tests confirmed it. Fans of other teams and fans of the player in particular have confirmed it. Hell, arguably the "you suck so you deserved it" crowd is acknowledging that it happened.

The past is set. It is what it is. The present and future may be up for debate, though.

 

[KingsOfCali25]

Ok:

Pick one:
Pesce, Hamilton, TVR, Faulk
+
Pick one:
1st, 2 2nds
+
Pick 2:
Gauthier, Saarela, Kuokkanen, McKeown, Ned, Booth
+
Darling....

For Quick + Carter

If LA is taking on Darling a better prospect needs to be involved. He's a $3m AHL goalie that is not needed in LA.

The rest of the deal is fine but Darling is a no go for me.

 

[KingsOfCali25]

Someone suggested he might be better suited to come here. I explained why that was astronomically unlikely. That prompted the usual mix of "yeah but you suck so you deserved it" and "well, maybe, maybe not" nonsense in response.


That's largely because there's no honest conversation to be had about whether or not he dogged it here. He did. End of story. It's not some kind of vague opinion; it's documented fact. I'm happy to acknowledge that someone can honestly be uninformed, but the facts are indisputable.


I see no reason why I should accommodate comments of "y'know, maybe you're just being bitter and deluded" no matter how "politely" it's delivered. News reports confirmed it. Eye tests confirmed it. Fans of other teams and fans of the player in particular have confirmed it. Hell, arguably the "you suck so you deserved it" crowd is acknowledging that it happened.

The past is set. It is what it is. The present and future may be up for debate, though.

Why are you whining about something that happen forever ago in a thread that is not about that. Your hatred for the player is beyond belief. How can a mod come into a thread and just bring so much discourse to a thread. It's like opposite of their so called "job". Its like the most unproductive thing someone can do.

 

[Ingvar]

If LA is taking on Darling a better prospect needs to be involved. He's a $3m AHL goalie that is not needed in LA.

The rest of the deal is fine but Darling is a no go for me.

They wouldn't offer you 1st+Hamilton+ (or whatever you prefer) if you're not taking Darling. Both Carter and Quick are over 30 and have at least 4 years on their deals. Carter looks declining or LA wouldn't be selling him. Quick has 2nd serious injury in 3 years. They should make Carolina better but carry significant risk - Darling is dead weight that offsets that risk and helps salary balance. You can even use him as a backup after you sell Quick.

Why are you whining about something that happen forever ago in a thread that is not about that. Your hatred for the player is beyond belief. How can a mod come into a thread and just bring so much discourse to a thread. It's like opposite of their so called "job". Its like the most unproductive thing someone can do.

Being right about Carter is not a moddable offence. It is relevant to the thread because it explains why Carter won't return to Columbus and why teams should be hesitant to buy him.

 

[King'sPawn]

Being right about Carter is not a moddable offence. It is relevant to the thread because it explains why Carter won't return to Columbus and why teams should be hesitant to buy him.

Passing off an opinion or interpretation as "right" is the problem.

Has anyone actually in the know of the situation (players, coaches, etc) actually said something to support or refute the claims he was dogging it?

If not, it's an opinion. An interpretation. A perception. It's anything except a "fact" and a bitter fan being "right."

 

[Viqsi]

Passing off an opinion or interpretation as "right" is the problem.

Has anyone actually in the know of the situation (players, coaches, etc) actually said something to support or refute the claims he was dogging it?

Yes. Many, many off-the-record comments attributed to players were reported. And there were comments by Nash's agent about how that situation affected Nash's desire to leave.

Seriously. It's not an "interpretation". When I say it's "documented fact", I'm not exaggerating.


EDIT: For the record, I haven't posted links because I've had trouble finding them. Most of the reporting was through Puck-Rakers - a blog maintained by the Columbus Dispatch hockey beat writers (Portzline and Reed at the time; they're now both with The Athletic) - and finding archived posts from that is like pulling teeth. And I can't go through the HFBoards discussions that cited them because those threads were purged (and the links wouldn't work in any case, as the Dispatch has reformatted/restructured Puck-Rakers several times since).