Value of: Jeff Carter to Carolina

[Ahoy there]

Try perennial 9th place, out of the playoffs and out of a good pick.

You speaking of Carolina or LA, lol! Same boat, different conference.

 

[AD Skinner]

You speaking of Carolina or LA, lol! Same boat, different conference.

LA has won two cups since the last time Carolina sniffed the playoffs. Come on man

 

[Ahoy there]

LA has won two cups since the last time Carolina sniffed the playoffs. Come on man

I concede. I was more referring to being perennial 9th-10th place finishers.

 

[bleedgreen]

I know Carter has the history in Columbus but he’s won two cups and I’m sure grown up some. I would hope if this happened it would be something they ran by Carter before agreeing to the trade to make sure he’s amenable. If he’s going to be THAT upset to be on the canes of course I wouldn’t want the trade. Seems like guys love the area once they’re actually in it. If he’s a diminishing player on a team in a free fall be may be rethinking his future. I do believe he could help the canes despite his age. I think he’s got a few kicks left in his can. He would be more of what jr thought he was getting with Staal.

 

[LeafChief]

Jeff Carter sulked when he got traded to Columbus. In what world does he want to get traded to Carolina.

 

[Chan790]

Jeff Carter sulked when he got traded to Columbus. In what world does he want to get traded to Carolina.

The one where we fix the other half of our goaltending and he's the missing piece to playoff contention on a team on the rise?

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Perhaps the changes in his life as he's gotten older have made him more mature. People can change.

His former teammate Williams is the captain in Carolina, don't forget. I'm sure he'd play a role in making it happen on both sides.

 

[Moosetache]

I have no interest in giving up a 1st for Carter. 2nd and Goat, or Mckeown/tvr something like that.

I understand if that doesn't get it done, but hes 33, we can't be giving up 1st round picks for 33 year old forwards.

 

[Viqsi]

seriously ?

It was confirmed at the time. I understand it's difficult to recognize that your golden boy was legitimately horrible over here, but he was and there's no changing that. I'd like to believe that he's grown up since, but you can't just handwave over the past as though it never happened. It happened. It's documented fact. Deal with it.

The question one should be wondering about is if he's since learned to not pull that sort of nonsense. Again, I'd like to believe he has (if only because I like being able to retain faith in humanity ), but at the moment there's no definitive way to tell.

* * *​

Perhaps the changes in his life as he's gotten older have made him more mature. People can change.

I certainly hope so. The only thing that would be more agonizingly hateful than how he acted here would be him never learning anything from his mistake and never doing better.

If he came out with a public apology to the fans here, at this point I'd be willing to accept it. It wouldn't wipe the slate clean, but it'd at least be an acknowledgement that he's taking responsibility for his own garbage, and that's always good to see IMO.

 

[King'sPawn]

As usual here I don't want the qualifiers on his stats, when people talk Columbus Carter they are talking about effort. People throwing numbers out should know that isn't what is being talked about. It is the way a really gifted skater and 200 foot player would routinely quit for entire periods and games during that brief stint. It was incredibly troubling and like I said I am a big fan of Jeff Carter, I like watching him play engaged hockey a ton. It was fantastic for LA. But what happened in Columbus did happen, I am always stunned when people want to dismiss and try to tell an entire fan-base that watched him night in and night out that it didn't. I saw it enough in just the handful of games I flipped through and few total games I watched during that year of them to be fairly disgusted with them, but his effort in particular was embarrassing often.

The larger point is you better make sure Jeff Carter wants to be there, the one time he didn't it wasn't pretty. You can bank on the maturity of Carter. He really is a terrific player, but I have to believe this is a part of the process when you look at Carter as a GM. You better make sure he wants to come if I am the other team, fool me once and all.

I understand that people shouldn't purely cite numbers and ignore the eye test, but let's not forget that
1) Carter was injured and missed part of the season due to a foot injury (Jeff Carter suffers foot injury)
2) Fans are human, and Carter's initial reaction of not being happy being traded there could have skewed their perception of him as a player.

I'm not saying it's impossible for Carter to have dogged it while in Columbus, but I saw first hand when people were complaining about Kopitar "not trying" during his worst career season; he was playing through an injury to the point he couldn't shoot the puck, but people still mold their observations to fit their viewpoint and fail to account for circumstances; I don't think ANYONE, whether it's you, me, or Columbus fans, are qualified to remark on a player's effort when the player did, in fact, have an injury.

Anyway, if Carter were traded to Carolina, I would like a first round pick (top 10 protected) + Roland McKeown back

 

[Frolov 6'3]

It was confirmed at the time. I understand it's difficult to recognize that your golden boy was legitimately horrible over here, but he was and there's no changing that. I'd like to believe that he's grown up since, but you can't just handwave over the past as though it never happened. It happened. It's documented fact. Deal with it.
.

..TMZ ?

I also still laugh at the fact that you said he had no excuse to act like he did. Two months later he was skating around with the Stanley Cup.

 

[Viqsi]

I understand that people shouldn't purely cite numbers and ignore the eye test, but let's not forget that
1) Carter was injured and missed part of the season due to a foot injury (Jeff Carter suffers foot injury)
2) Fans are human, and Carter's initial reaction of not being happy being traded there could have skewed their perception of him as a player.

I'm not saying it's impossible for Carter to have dogged it while in Columbus, but I saw first hand when people were complaining about Kopitar "not trying" during his worst career season; he was playing through an injury to the point he couldn't shoot the puck, but people still mold their observations to fit their viewpoint and fail to account for circumstances; I don't think ANYONE, whether it's you, me, or Columbus fans, are qualified to remark on a player's effort when the player did, in fact, have an injury.

We've seen "playing through injury" before. Even on players who have that same sort of effortless-looking skating style, in which one has to notice positioning to recognize that someone is putting in the proper work - recall that Rick Nash skated here for ten years, and that we watched live his evolution under Hitchcock from primarily offensive guy who rarely goes deep in the defensive zone to two-way badass. Injury problems were accounted for already.

* * *​

I also still laugh at the fact that you said he had no excuse to act like he did. One month later he was skating around with the Stanley Cup.

Then you're just blithely ignoring reality in favor of your rose-colored agenda and there's nothing I can do for you.

 

[King'sPawn]

We've seen "playing through injury" before. Even on players who have that same sort of effortless-looking skating style, in which one has to notice positioning to recognize that someone is putting in the proper work - recall that Rick Nash skated here for ten years, and that we watched live his evolution under Hitchcock from primarily offensive guy who rarely goes deep in the defensive zone to two-way badass. Injury problems were accounted for already.

Goodness, not everyone plays through injury the same way. If you don't like Carter because you feel he was dogging it, fine, but you simply can't throw all injured players into the same boat and feel you've "fairly accounted for injury problems."

I've seen "playing through injury" before, too. You cannot differentiate and get into the heads of players and quantify how much of their bad play is from injury or from being the heartless turd you paint Carter out to be.

 

[Viqsi]

Goodness, not everyone plays through injury the same way. If you don't like Carter because you feel he was dogging it, fine, but you simply can't throw all injured players into the same boat and feel you've "fairly accounted for injury problems."

I've seen "playing through injury" before, too. You cannot differentiate and get into the heads of players and quantify how much of their bad play is from injury or from being the heartless turd you paint Carter out to be.

If folks want to keep playing the "no, really, he's always been a perfectly wonderful guy and he never did anything wrong in Columbus" game for the sake of their pride in their team, there will be pushback. Get out of denial already. It. Happened. He treated y'all right, but he treated us like ****.

 

[King'sPawn]

If folks want to keep playing the "no, really, he's always been a perfectly wonderful guy and he never did anything wrong in Columbus" game for the sake of their pride in their team, there will be pushback. Get out of denial already. It. Happened. He treated y'all right, but he treated us like ****.

You're purposely ignoring where I said it's possible Carter did dog it with Columbus, so I'm just going to assume you're not still ready to discuss it seven years later. Which further reinforces you probably weren't being impartial when you were "taking injuries into account."

 

[Viqsi]

You're purposely ignoring where I said it's possible Carter did dog it with Columbus,

Yes, I am, because you're doing the "well it might have happened, but excuse excuse excuse excuse so probably all those Jackets fans are deranged" thing that so many Kings fans that are trying to convince themselves they're being objective about the situation have been doing for those seven years. It's the same rationalization pattern all over again.

 

[member 88115]

Even though a good friend in William is in Carolina, I don't see them giving up the asset required to pick up Carter. Don't see the fit

And BTW, I could care less what Carter did in Columbus. Either cause Bummed it or was injured, most LA fans don't care. We don't need excuse what Carter did there or convince ourselves into anything. Get over it.

 

[Bandit]

Yes, I am, because you're doing the "well it might have happened, but excuse excuse excuse excuse so probably all those Jackets fans are deranged" thing that so many Kings fans that are trying to convince themselves they're being objective about the situation have been doing for those seven years. It's the same rationalization pattern all over again.

I don’t think Kings fans really care. Hold onto your resentment, we’ll hold on to two championships. Win win.

Carter for Panarin.

 

[Viqsi]

I don’t think Kings fans really care. Hold onto your resentment, we’ll hold on to two championships. Win win.

And this would be an example of the other common reply: "whatever, we won, so **** you." The big difference is that in this one there's no attempt to even pretend to be objective. Both, however, are firmly grounded in a "he can't possibly be that bad because he did good things for my team" reality blindness. I can't really speak to what he is now, but we all know what he was then.

 

[Viqsi]

And BTW, I could care less what Carter did in Columbus. Either cause Bummed it or was injured, most LA fans don't care. We don't need excuse what Carter did there or convince ourselves into anything.

I have no doubt that it doesn't bother most Kings fans, and frankly that's your prerogative. We don't exactly need y'all to be hanging your collective heads in shame or something similarly silly to feel validated or anything like that. This only comes up when folks start acting like it never happened or that it was our fault or something like that. Avoid that kind of nonsense and we can just live and let live.

 

[Bandit]

And this would be an example of the other common reply: "whatever, we won, so **** you." The big difference is that in this one there's no attempt to even pretend to be objective. Both, however, are firmly grounded in a "he can't possibly be that bad because he did good things for my team" reality blindness. I can't really speak to what he is now, but we all know what he was then.

No, it’s grounded firmly in “we don’t care what he did to you”. You’re trying to convince the guy that’s happily married to your ex that she’s an awful person because she was bad to you 6 years ago. Good luck with that. At some point, it’s time to move on.

 

[Viqsi]

You’re trying to convince the guy that’s happily married to your ex that she’s an awful person because she was bad to you 6 years ago.

Incorrect. This only comes up if folks insist that what happened years ago never actually happened, or that it was somehow deserved. That's all. Any judgments on who that person is now are for others to infer.

 

[KINGS17]

Ah yes his whole 8 NHL games really show that.

Petersen has been in the Kings system for a while and they have spent a lot of time on his development. He is the heir apparent to Quick. One good thing left over from the Lombardi days is the Kings goalie development program.

 

[member 88115]

I have no doubt that it doesn't bother most Kings fans, and frankly that's your prerogative. We don't exactly need y'all to be hanging your collective heads in shame or something similarly silly to feel validated or anything like that. This only comes up when folks start acting like it never happened or that it was our fault or something like that. Avoid that kind of nonsense and we can just live and let live.

Their are many ways to find view points. Some folks will defend Carter because that is not the player they see now. Everyone knows he did not play well in Columbus cause he hated the org/city (whatever) or was injured. It was also confirmed he was playing through an injury, so its not out of this world he was not ready to play during his time in Columbus. Simple hypothesis that folks should not get bent out shape, that OMG: That is way of line. To you its an excuse, but to another its a probable reason. Like I said, its time to move on cause its seems every time Carters name comes up, we have to relive this Columbus thing like its yesterday.

 

[Roboturner913]

We don't need excuse what Carter did there or convince ourselves into anything. Get over it.

Nor does it matter to you. It might however matter to a team such as Carolina looking to trade for him.

If you want to ignore/minimize what Carter did in Columbus, you may do so. But I can guarantee you that an NHL GM is going to be more thorough and cautious.

As a Canes fan who remembers Keith Primeau too well, don't even try to suggest that stuff like that is not an issue when it comes to acquiring a player.