Proposal: J.G. Pageau to Colorado

[Hasbro]

If he is willing to re-sign with the Avs I’d be okay paying a 1st. He’s an elite 3C and can move up the lineup.

Maybe Dorion would fall for a bad faith offer of a conditional 1st if Paggy resigns with the Avalanche and maybe Peirre figures he'd rather have a 2nd 1st in 2021 as oppossed to going up to 3 this year.

 

[cgf]

While I agree that EJ might not be best suited for the role anymore, I don’t think he’ll be replaced from the outside. It’ll have to be some combo of Makar and Girard that take those minutes from him.

This year is going to take some luck regardless. Our most talented defenseman is a rookie. That’s probably not gonna get us a cup unless things just happen to fall perfectly into place. Plus, we’ve got some room to grow organically on the blueline with Byram and Timmins both pushing to get into the 20-21 lineup. So I think Sakic will be a buyer at the deadline but only for players that might help us beyond this season. There’s room at forward, but less so on D (unless we’re paying a 5th rounder for injury insurance).

*I don't disagree with your assessment of what Joe is likely to do, just talking about what I think we should do*

All cups take some luck, but some take more than others and I think we can put ourselves in a position to only need an average amount of luck with the addition of a quality 3C; temporary Makar-partner (eventually, but not yet, Byram); and a reliable Bura-caliber 5th winger, who would be battle that 3C to be our 5th high-quality forward...which I think is where I diverge from you on this; especially when all of those are moves that should be fillable without touching Bo, Timmins, Newhook or any future 1sts.

Byram & Timmins mean that the blueline doesn't need a long term solution *knocks on wood*, but not that it doesn't need any help until then. I'm not really worried about Cale if we can get him a reliable partner. So a Graves-upgrade for this season & (probably) next, would go a long way towards bringing us into the "need just a normal amount of luck" range. And since we only need someone to fill that role this spring & next, a solution shouldn't be crazy expensive...which is why I think it's something that Joe should pursue.


Ultimately the question would boil down to just how much it cost to bring in a quality 3C, top 4 stop-gap, and to flip Bura for a more reliable 2nd line winger -- too give ourselves that realistic chance that I think we'd have with those moves -- to decide if it was worth it, or if we would be better served aiming to get just 1 round further this year while waiting to take our shot. The latter being an opinion that I get, even if I don't share it.

Because of how much luck cups require I want as many legit whacks at it as we can get for this core...and I thought we could have had a realistic shot at the cup last year had we brought in a capable 2c -- even if not my Drae/ROR fantasy lol -- plus a solid top-6 winger. So, despite the positive progress of last spring & this past summer; that was still a swing at the prize that we didn't make the most of...not the be all end all, but it does make me more anxious about passing up another shot at beginning to contend for realsies.


I certainly feel more confident in Joe not Chevy'ing us after this past offseason, but I tend to get antsy when folks start talking about how it's not our time yet; given that it is absolutely our core forwards' "time" with affordable reinforcements. Next season should start the transition where our core blueliners begin to really catch up to our core forwards, but next season doesn't do much for our cup-portunity this season.

 

[Eltuna]

I actually think Pageau replacing Jost would be a better upgrade to the Avs defence than a 4ish defenceman would be replacing a guy like Graves.

Pageau is really good defensively and compliments offence well without needing pp time. Bolland was huge for the Hawks and Bonino for the Pens, Pageau can be that kind of player for the Avs and is the perfect age to compliment the core. As long as the team can sign him to a 4ish year contract I would be really happy getting him even if he costs a lot to acquire.

 

[cgf]

I actually think Pageau replacing Jost would be a better upgrade to the Avs defence than a 4ish defenceman would be replacing a guy like Graves.

Pageau is really good defensively and compliments offence well without needing pp time. Bolland was huge for the Hawks and Bonino for the Pens, Pageau can be that kind of player for the Avs and is the perfect age to compliment the core. As long as the team can sign him to a 4ish year contract I would be really happy getting him even if he costs a lot to acquire.

He would be great for us, but if we can afford both without touching Bo / Timmins / Newhook / future 1sts, then why not get both really give ourselves a good shot at the cup this season?

There are only so many more season where MacK is going to be this amazing, so if we can give him a legit swing at the cup this season for a price we can bare, I want to see it happen...even if we didn't end up winning it all in the spring

 

[Hasbro]

If the Avalanche did a 1st + Jost for Paggy is there a throw in or decent defenseman that Ottawa can send back?

 

[CapSpace]

Colorado can give up Byram if they want Pageau

The f*** you smoking lad?

 

[edguy]

If the Avalanche did a 1st + Jost for Paggy is there a throw in or decent defenseman that Ottawa can send back?

We are short dmen as it is..

 

[Hasbro]

We are short dmen as it is..

You want Cole?

 

[cgf]

If the Avalanche did a 1st + Jost for Paggy is there a throw in or decent defenseman that Ottawa can send back?

Don't think so, better blueliners behind Chabot is a need for them, not a strength to trade from.

 

[Hasbro]

Don't think so, better blueliners behind Chabot is a need for them, not a strength to trade from.

Doesn't necessarily need to be a Dman.

 

[bert]

We are short dmen as it is..

So what? If the sens are getting a 1st and Jost throw in Hainsey/Boro is fine by me they are UFA's and likely arent coming back anyway.

 

[Alikhan Alizada]

As good as Pageau may be and I do like him, Colorado doesn't need another undersized middle 6 forward. Also, don't see why the Sens would want Jost. He's trash.

Fair reply except the fact that Pageau plays like a 6 foot player doesn't matter his size. Malkin is 6"3 but I can say that Domi plays a tougher game at 5"10.

 

[AvsGuy]

D Ian Cole
F Martin Kaut
1st round pick in 2020




D Dylan DeMelo
F Jean-Gabriel Pageau


Otherwise I don't think Pageau is worth a 1st on his own

 

[Karl Eriksson]

D Ian Cole
F Martin Kaut
1st round pick in 2020




D Dylan DeMelo
F Jean-Gabriel Pageau


Otherwise I don't think Pageau is worth a 1st on his own

He will return someone’s first with standalone value. Take Boro if you need a D tossed in.

 

[Mac Attack]

This is ridiculous. I swear there are a bunch of Av's fans on here that are willing to pay the same amount for Pageau that they were for Hall.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

This is ridiculous. I swear there are a bunch of Av's fans on here that are willing to pay the same amount for Pageau that they were for Hall.

I mean the difference in value in the top 3 or 4 UFA’s each year is generally pretty similar as rentals regardless of the difference in talent. Hayes vs Duchene is a good example.

Pageau fills a bigger position of need for Colorado than Hall. Plus he’d be much easier to extend if they decided to go that route. I think he’ll get a 1st rounder back.

 

[Crosside]

A second and Annunen

 

[topshelf15]

D Ian Cole
F Martin Kaut
1st round pick in 2020




D Dylan DeMelo
F Jean-Gabriel Pageau


Otherwise I don't think Pageau is worth a 1st on his own

Not happening,Demelo isnt being thrown in ...Take another defender Zaitsev,Boro,Hainsey etc

 

[Hornstar]

A first for pageau is fair. The Avs aren't drafting anyone better than him and if they do he's years away from helping. MacK playing near 25 minutes a night will take a toll by playoff time. Pageau will allow him to not have to double shift for Jost. 3c is our biggest need and here is a good one. Sakic should be all over this guy.

 

[JoemAvs]

A first for pageau is fair. The Avs aren't drafting anyone better than him and if they do he's years away from helping. MacK playing near 25 minutes a night will take a toll by playoff time. Pageau will allow him to not have to double shift for Jost. 3c is our biggest need and here is a good one. Sakic should be all over this guy.

Its fair but it very much depends on whether Pageau is willing to sign a reasonable extension with the Avs or not.
If he is not, the Avs should not do it. And if he wants too much money they should stay away as well.
Avs aren't in the "lets just throw away 1sts for rentals and see what happens" phase at all...

 

[cgf]

A first for pageau is fair. The Avs aren't drafting anyone better than him and if they do he's years away from helping. MacK playing near 25 minutes a night will take a toll by playoff time. Pageau will allow him to not have to double shift for Jost. 3c is our biggest need and here is a good one. Sakic should be all over this guy.

It's not just about who we could draft with that pick, but also who else we could trade for with that pick and what it would cost to get a 3C who isn't as good as Pageau. Joe may not view it as a need, but another top 4 guy could impact our cup chances just as much as JPG.

 

[Mac Attack]

I mean the difference in value in the top 3 or 4 UFA’s each year is generally pretty similar as rentals regardless of the difference in talent. Hayes vs Duchene is a good example.

Pageau fills a bigger position of need for Colorado than Hall. Plus he’d be much easier to extend if they decided to go that route. I think he’ll get a 1st rounder back.

That's the problem. If they are going to go for a similar price we should have paid for Hall end of story. Paying almost the same for a far inferior player, regardless of positional need is not smart in my books.

 

[Pinto22]

Why can't this be simple

Pageau

For

2020 first

Done deal let's move on

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

D Ian Cole
F Martin Kaut
1st round pick in 2020




D Dylan DeMelo
F Jean-Gabriel Pageau


Otherwise I don't think Pageau is worth a 1st on his own

I dont think we would place any kind of significant value on Cole or Kaut. Even if Pageau cant get a 1st, I'd look elsewhere because Pageau + DeMelo will for sure.

That's the problem. If they are going to go for a similar price we should have paid for Hall end of story. Paying almost the same for a far inferior player, regardless of positional need is not smart in my books.

The issue with this line of thinking is that Hall's value has gone way, way up now. Realistically, you're looking at a legit top 6 player with term if you want to add Hall, because AZ won't give him up without getting back a top 6er and there aren't any impending UFAs who are close to Halls level.

 

[Samsquanch]

Why can't this be simple

Pageau

For

2020 first

Done deal let's move on

Yup, I dont think we need Jost coming back this way tbh. Not that big a fan of Jost myself, and the Sens will be ridiculously deep after this years next draft. Best in the league. Jost just complicates things as hes obviously worth developing, I would just rather see our own guy get those minutes,

A late 1st is exactly the right price imo. Pager is a monster in the playoffs, and will compliment just about any of the contenders perfectly with his big heart and versatility.

I honestly dont want to trade Pager at all, but this draft year is just too sexy to pass up a 1st pick in, and all of the stars have aligned for Ottawa springboard the rebuild ahead by a few years.

In what is being touted as perhaps the deepest draft in 15 years, the Sens could have (3) 1st's and (3) 2nd round picks, Thats friggin bonkers when you think about it for a second. And maybe even a few more 2nds by the TDL with all the potential FAs they could trade in packages (Ennis and Hainsey anyone?).