Speculation: Is our GM Brendan Shanahan or Dave Nonis?

Dugath

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Jan 9, 2014
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Well the way I see it as with most GM's Nonis has to run his decisions past his boss (Shanahan). When I watched the draft and saw how Shanahan was taking charge at the table and Nonis somber behaviour when he went up and selected tells me Nonis was leaning towards drafting someone else but got over ruled. I could be wrong, but that was the impression I got.

So while he might be the GM, not all choices are his to make.
 

bobber

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Jan 21, 2013
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Kitchener Ontario
I think letting Bolland walk was Shanny's first blooper. Guy is a gamer. Impact player that won a cup. You fight to keep these types on the roster.
 

rojac

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Shanahan:

In my mind, Shanahan is the "big picture" guy. He, with input from all the hockey minds in the organization, basically decides the direction that the team will go, the type of players that should be on the team, etc. Essentially, he creates the "mission statement" that guides the hockey department in doing their jobs.

Nonis:

It's Dave Nonis' job to manage the roster. He's the one who negotiates contracts (or oversees them being negotiated), talks to other GMs about deals, scans the waiver wires for pick-ups, etc. He uses the "mission statement" to guide him in doing his job.

Nonis at the Draft:
As for Nonis looking somber at the draft, that may be nonsense. Nonis is a somber-looking guy most of the time. He just doesn't smile a lot. I suspect people are reading far more into this than what is there.


Thoughts
Probably, like many business relationships, the relationship between Nonis and Shanahan will be unique to the two men. There may be blending of roles at times, for example, when Shanahan has a more useful relationship with a team than Nonis, he may be more involved. There will also be areas where, yes, Shanahan technically has final say, but he trusts Nonis in those areas, so he happily rubber stamps Nonis' decisions. That's certainly the way it often works in other business situations. For example, while my manager technically has final say on all projects that our department handles, there are some projects where she trusts me to handle the project management duties and simply rubber stamps my decisions.

Personally, I wonder if some fans simply like to be able to have one specific person to blame for all decisions. It makes their angry Internet rants easier. :D
 

EastVan

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Jun 25, 2014
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Another solid move by "King Brendan" adding our two new assistant coaches.

It will be interesting to see how they do with this slightly revamped roster.

Hopefully Spott will help guys like Holland, Ashton and Granberg find meaningful roles.

Maybe Horachek will be able to make some much needed adjustments to our team defense.
 

Cor

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Jun 24, 2012
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I think letting Bolland walk was Shanny's first blooper. Guy is a gamer. Impact player that won a cup. You fight to keep these types on the roster.

I bet if we signed him to 5.5x5, you would say that was his first blooper too.
 

Kyle93

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Mar 30, 2012
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I think letting Bolland walk was Shanny's first blooper. Guy is a gamer. Impact player that won a cup. You fight to keep these types on the roster.

You're ****ing joking right? Having 10+mil tied between Bolland and Clarkson for years to come?
 

EastVan

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Jun 25, 2014
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Shannahan made a bold move today hiring Kyle Dubas to be the new Assistant GM. I cannot wait to sit back and watch the ripple effects. I expect our team is going to have a new complexion as they begin to integrate advanced stats into their approach. This was a significant step towards culture change. All of a sudden I have hope.
 

agropop

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Mar 3, 2011
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Windsor
It's pretty clear that Shanny is making all the decisions these days. Nonis is little more than a stuffed suit right now.
 

The Winter Soldier

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Apr 4, 2011
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The writing is on the wall, Nonis is on his way out. Probably will resign within a year, I can see this happening.

I can also see a presser where Babcock and a new GM will be brought in. The Burke hirings will be turned over.
 

Northern Dancer

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Mar 2, 2002
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He's basically filling the Ken Dryden role. Which is getting paid for wearing nice suits and pretending to be important.

Do you have any idea what you are talking about. Dryden got us Cujo and Dryden got us in the East from the West division. He was much, much more than a suit pretending to be important.:shakehead:shakehead:shakehead
 

SprDaVE

Moderator
Sep 20, 2008
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Shanahan is the President. Nonis is the GM. Nonis reports to Shanahan.

What's so hard to understand?
 

SprDaVE

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Sep 20, 2008
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Shanahan:

In my mind, Shanahan is the "big picture" guy. He, with input from all the hockey minds in the organization, basically decides the direction that the team will go, the type of players that should be on the team, etc. Essentially, he creates the "mission statement" that guides the hockey department in doing their jobs.

Nonis:

It's Dave Nonis' job to manage the roster. He's the one who negotiates contracts (or oversees them being negotiated), talks to other GMs about deals, scans the waiver wires for pick-ups, etc. He uses the "mission statement" to guide him in doing his job.

Nonis at the Draft:
As for Nonis looking somber at the draft, that may be nonsense. Nonis is a somber-looking guy most of the time. He just doesn't smile a lot. I suspect people are reading far more into this than what is there.


Agreed. Nonis always looks like he just woke up and confused. It's his demeanour.

Shanahan is getting a lot of attention right now because he's the new shinny exec. There's also a lot of hirings and execs to change over from the last regime, so he's prominent now and looks like the one that's doing all the changes.

If Nonis didn't have any say in anything, or was basically useless, he wouldn't be around. Pretty simple.
 

pspot

Registered User
Dec 20, 2004
10,234
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Kitchener
nonis is a lame duck GM and Carlyle a lame duck coach
maybe they've kept them around to take a fall while Shanny tinkers.
 

Mess

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Feb 27, 2002
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Agreed. Nonis always looks like he just woke up and confused. It's his demeanour.

Shanahan is getting a lot of attention right now because he's the new shinny exec. There's also a lot of hirings and execs to change over from the last regime, so he's prominent now and looks like the one that's doing all the changes.

If Nonis didn't have any say in anything, or was basically useless, he wouldn't be around. Pretty simple.

Neither Shanahan nor Dubas have any experience as an NHL GM at this point.

Nonis is here directly related to that fact as both Shanny and our new assistant GM are still in training. Both appear as quick study execs and once they're comfortable with the roles and responsibilities they will allow Nonis to join his buddy in Calgary.
 

SprDaVE

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Sep 20, 2008
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Neither Shanahan nor Dubas have any experience as an NHL GM at this point.

Nonis is here directly related to that fact as both Shanny and our new assistant GM are still in training. Both appear as quick study execs and once they're comfortable with the roles and responsibilities they will allow Nonis to join his buddy in Calgary.

It's not like Nonis has a ton of GM experience. He had a bit in Vancouver and that's about it. He's been more of assistant then not.

Seems like a big reach and assumptions that Nonis is a lame duck GM as you say. He's not here just because there isn't much experience. I don't disagree that he's probably on thin ice, just like Carlyle, but he hasn't been here for very long either as the guy at the helm. I really believe Shanahan wants to give him a couple more years to set forth what he started, something he didn't get to do in Vancouver. Leweike, Shanahan's boss, also has been saying good things about Nonis.

If we needed a temporary GM with experience until Dubas was ready, Cliff Fletcher would be the GM. Speaking of Cliff, I'm hoping Shanny talks to him quite a bit over the next couple months. He may be old and senile now but that guy could build a team and knows a thing or two about being a GM. He's the type of advisor that I'm sure Shanny will lean on if he needs to some tips about the GM business.
 
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StuckOutHere

Registered User
Feb 10, 2010
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While Shanny likely has some serious input, Nonis isn't some brainheaded rookie. I imagine they are learning from each other. Shanny is learning how to be a GM in a sense, while Nonis, if he has any survival instincts, is learning to open his mind to new methods of evaluation and seemingly for the first time learning how to be part of a different braintrust free of the influence of guys like Burke(I like Burke), Loiselle, and Poulin.
 

Mess

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Feb 27, 2002
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It's not like Nonis has a ton of GM experience. He had a bit in Vancouver and that's about it. He's been more of assistant then not.

Seems like a big reach and assumptions that Nonis is a lame duck GM as you say. He's not here just because there isn't much experience. I don't disagree that he's probably on thin ice, just like Carlyle, but he hasn't been here for very long either as the guy at the helm. I really believe Shanahan wants to give him a couple more years to set forth what he started, something he didn't get to do in Vancouver. Leweike, Shanahan's boss, also has been saying good things about Nonis.

If we needed a temporary GM with experience until Dubas was ready, Cliff Fletcher would be the GM.

Nonis has years of assistant GM experience and that assistant role does everything an actual GM does except make the final calls. Contract negotiations, trade calls, CBA knowledge, cap management etc etc are all things an assistant GM is involved in.

Nonis and Carlyle are both directly attached to Leafs results, whereas neither Shanny nor Dubas are. If this next season ends in failure and another non playoff season one or both will be fired, in that respect they're lame duck execs that need results to save themselves.

They're transitional management execs as Shanny switches the organization over to his own management choices in the future. Leafs need fall guys to insulate his hires Dubas and Steve Spott from ridicule and blame as Shanny rebuilds the organization around them.

Expect scouting to be next on Shanny's hit list for change.
 
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Kubus

Registered User
Jun 22, 2014
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31
Shanahan:


Personally, I wonder if some fans simply like to be able to have one specific person to blame for all decisions. It makes their angry Internet rants easier. :D

:handclap:

LOL. How true.
 

Parkdale

Registered User
Jan 14, 2013
1,265
0
Toronto
It's not like Nonis has a ton of GM experience. He had a bit in Vancouver and that's about it. He's been more of assistant then not.

Seems like a big reach and assumptions that Nonis is a lame duck GM as you say. He's not here just because there isn't much experience. I don't disagree that he's probably on thin ice, just like Carlyle, but he hasn't been here for very long either as the guy at the helm. I really believe Shanahan wants to give him a couple more years to set forth what he started, something he didn't get to do in Vancouver. Leweike, Shanahan's boss, also has been saying good things about Nonis.

If we needed a temporary GM with experience until Dubas was ready, Cliff Fletcher would be the GM. Speaking of Cliff, I'm hoping Shanny talks to him quite a bit over the next couple months. He may be old and senile now but that guy could build a team and knows a thing or two about being a GM. He's the type of advisor that I'm sure Shanny will lean on if he needs to some tips about the GM business.

Don't know if you are being serious, but how did that work out last time? Nonis has a longer leash because he is one of Leweike's hire (extension giver)....but he is clearly a lame duck (well paid though). I think his probation period under Shanny could last at least 18 months. Expecting the scouting staff to be given the Shanny special treatment next....not a good time to be an assistant scout:)
 

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