Is Mike Babcock's Lame Duck Status Hurting the Wings?

[The Zetterberg Era]

We are all disappointed with Holland and the buck stops with him.

But is it fair to ask at this point is Mike Babcock's lack of a contract, swirling rumors in terms of his coaching future hurting this team?

I mean surely the big crowd of major Babcock supporters would argue his being the bench boss should be a big selling point right?

He was willing to fly around and meet people in the past, not much heard on that front recently.

We have gone on about the lengths of what appears to be a growing disconnect between him and his boss who is persona non grata for his stunning decision to panic and bring Quincey back and then loyally sign Cleary.

But we had options up the list first if we are to believe some of what has been floated out there and we offered them things that should have been desirable. Did Babcock's contract status hurt us in your opinion and how worried should we be if this is an opinion of NHL players because that would be some additional smoke to the idea he is leaving soon.

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[chances14]

it can't help that's for sure

 

[davecrockburn]

The only reason I think Babs didn't re-sign earlier on is that he wanted to see what Holland would provide him with in the offseason. Babs isn't going to stick around for a full youth rebuild from scratch. I think he is as good as gone at this point as Holland has shown no interest in improving this team. Babs can go coach any team in the NHL he wants and he is stuck with Q and Cleary on the bench as his offseason acquisition and an aging core. I also don't see Babs as the greatest person to bring up our youth as he seems to work best with established talent and has trust issues with young guys on higher lines.

 

[davecrockburn]

Anyone remember when Babs got pissed after Holland missed out on Brent Burns at the draft a couple years ago? He does believe we need more talent and wants to have RH-LH pairings but Holland keeps nickel and diming him with the same old crap. Holland claims RH dmen don't grow on trees - well neither do RH 1C's and Nill acquired 2 of those in 2 offseasons...

 

[Vladdy84]

I truly believe some players don't wanna play for Babcock. But I also don't believe the coach matters as much as the situation, facilities, location etc.

 

[Vladdy84]

Anyone remember when Babs got pissed after Holland missed out on Brent Burns at the draft a couple years ago? He does believe we need more talent and wants to have RH-LH pairings but Holland keeps nickel and diming him with the same old crap. Holland claims RH dmen don't grow on trees - well neither do RH 1C's and Nill acquired 2 of those in 2 offseasons...

The Wings didn't have a Loui E. or Riley Smith to dangle either. At least that they were willing to move. The Spezza acquisition is more complicated.

 

[Adityase]

It's not Babs status. People see the Wings are in decline. Dats and Z were clearly going to replace Stevie and Fedorov... And Lidstrom proved to be the most important piece. Without Lids and no clear Heirs to Dats and Z, the coaches reputation doesn't mean much. If Scotty Bowman decided to coach Calgary right now players wouldn't flock there...

 

[Frk It]

His status is irrelevant to the two awful signings Holland just made.

But it doesn't help matters, he's good as gone.

 

[PullHard]

I think the fact that Babcock could be leaving soon, the team sliding in the standings the last couple years, the best players being mid 30s, and the team's reputation to favour/ cater to (in some instances) long time vets all combine to make it not overly appealing at this moment.

Could be different in a year or two, if Babcock extends or leaves, and the team's prospects turn into exciting young NHLers who can contribute at this level.

But right now, I think it is pretty much the perfect storm of uncertainty.

 

[Winger98]

I think it hurts us a bit. It's not the only reason guys wouldn't want to sign here, but having that sort of instability on the horizon while the main guys on the roster get another year older can't help us. especially if it's assumed we're bringing in a rookie head coach with strong ties to a lot of kids in the system.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

I think it hurt the Wings a LOT during the UFA period. Nobody wants to sign a long-term deal when even the coach is threatening to leave.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I think it hurts us a bit. It's not the only reason guys wouldn't want to sign here, but having that sort of instability on the horizon while the main guys on the roster get another year older can't help us. especially if it's assumed we're bringing in a rookie head coach with strong ties to a lot of kids in the system.

Which is a very interesting point that I didn't think of either. Have heard players point this out on other teams that promote from within that they believe the players that come up have a slight advantage. Now most of us would welcome that change, but it does have to impact the way some FA think, not all, just think our coaching situation while I have faith in both guys is not helping.

 

[Vladdy84]

I think it hurt the Wings a LOT during the UFA period. Nobody wants to sign a long-term deal when even the coach is threatening to leave.

Or they don't wanna play for a coach like Babcock.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Or they don't wanna play for a coach like Babcock.

I think that might be true for some guys, but there are always vets who really badly want to win. Those guys absolutely want to play for Babcock... they just don't want to do it here. And from their perspective, maybe they won't have to. They'll just sign wherever he goes for next year.

 

[Vladdy84]

I think that might be true for some guys, but there are always vets who really badly want to win. Those guys absolutely want to play for Babcock... they just don't want to do it here. And from their perspective, maybe they won't have to. They'll just sign wherever he goes for next year.

Like? Alfie came here because of Z and the other Swedes. Hossa came here because he thought he could win a cup.

 

[icKx]

Absolutely.

Holland signs scraps and Babcock benches them. If we can see the rift I'd wager players around the league can.

Our core is aging -- three years left on the expiration date, the future is being suppressed at every opportunity and the head coach is in limbo.

What free agent wants a part of an organization with this much uncertainty?

I don't like all of Babcock's decisions but completely understand his frustration and why he will not re-sign.

Babcock is like Phil Jackson: give him the best toys or don't expect to keep his interest.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Like? Alfie came here because of Z and the other Swedes. Hossa came here because he thought he could win a cup.

What I look at is Team Canada. Babcock came out of the Olympics looking like a coaching god. He's still got a lot of that mojo, and a lot of players no doubt still buy into that idea.

The non-starter is the team. I think pretty much everybody thinks Babcock could do wonderful things with a good team. It's just that he doesn't have one, and no free agents were willing to risk their necks on the idea that the Wings could get there with just a little help.

Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if players were worried that Babcock is making the team look better than they are. So if Babcock leaves, by their logic, the team could be in shambles. That's got to be scary to UFAs.

 

[Vladdy84]

What I look at is Team Canada. Babcock came out of the Olympics looking like a coaching god. He's still got a lot of that mojo, and a lot of players no doubt still buy into that idea.

The non-starter is the team. I think pretty much everybody thinks Babcock could do wonderful things with a good team. It's just that he doesn't have one, and no free agents were willing to risk their necks on the idea that the Wings could get there with just a little help.

Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if players were worried that Babcock is making the team look better than they are. So if Babcock leaves, by their logic, the team could be in shambles. That's got to be scary to UFAs.

Pretty easy to coach when your team has more talent than any other team.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

Pretty easy to coach when your team has more talent than any other team.

I guess, but Canada hasn't always won it. He still had a job to do, and he did it well.

 

[vladdy16]

Holland and the Red Wings have excelled at stocking a system full of undersized, high iq, skill players. Babcock has consistantly run undersized, high iq, skill players out of town in favor of gritty, system players. The resulting losses in asset management have been crippling.

I think a lot of frustrations about how the organization has been run would be alleviated if Babcocks contract was allowed to run out.

He's a great coach in many situations, but he's been here too long and the team has been declining too consistantly to claim things are working out. A broader thinking coaching could do wonders with the development system we have. I think it's imperitive someone gets that chance while 40,13 and 55 are still kicking.

I could care less about Suter, Ehrhoff, etc. But Cleary, Quincy, Lashoff, glendenning, etc. makes Detroit's system unattractive not only for Ufa's but for Hudler, filpulla, tatar etc.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

His status is irrelevant to the two awful signings Holland just made.

But it doesn't help matters, he's good as gone.

Yup if he was'nt before, He sure is now.

 

[Octopus]

We are all disappointed with Holland and the buck stops with him.

But is it fair to ask at this point is Mike Babcock's lack of a contract, swirling rumors in terms of his coaching future hurting this team?

I mean surely the big crowd of major Babcock supporters would argue his being the bench boss should be a big selling point right?

He was willing to fly around and meet people in the past, not much heard on that front recently.
I think Holland should assume a higher role in the organization similar to others in the league. He's done a good job over the years ai
We have gone on about the lengths of what appears to be a growing disconnect between him and his boss who is persona non grata for his stunning decision to panic and bring Quincey back and then loyally sign Cleary.

But we had options up the list first if we are to believe some of what has been floated out there and we offered them things that should have been desirable. Did Babcock's contract status hurt us in your opinion and how worried should we be if this is an opinion of NHL players because that would be some additional smoke to the idea he is leaving soon.

I think Holland should assume a higher role in the organization similar to others in the league (Clarke, Davidson etc.) He's done a good job over the years, won cups and has always brought in money for the owner given the playoff streak. Like everyone else, I'm not happy with his free agent record in the past 2-3 years. Quite frankly its been horrible. Babcock will move on for sure and Blashill would be a good choice given he knows many of the players that will become the core of the team moving forward. Detroit is not a good destination right now for free agents because the Red Wings are not a cup contender anymore and the city itself has to be a factor. The last 5 years has taken its toll on the city and no doubt that becomes a factor on some players minds. Hate to say that and I know some of you will be upset for bringing it up but I believe its true.

 

[Heaton]

Like? Alfie came here because of Z and the other Swedes. Hossa came here because he thought he could win a cup.

So what's your point? no one wants to play for Babcock?

 

[Heaton]

Pretty easy to coach when your team has more talent than any other team.

Yeah it is, amazing how much talent the cup winner always has. amazing that Scotty had the most talent ever and won the most.

 

[GBFP]

The uncertainty hurts - because there are players who don't want to play for him, but others who probably do, but on the one year deal he's not a lure to the latter player in that they sign here long term and he's gone in a year. And he still keeps the players who don't like him away because he's still here one more year and could end up staying longer.