Is Erik Karlsson still a top 5-10 dman?

[wetcoast]

Hasn’t been since 2016

I think he has a case for top 5 still, especially with his playoff run, in 2016 but sure since then he hasn't been.

 

[wetcoast]

Since 2016-2017, there are 34 skaters who have played at least 600 minutes on the PP.

One of those players scores over 3 goals per 60 minutes. Guess who?

It's an easy guess, Ovechkin since he is the best goal scorer in the league.

Doesn't change the fact that he is getting more PP time and that can't but help his stats, it's simple math.

The 2 things aren't mutually exclusive.

 

[HavlatMach9]

On another, more topical note, E. Karlsson had another great game. 2 assists and quickly approaching being a + player for the Sharks...

If we add Erik's own assist to the two of Karlsson, he had 3 tonight Pog

 

[aufheben]

damn he just looks fantastic.

even if you forget his offence, he might be the best defensive d in the league right now. i know people are going to start frothing at the mouth citing vlasic, doughty or some **** and all ill do is laugh

Forget best defensively, I still see people saying he literally cannot play defense.

Boggles the mind, just...boggles the mind.

 

[Alwalys]

Forget best defensively, I still see people saying he literally cannot play defense.

Boggles the mind, just...boggles the mind.

i never bought into that but i also didn't think he was elite. some of the things he can do are elite, his stickwork is elite and his reading of plays is definitely elite. considering how much offense he can generate quickly his defense is far more than adequate. he is a major plus ice tilter.

 

[Agent Zub]

Forget best defensively, I still see people saying he literally cannot play defense.

Boggles the mind, just...boggles the mind.

funny thing is that if their teams best d was playing like karlsson defensively they would be hyping him up to no end (deservedly).

but since its karlsson playing like that he's trash and a liability on the ice.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

It's an easy guess, Ovechkin since he is the best goal scorer in the league.

Doesn't change the fact that he is getting more PP time and that can't but help his stats, it's simple math.

The 2 things aren't mutually exclusive.

I had began to type a long-winded response to tell you just how wrong you are, but I decided to turn it into an article instead. I don't mean to de-rail this one, but I will just include the point of that post as it pertains to the topic of this one: Erik Karlsson:

Purely offensively, John Carlson is not at the level that a true elite offensive defenseman like Burns/Karlsson. His team is far, far better offensively, which is why his statistics are close to theirs, but he is merely a cog in that beautifully orchestrated machine; he does not drive offense in the manner that those two do. Defensively, John Carlson is pretty pedestrian. This would be enough for him to be considered a top defenseman if he were offensively at the level of a Karlsson/Burns, but he is not.

 

[4thTierSport]

I had began to type a long-winded response to tell you just how wrong you are, but I decided to turn it into an article instead. I don't mean to de-rail this one, but I will just include the point of that post as it pertains to the topic of this one: Erik Karlsson:

Purely offensively, John Carlson is not at the level that a true elite offensive defenseman like Burns/Karlsson. His team is far, far better offensively, which is why his statistics are close to theirs, but he is merely a cog in that beautifully orchestrated machine; he does not drive offense in the manner that those two do. Defensively, John Carlson is pretty pedestrian. This would be enough for him to be considered a top defenseman if he were offensively at the level of a Karlsson/Burns, but he is not.

Ah, the truth comes out a couple threads down!

 

[PatrikBerglund]

I guess he´s kind of back now.

Needs a couple of goals though.

 

[Sun God Nika]

6 game point streak right now with 8pts in his last 8 games.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Yes 2 months Does not change that

 

[authentic]

I heard he's looking back to his old self, how true is that?

 

[Alwalys]

I heard he's looking back to his old self, how true is that?

depends what you thought his old self was

 

[GreatGonzo]

depends what you thought his old self was

I honestly don’t see what your seeing. He’s made great improvements since the start of the year, but he was absolutely horrid in the beginning, and he still isn’t this amazing defender that a lot of excited to proclaim him as.

His defensive game has ALWAYS been suspect. He just showed from time to time that he has the abilities, but he isn’t consistent at all. The difference is his offense suffered this season, making his defensive game become glaring. Now that he has picked it up offensively, doesn’t mean his defense has come along with it.

Sure, he’s been solid from time to time. But I think we need to let the season play out longer before declaring him “back.” Sharks fans are excited so I can see where this jump to that conclusion is coming from.

 

[Alwalys]

I honestly don’t see what your seeing. He’s made great improvements since the start of the year, but he was absolutely horrid in the beginning, and he still isn’t this amazing defender that a lot of excited to proclaim him as.

His defensive game has ALWAYS been suspect. He just showed from time to time that he has the abilities, but he isn’t consistent at all. The difference is his offense suffered this season, making his defensive game become glaring. Now that he has picked it up offensively, doesn’t mean his defense has come along with it.

Sure, he’s been solid from time to time. But I think we need to let the season play out longer before declaring him “back.” Sharks fans are excited so I can see where this jump to that conclusion is coming from.

wtf are you responding to

 

[GreatGonzo]

wtf are you responding to

My fault I was going off of what you were saying but instead of saying “you”, I should have said the fans that see him as back to his old self.

 

[jetsforever]

Looked great tonight, I'd still take him over pretty much anyone

 

[WesMcCauley]

I honestly don’t see what your seeing. He’s made great improvements since the start of the year, but he was absolutely horrid in the beginning, and he still isn’t this amazing defender that a lot of excited to proclaim him as.

His defensive game has ALWAYS been suspect. He just showed from time to time that he has the abilities, but he isn’t consistent at all. The difference is his offense suffered this season, making his defensive game become glaring. Now that he has picked it up offensively, doesn’t mean his defense has come along with it.

Sure, he’s been solid from time to time. But I think we need to let the season play out longer before declaring him “back.”

He is fine defensively. He is by far the best defensemen in the NHL when it comes to breaking out of the defensive zone. Skates himself out of trouble time after time and has a fantastic first pass etc.

He was a -1 tonight for example and on for three goals against at even strength. First goal Burns turns it over and gives Byfuglien a breakaway, second goal puck bounces off the boards to the slot when the goalie went behind the net to pick it up and its an open net for the Jets player, third goal is an empty netter.
He had absolutely nothing to do with the goals or could do anything to avoid them but still gets -3 from 3 of the goals.
He also has unreal shots for/against stats because of how crazy good he is at moving the puck out of the defensive zone. San Jose has also had awful goaltending this season.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Looked great tonight, I'd still take him over pretty much anyone

I agree. He is much better defensively than Burns for example who is extremely inconsistent defensively.

 

[TomasHertlsRooster]

Good to hear some objective analysis from Jets fans in this thread. Tonight’s game was his best of the season and he was absolutely incredible.

He’s going to be this player going forward and that player has a larger positive impact than any other defenseman in the NHL.

 

[Alwalys]

id say he singlehandedly makes the sharks competitive with the jets.

 

[GreatGonzo]

He is fine defensively. He is by far the best defensemen in the NHL when it comes to breaking out of the defensive zone. Skates himself out of trouble time after time and has a fantastic first pass etc.

He was a -1 tonight for example and on for three goals against at even strength. First goal Burns turns it over and gives Byfuglien a breakaway, second goal puck bounces off the boards to the slot when the goalie went behind the net to pick it up and its an open net for the Jets player, third goal is an empty netter.
He had absolutely nothing to do with the goals or could do anything to avoid them but still gets -3 from 3 of the goals.
He also has unreal shots for/against stats because of how crazy good he is at moving the puck out of the defensive zone. San Jose has also had awful goaltending this season.

Well he isn’t “fine.” Maybe for your standards but not for a player who is supposed to be the best in the NHL.

What you just described are his abilities offensively, which he finally is getting back in the groove of things, but he was always the best offensive defenseman in the league while being one of the best playmakers. That’s where his speciality is, driving the play and creatinf chances....hardly his play in his own end. I’m not counting on EK to be the best defenseman on our team or even in the league, I’m counting on him to be at least responsible in his own end while generating offense. He was pretty much bad on both ends of the ice the first couple of months in.

Like I said, he has been doing good this month so far. But it’s only been a couple of weeks. I want to see if he maintains this play, and maybe elevates it at some point.

 

[GreatGonzo]

I agree. He is much better defensively than Burns for example who is extremely inconsistent defensively.

Both are inconsistent while being stand outs offensively. Burns has been better this season than EK, who is finally showing signs of life.

id say he singlehandedly makes the sharks competitive with the jets.

he was good tonight. Let’s see if he keeps it up.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Well he isn’t “fine.” Maybe for your standards but not for a player who is supposed to be the best in the NHL.

What you just described are his abilities offensively, which he finally is getting back in the groove of things, but he was always the best offensive defenseman in the league while being one of the best playmakers. That’s where his speciality is, driving the play and creatinf chances....hardly his play in his own end. I’m not counting on EK to be the best defenseman on our team or even in the league, I’m counting on him to be at least responsible in his own end while generating offense. He was pretty much bad on both ends of the ice the first couple of months in.

Like I said, he has been doing good this month so far. But it’s only been a couple of weeks. I want to see if he maintains this play, and maybe elevates it at some point.

He has unreal shot suppression numbers and a great stick. Not the strongest in front of his net but he can defend.
What ever people say, he avoids chances against better than most defensemen in the NHL while also being elite at creating chances.
Can he be a little sloppy around his own net? Sure, but so does Burns, Rielly, Hedman and Subban etc. Karlssons game gets broken down to a level that no other defensemen in the NHL gets. Ofc we are going to complain more about his defensive game then all the other top players.

Fact is, he stops chances before they happen which is a fantastic skill to have. His defensive game has also matured a lot the last 5 seasons down low. What i do think he isnt elite at is defending his net and the crease which players like Weber are much better at for obvious reasons.

 

[GreatGonzo]

He has unreal shot suppression numbers and a great stick. Not the strongest in front of his net but he can defend.
What ever people say, he avoids chances against better than most defensemen in the NHL while also being elite at creating chances.
Can he be a little sloppy around his own net? Sure, but so does Burns, Rielly, Hedman and Subban etc. Karlssons game gets broken down to a level that no other defensemen in the NHL gets. Ofc we are going to complain more about his defensive game then all the other top players.

Fact is, he stops chances before they happen which is a fantastic skill to have. His defensive game has also matured a lot the last 5 seasons down low. What i do think he isnt elite at is defending his net and the crease which players like Weber are much better at for obvious reasons.

He can defend but he hasn’t always done it at an elite level, and when he did..he wasn’t consistent.

EK isn’t on another level. You sound like a great hype man but I think you should calm down and take a look at the EK over the past couple of years. EKs superiority compared to other defensemen has always been his offense, but that doesn’t make him on another level, especially right now. I never minded hearing Hedman, Doughty, or at one point Burns being better over the last few years.

Again, matured....still not at a high Level. We can give him a pat on the back and loose our minds every time he makes a good defensive play, but in the end he needs to keep elevating it, problem is his latest surgery slowed him down and he’s been trying to get back to his old form since.