Is Erik Karlsson still a top 5-10 dman?

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Tage2Tuch

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May 10, 2004
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Defense first was not his game, but now that he’s not tremendous offensively as he once was I am wondering if anyone still puts them in their “top 5 or top 10 dman in the game” list, and if not, where would you rank him? And why?
 

TomasHertlsRooster

Don’t say eye test when you mean points
May 14, 2012
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Yes, despite a bad start and relatively poor season as a whole by his standard last year, he was still easily a top-10 over the entirety of the season.

Watching him with the Sharks, it’s clear that he still has the talent that few others in the NHL have. It hasn’t necessarily translated to production just yet, but his impact on the game is obvious and the production will come around.

Come playoff time, when he is fully acquainted with his new team, he will be at that level.
 

Ronnie Residue

Burns is daddy.
Feb 15, 2015
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Yeah this is an irrelevant question until next year. Haven’t been wildly impressed yet but there’s a lot of time left, and he has not been negative by any means. Even games with no points recorded he’s managed to be very strong in.
 

Reddwit

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Feb 4, 2016
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I think people really underestimate how much of an adjustment it is to go from the Erik Karlsson Show to the Burnsy, Pickles & EK Trio.

Not uncommon for veterans who have been the top dog on their team for a while to struggle when transitioning to a team with other top dogs already running the show.
 
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TomasHertlsRooster

Don’t say eye test when you mean points
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Watching these GIFs, it’s clear to me that whatever issues Karlsson is having this season, his top end speed is not one of them.

65__Domi_.gif


This one looks like it’s photoshopped:

65.gif
 

Mafoofoo

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Jul 3, 2010
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I think people really underestimate how much of an adjustment it is to go from the Erik Karlsson Show to the Burnsy, Pickles & EK Trio.

Not uncommon for veterans who have been the top dog on their team for a while to struggle when transitioning to a team with other top dogs already running the show.

Wrong. Everyone in San Jose knows it’s the Dilly show with guest appearances from Burns, Karl and the Pickle.
 

Tage2Tuch

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He isn't playing like one right now, but first trades can have a big impact on players.

If he still struggles next season, i think they conversation should be had. But he's still Erik ****ing Karlsson


Yeah but Carey price is still Carey PRICE and while one can remain good can they remain great after a fall off, and by great I mean elite, which is what my question was.

And I don’t think it should take a guy thAt good an entire season to get his “overcoming A trade” (In reference to your if next year then....) but I agree he’s still got the tools I’m just not seeing it this year.
 
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Tage2Tuch

Because TheJackAttack is in Black
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Let’s make it simple. Can you name ten defencemen who you would rather have over Karlsson?


I’m not the one saying he’s not, I’m the one asking others what there opinion is.

I think he still can be the best in the game.

But if I tried? MAybe? Arguably one of these...


Hedman
Jones
Doughty (see petriangelo but maybe still)
Dahlin (for now and future)
Josi
Burns
PK
Carlsson
Krug
Petriangelo (not so much this year)


There are lots more who are arguable but if this is how he plays the test of his career I could name some more.


However if he gets his game back then no, maybe only to three of those guys would I pick for now and the future (probably dahlin and Hedman) and maybe one of doughty/Josi/Jones

But I wanted to know what others thought...
 

Anomie2029

Registered User
Oct 10, 2013
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I’m not the one saying he’s not, I’m the one asking others what there opinion is.

I think he still can be the best in the game.

But if I tried? MAybe? Arguably one of these...


Hedman
Jones
Doughty (see petriangelo but maybe still)
Dahlin (for now and future)
Josi
Burns
PK
Carlsson
Krug
Petriangelo (not so much this year)


There are lots more who are arguable but if this is how he plays the test of his career I could name some more.


However if he gets his game back then no, maybe only to three of those guys would I pick for now and the future (probably dahlin and Hedman) and maybe one of doughty/Josi/Jones

But I wanted to know what others thought...

So Doughty and Petriangelo having down years but that's ok against Karlsson having a down year? (Btw Doughty with 51 Giveaways but 7 takeaways? Ouch)

Also Dahlin has not been better than Karlsson this season. Dahlin has less points per game despite shooting at a percentage twice of Karlsson's.
Karlsson is also rated at 58.46% Corsi (putting him 5th in the league) compared to 49.50% for Dahlin.
Karlsson has 31 takeaways, putting him equal third in the league (Dahlin has 8 putting him at 81st).
Dahlin has 5:00 on the PK compared to Karlsson's 52 minutes (he is also listed as second on SH takeaways, so he is a pretty effective PK).

The narrative that he is having a poor season is overblown, as is the narrative that he is awful defensively.
 
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Howard Beale

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Apr 7, 2010
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I wouldn't be too quick to write him off... even elite defensemen can occasionally have a bad season (or ~27 games, in this case).


In the early 2000s, Lidstrom was a 60-70 point guy, but then in 2004 he had a weak season and only scored 38 points. He was already 33 years old, so I remember I figured he was probably now on the decline, and his best days were behind him.

Instead, he came back from the 2005 lockout and scored 80 points in 2006, and won 4 more Norris trophies (scoring 60+ points each time).

Karlsson's a 2-time Norris winner (who came close to winning two others), and he's only 28. He may have had a so-so start to the season by his standards, but it's too soon to declare he's no longer an elite defenseman.
 

TomasHertlsRooster

Don’t say eye test when you mean points
May 14, 2012
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Yeah but Carey price is still Carey PRICE and while one can remain good can they remain great after a fall off, and by great I mean elite, which is what my question was.

And I don’t think it should take a guy thAt good an entire season to get his “overcoming A trade” (In reference to your if next year then....) but I agree he’s still got the tools I’m just not seeing it this year.

Carey Price is not at Erik Karlsson’s level. Price had one fantastic season and a few good ones, Karlsson was unquestionably the best defenseman in the NHL over a 5 year period.
 
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filinski77

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Feb 12, 2017
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Yeah but Carey price is still Carey PRICE and while one can remain good can they remain great after a fall off, and by great I mean elite, which is what my question was.

And I don’t think it should take a guy thAt good an entire season to get his “overcoming A trade” (In reference to your if next year then....) but I agree he’s still got the tools I’m just not seeing it this year.
But Karlsson never had a "fall-off" though. He lead all D-men in points/gp last year on a terrible tire fire of a team. He's had a slow start this year, but he was still the best offensive d-man last year.
 
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