Salary Cap: I'm too lazy to think of a funny Salary Cap pun

[Ugene Magic]

I don't mean to be rude, but you have no understanding of the situation. You are treating Boedker's contract as if the Pens have "prorated" cap space and not LTIR space. Technically, there is no such thing as pro-rated space, just daily hits as you said.

However, LTIR space only allows you to take a FULL YEAR contract (as in not daily hits like you are attempting to do) when you take on a contract.

No the Pens have LTIR cap space meaning cap space they can use but they can't double it due to LTIR.

You are saying they have none basically and that is not true at all.

The Pens space is LTIR.

I don't know where you get I'm prorating it at all. they have 1.6 at this very moment even if it is LTIR. JR say's they have more, and when guys get sent down they'll gain more. So I get that it's 2.0 or possibly more.

You do take the full year contract if you notice the salary part section of any given cap site, but the actual cap hit will be .947. What everyone fails to understand here is, Arizona has already paid Boedker up and to this point. The Pens are not going to pay Boedker 3.750 which is exactly what that would imply.

 

[Shady Machine]

Yeah you're correct. Prorating cap space and prorating contracts are the same thing, I have no idea why people think they're not the same thing. The Pens only have LTIR space, so they can't prorate that cap space. That means they can't prorate contracts. Boedker would cost the full $3.75 million or whatever it is. That's why any move we make will probably be money out for money in.

Agreed. Hopefully my quote of the definition from generalfanager puts this issue to rest. I get into this debate every year with someone else at the deadline. JB even fell into the trap and then amended his article after our discussion on here the other day.

 

[Empoleon8771]

No the Pens have LTIR cap space meaning cap space they can use but they can't double it due to LTIR.

You are saying they have none basically and that is not true at all.

The Pens space is LTIR.

I don't know where you get I'm prorating it at all. they have 1.6 at this very moment even if it is LTIR. JR say's they have more, and when guys get sent down they'll gain more. So I get that it's 2.0 or possibly more.

You do take the full year contract if you notice the salary part section of any given cap site, but the actual cap hit will be .947. What everyone fails to understand here is, Arizona has already paid Boedker up and to this point. The Pens are not going to pay Boedker 3.750 which is exactly what that would imply.

No it isn't. You're just incorrect on that. Arizona has paid Boedker up to that point, but the Pens still are responsible for his entire cap hit due to their cap space being LTIR space.

The cap hit being less only applies if you're under the cap. If you're over the cap, you can only add however much in yearly AAVs that the LTIR space is. LTIR space is not prorated, which means we can't bring in prorated contracts with it.

 

[Shady Machine]

No the Pens have LTIR cap space meaning cap space they can use but they can't double it due to LTIR.

You are saying they have none basically and that is not true at all.

The Pens space is LTIR.

I don't know where you get I'm prorating it at all. they have 1.6 at this very moment even if it is LTIR. JR say's they have more, and when guys get sent down they'll gain more. So I get that it's 2.0 or possibly more.

You do take the full year contract if you notice the salary part section of any given cap site, but the actual cap hit will be .947. What everyone fails to understand here is, Arizona has already paid Boedker up and to this point. The Pens are not going to pay Boedker 3.750 which is exactly what that would imply.

NO stop. Please read what I wrote and the definition. Because it's LTIR space, Boedker costs the pens his FULL ANNUAL CAPHIT of 3.75MM. You are pro-rating Boedker's contract. Stop doing that with LTIR space

Or read Empoleon because he explained it better than I did.

 

[Shady Machine]

I don't know about you guys, but I see that as a good thing: the whole money in, money out, dollar-for-dollar, good-ol'-fashioned hockey trades, etc.

I trust Rutherford way more when we're making hockey trades. I don't think there are too many GM's in the league better right now, to be honest. He's from a time when most GM's were good at hockey trades. Not so much anymore.

It is a good thing. He can't do too much stupid IMO.

 

[WayneSid9987]

Lawless, who knows his Jets say the Pens still in on Ladd:

http://www.tsn.ca/cheveldayoff-doing-a-lot-of-listening-on-ladd-1.441327

As many as six teams – Anaheim, Chicago, Florida, Los Angeles, Pittsburgh and Washington – are believed to have interest in him.

ETA: Thought it was a new article.
Written on Feb.21 but still.

 

[Greeneye]

Really hope JR stands pat unless he can pull off a real hockey trade. Trading futures for a playoff run would be a big mistake imo.

 

[SEALBound]

No it isn't. You're just incorrect on that. Arizona has paid Boedker up to that point, but the Pens still are responsible for his entire cap hit due to their cap space being LTIR space.

The cap hit being less only applies if you're under the cap. If you're over the cap, you can only add however much in yearly AAVs that the LTIR space is. LTIR space is not prorated, which means we can't bring in prorated contracts with it.

Ugene, they are correct. It is fairly confusing and I see where you are coming from they are correct.

 

[SEALBound]

Lawless, who knows his Jets say the Pens still in on Ladd:

http://www.tsn.ca/cheveldayoff-doing-a-lot-of-listening-on-ladd-1.441327


ETA: Thought it was a new article.
Written on Feb.21 but still.

And why wouldn't they be? I think for the Penguins it will come down to price.

The only way I can see the Pens getting Ladd is for the Jets to ask for the moon and have all other teams say no and go for other targets and get them. Then the Pens come in and offer something less and force them to take it.

Highly unlikely but...you never know. I just hope they are not so in love with him that they get into a bidding war and we lose Pouliot, Sprong, or Murray.

Jets would also have to be okay with taking back a couple contracts.

 

[Riptide]

Sundqvist is the reverse Brandon Sutter. Can't score goals but he's strong and a beast on the boards.

Which is fine. The offense might come - I mean he's played what - 10 games now? Or it might not, but I'll take someone more like this on the 3rd/4th line then someone who can score but can't battle it out and usually only scores off the rush.

 

[PensandCaps]

Ugh, I don't like these articles, but the comments are even worse. Way to go Herb.

http://penslabyrinth.com/2016/02/19/could-the-pittsburgh-penguins-trade-beau-bennett/
https://penslabyrinth.com/2016/02/22/trade-bait-are-pittsburgh-penguins-trying-to-move-plotnikov/

"I like having cole as a fill in replacement " lol those comments are always a fun read.

 

[Riptide]

Two 2nd's for Polak and Spaling. Crazy over payment. We could be in for trouble if that's the cost of a minor upgrade.

Price also likely went up as they're future picks vs 2016 ones. But yeah in general that's insane.

 

[#66]

Agreed. We are seeing that benefit on defense, but it sure would be nice to see it up front. I guess we technically are with Wilson, Rust, and co, but we need more Sprong upsides in the pipeline.

Yeah... Last years draft was big. Sprong Simon and hoping Tiff can be a Hagelin clone.

 

[Riptide]

I think all 30 GM's have to let him back in first(ok it) or something.

Certainly weird though as his team is heading into game 2 of the 1st round of the playoffs.
He played 26 minutes in game one.

Correct. For him to come back before he's 35 (he's 33 now?) he would need all 30 GMs to sign off on it.

So it would appear it's just the Devil's that have to ok it.

Only if he sits for an entire season of pro hockey and doesn't play.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

And why wouldn't they be? I think for the Penguins it will come down to price.

The only way I can see the Pens getting Ladd is for the Jets to ask for the moon and have all other teams say no and go for other targets and get them. Then the Pens come in and offer something less and force them to take it.

Highly unlikely but...you never know. I just hope they are not so in love with him that they get into a bidding war and we lose Pouliot, Sprong, or Murray.

Jets would also have to be okay with taking back a couple contracts.

Well, if we look at it logically, the Jets won't insist on Murray I don't think (Hellebuyck seems like a legit No. 1, plus they have Comrie in the AHL and two NHLers as well). Pouliot would likely be their target, me thinks, since they are better on the right side than the left side on defense. Then again, they do have to make room soon for Joshua Morrissey, one would think.

The Jets have two fairly interesting right D prospects in Jan Kostalek and Jack Glover. If we sent Pouliot and Kunitz to Wpg for Ladd and one of those two prospects, I would like that. Hate trading Pouliot but the LW swap for me would be worth it.

 

[Shady Machine]

Well, if we look at it logically, the Jets won't insist on Murray I don't think (Hellebuyck seems like a legit No. 1, plus they have Comrie in the AHL and two NHLers as well). Pouliot would likely be their target, me thinks, since they are better on the right side than the left side on defense. Then again, they do have to make room soon for Joshua Morrissey, one would think.

The Jets have two fairly interesting right D prospects in Jan Kostalek and Jack Glover. If we sent Pouliot and Kunitz to Wpg for Ladd and one of those two prospects, I would like that. Hate trading Pouliot but the LW swap for me would be worth it.

Sure we could do that, but then we'd need to replace Pouliot's spot in the lineup for the playoff run. It seems too difficult to pull off.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm quite confident that Murray, Pouliot, Sprong, Bennett and both 2nd rounders will be safe at this deadline. I'm concerned they'll do something stupid like Jarry for McGinn or something else with one of Sundqvist, Jarry, Wilson or someone like that.

 

[Shady Machine]

I'm quite confident that Murray, Pouliot, Sprong, Bennett and both 2nd rounders will be safe at this deadline. I'm concerned they'll do something stupid like Jarry for McGinn or something else with one of Sundqvist, Jarry, Wilson or someone like that.

I think one 2nd is in play in the right deal. Bennett possibly as well if JR can get actual value from him in a trade. Pouliot, Murray, Sprong should be safe.

 

[PensandCaps]

I'm quite confident that Murray, Pouliot, Sprong, Bennett and both 2nd rounders will be safe at this deadline. I'm concerned they'll do something stupid like Jarry for McGinn or something else with one of Sundqvist, Jarry, Wilson or someone like that.

Wouldnt mind a jarry for mcginn + trade. At all.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

I have no problem throwing in a Wilson, Sheary, Rust or Kuhnhackl in any deal. Those guys are just depth players. If some other team saw something they liked during their time up with the team lately, great.

Otherwise, Kunitz, Bonino, Cole should be in play. If it's something bigger, I wouldn't have a problem including names like Daley, Fehr and Hagelin.

Also, the two prospects we can dangle are Jake Guentzel and Theodor Blueger.

Are those assets enough to get what we need? Highly unlikely.

EDIT: I forgot Plotnikov...I assume JR will ask any team he's dealing with to take him for cap/roster purposes.

 

[UnderratedBrooks44]

Wouldnt mind a jarry for mcginn + trade. At all.

Why would Buffalo add?

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think one 2nd is in play in the right deal. Bennett possibly as well if JR can get actual value from him in a trade. Pouliot, Murray, Sprong should be safe.

The reason I think Bennett is safe is because of an article from yesterday that had JR praising Bennett and seeming to not want to move him. Then again, wasn't there an article that said Kapanen may be a top-6 forward for us this year right before he was traded for Kessel?

Wouldnt mind a jarry for mcginn + trade. At all.

That would be awful to trade a good prospect for a pure rental.

 

[MrBurghundy]

I'd be leery on trading Wilson just yet. He's a LW prospect that was leading the AHL in goal scoring before his call-up, and he seems to be coming on a bit here. I'm not just speaking about he goals he's scored either. He may never amount to much at this level, but we don't exactly have guys like that growing in trees at the moment. I'd be ok with trading him too, but it would have to be for the right return.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'd be leery on trading Wilson just yet. He's a LW prospect that was leading the AHL in goal scoring before his call-up, and he seems to be coming on a bit here. I'm not just speaking about he goals he's scored either. He may never amount to much at this level, but we don't exactly have guys like that growing in trees at the moment. I'd be ok with trading him too, but it would have to be for the right return.

I don't know what to expect with Wilson. I don't think he'll become a top-6 scorer like he is/was in the AHL. However, at the same point, I wouldn't be surprised for him to develop into a suitable tweener that could be a good 3rd wheel in the top-6. I don't know why, but I keep thinking of Marchand minus the nastiness any time I watch Wilson.

Also this:

 

[MrBurghundy]

I really have little to no interest in Boedker after learning of his inability to play LW (allegedly), and trouble scoring 5v5.

As for Wilson, I'm not sure I expect him to be a top-6 player yet either, but it's too early to tell one way or the other. With our LW prospect depth being virtually non-existent, I'd want to hang onto him for a bit longer.