If you're Matthews and Marner's agent it would be negligent not to advise them to become RFA's

[King In The North]

On Matthews, my god. Everyone talks about his shot but some of Marner's passes on the powerplay are real hard. Just to receive and keep that puck down and not bounce off the stick is amazing.

 

[bionic]

If there is a team willing to pay Nylander over 8 million a year then I would gladly take the 1-2-3 round picks from them because judging from that move they would probably end up being pretty high picks

 

[razkaz]

Hot damn. If tenuous rationalizations to justify negativity were an energy source HF could fuel the 3rd world.

"Tee hee, sucks to be you guys, your team might end up with three of the top 15 forwards in the game, suckers!"

Think you got it wrong bud. Leafs end up paying 15 mil for Matthews, Marner, Nylander each but individually they are not good enough to be considered top 50 fwds

 

[NoName]

I would be shocked if any GM gives up the compensatory draft picks required to pry either out of Toronto.

What is more likely is that a GM would inform Toronto that he is planning on extending an offer that Toronto cannot match. Then the GM and Toronto would negotiate a trade of Matthews or Marner in exchange for mostly roster players and prospects which Toronto would be more interested in than straight up picks. That's supposedly what happened with Saad in Chicago.

Ideally for Toronto, they keep both with no problems. But if something were to go down, I would guess it's a threat of an offersheet to try to force them into a trade rather than outright signing and giving up something like 4 1st round picks.

I could potentially see that, but the issue then would be that Dubas calls said GMs bluff and says go ahead and offersheet Marner (Matthews is the face of the franchise and looks like he could be the 2nd best centre of the generation; the Leafs are keeping him at all costs) and we will take the 4 first rounders. Said GM would like balk at obliterating their prospect pool for the next half decade to overpay Marner.

Saad made sense because the cost of the offersheet in picks was not so obviously prohibitive. This is why if anyone gets offer-sheeted from the Leafs (or a trade is forced under threat of an offer-sheet) I would bet it is Nylander because he is seen as the most expendable (a talented winger on Matthews’ line) and likely can be had for $8 million and a more reasonable compensation package.

 

[4thline]

Got it. Nylander isn’t that good, is essentially what you’re saying. Noted for future arguments with TML fans

Can’t have it both ways

Is Ehlers "not that good"? Larkin? Pastrnak?
Have fun arguing against the shadows that say he's proven ppg player and should be paid like one.

 

[4thline]

A GM owes it to his owner to do that and an owner owes it to the team's fans.

Lol yup, a team owes it to themselves to cripple their cap structure AND gut their future at the same time.

 

[Dustin]

Think you got it wrong bud. Leafs end up paying 15 mil for Matthews, Marner, Nylander each but individually they are not good enough to be considered top 50 fwds

And this is exactly why this thread exists. It isn't some "real" discussion on how top end teams manage cap or player personnel. In the dreams of the people posting in here, the Leafs end up having to over pay their best players and yet somehow said best players are not good anymore.

This entire thread is hypothetical so I'll do my stupid hypothetical post. Well the Leafs win the cup this year obviously because as stated we have players wanting max returns. We trade several because unfortunately the cap is not big enough but what we get back is even better than what we gave up and they are all on ELC for 3 years so the Leafs win 3 more cups. Rinse and repeat. Oh the league changes its name to the TMLHL and all teams at the beginning of each game have to come out a take shots on their nets in Leafs Jerseys.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

Nobody is getting offer sheeted. But what I don't get is why GMs see them as a dick move. An RFA and a UFA are both free agents. Only difference is one comes with conditions. But neither has a contract with the team they last played for.

 

[Thorton02]

Matthews & Marner are going to get paid. The only question is whether they take Toronto to the cleaners. I can't imagine Matthews will ask for a max contract, but I bet he asks for what McDavid is making. Marner will get 9-10 million/year.

 

[NoName]

Matthews will probably ask for north of 11 million, and Marner will ask for north of 10.

Marner would have to put up insane numbers to justify that. Again, if someone wants to extend an offersheet "north of $10 million" for Marner that would cost them 4 first round picks as compensation for Toronto, unless Marner puts up out-of-this world numbers this season, there is no way any team destroyes their talent pool for the next half-decade to offersheet him. This is why franchise level RFAs virtually never get offersheeted in today's NHL.
Given said offersheet is extremely unlikely, why would the Leafs pay Marner that amount unless his production actually justifies it? If Marner demands way more then his actual market value, then the Leafs can just sit and wait, like they are with Nylander and call the bluff. If Marner does somehow take a massive step forward and put up say 90 points then yeah, he is worth $10 million+, and the Leafs will pay him that and probably let other guys walk to fit him in under the cap (Gardiner for start and maybe even trading Nylander), but if he is that guy then you are talking about a top-10 (possibly top-5) scorer in the NHL. You don't want to let someone like that walk, and stacking him with two other top 10 scorers (Matthews and Tavares) ensures that Leafs forward group is the deadliest in the NHL for the next 5 years, minimum. Of course, the odds of Marner becoming that player are not high. He could quite possibly crack 70 or 75 points this year and look for Draisaitl money but justifying $10 million is very unlikely.

 

[NoName]

Matthews & Marner are going to get paid. The only question is whether they take Toronto to the cleaners. I can't imagine Matthews will ask for a max contract, but I bet he asks for what McDavid is making. Marner will get 9-10 million/year.

I find it strange how when it comes to Toronto fans from other teams always expect the value of their young stars next contract to be several million per season above their comparables from other teams, and yet those fans from other teams say neither Marner or Nylander manage to get that elite first-pairing dman Toronto needs in a trade.

Very strange, how Toronto's players seem to be so much more valuble when it comes to contract negotiations then when it comes to trade negotiations.

 

[zharkenby]

Is Ehlers "not that good"? Larkin? Pastrnak?
Have fun arguing against the shadows that say he's proven ppg player and should be paid like one.

Have fun losing a great young hockey player

 

[LeafsNation75]

Since Kypreos reported it then it is 100% not happening. Can’t believe people actually listen to that clown

This was the same Nick Kypreos who reported that Mark Hunter was the favorite to become the next Leafs GM instead of Kyle Dubas. That right there is one major example why he is never to be trusted when it comes to inside information about the Leafs and the contract talks of Matthews and Marner.

 

[4thline]

Have fun losing a great young hockey player

He plays for us or we get a return commensurate with said great young hockey player.

Shucks. I hate win win scenarios.

 

[LeafsNation75]

The situation was different. The Oilers signed McDavid well before he was to become a RFA. They took care of that well before it could get to an offer sheet.

At that same time the media also reported that because the Oilers were busy trying to re-sign McDavid at the first chance they could to his new contract extension, they also said other teams would consider giving an offer sheet to Leon Draisaitl. Obviously we know that never happened despite them claiming the threat of the offer sheet was very much a possibility.

 

[LeafFever]

This was the same Nick Kypreos who reported that Mark Hunter was the favorite to the next Leafs GM instead of Kyle Dubas. That right there is one major example why he is never to be trusted when it comes to inside information about the Leafs and the contract talks of Matthews and Marner.

Oh yes, the Mark Hunter hype. I think theWinterSoldier linked that Hunter article from Kypreos a dozen times.
Hunter's phone still hasn't rang.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Teams will deal their first rounders next year. They are automatically out of the running for offer sheets.

 

[BAM]

First, Laine and Pettersson are wingers, so probably not as desirable targets for an offer sheet. Second, I'm not saying Matthews necessarily will be offer sheeted, just that it's foolish to think no team will even consider the possibility. Elite centers are prized pieces, and acquiring them is difficult. Toronto, having signed Tavares, is in a position where it will probably be difficult for them to keep all of their upcoming RFAs (at least with any kind of viable cap structure). Offer sheets are exceedingly rare, but the circumstances are more or less ideal for one. The odds are still much closer to 0 than 100, but I'd imagine much more likely than with the vast majority of RFAs

This thread says Marner and Matthews...so yes Laine is accurate. And lol...try telling Nucks fans that EP is a winger.

The problem with the offersheet issue is that Nylander is the Leafs 4th best offensive player at best, Matthews is the best offensive player and talent period. They'll match any offer for their best player and move pieces accordingly. Dubas this very offseason offloaded Martin to the Isles. Worse case scenario there will be takers for guys like Hyman or Brown if cap needs to be moved out.

 

[FourRings]

Matthews is the type of player you offer sheet. I don't think the other two are. With that being said, I think Matthews will take a discount to keep the team together.

 

[Dustin]

Nobody is getting offer sheeted. But what I don't get is why GMs see them as a dick move. An RFA and a UFA are both free agents. Only difference is one comes with conditions. But neither has a contract with the team they last played for.

Because managers and ownership are one group and players are another. Offer sheeting players gives the players leverage over negotiation, almost always increases the players total cap amount, which in turn helps raise all players cap amounts.

Furthermore if one GM can do it to another team, what's to stop a GM from doing it to your team?

For GM's it's a lose lose situation as you have to overpay to get the player and lose assets as well. It also doesn't help you with the negotiations of your players since you now overpayed for that player your cap space is less but your players now want more.

 

[zharkenby]

He plays for us or we get a return commensurate with said great young hockey player.

Shucks. I hate win win scenarios.

Yup. Losing a core player is a win win for sure. Never realized this guy was so expendable!!

 

[CamPopplestone]

The compensation really isn't very much. I am amazed they aren't used more.

That being said, Matthews will be too high for anyone to bother using one. Marner, maybe, but I could still see him coming in too high.

Nylander is the one here who makes sense. If you're a team with the room, offer him 5 years, 8 per. If he signs it, Leafs either match at a number they aren't comfortable with, or you get Nylander for a 1/2/3 picks.

But I just see Marner and Matthews being too high.

 

[Subway Schenn]

Hahahahaha.

So much for having the most explosive offense in the league!! The window has closed.

 

[Dustin]

Yup. Losing a core player is a win win for sure. Never realized this guy was so expendable!!

We'll just offer sheet Hischier. I mean I'm sure he can't wait to get out of that Mickey Mouse operation in New Jersey.

 

[4thline]

Yup. Losing a core player is a win win for sure. Never realized this guy was so expendable!!

Lose? Is he going to turn into dust or something?

[mod]