If Berube is fired, who would you like to see behind the Flyers bench?

[CSKA1974]

yr way too early to be arguing this angle
after a few years of the team being very bad maybe you have a legit point
the year after they were the worst team in the league they were right back in the top 5 of home attendance league wide
flyers fans are loyal to a fault

if they're both highly competitive in a few years, who cares?
does anybody really care now that the Blackhawks were being laughed at by everyone for the better part of a decade? Nope.

the sooner you accept that we are among the league weaklings this year, the easier it will be for you to deal with the reality

This season's mantra. Might as well be posted in the Flyers locker room

 

[CSKA1974]

Hockey Writers article

Fuel to the fire:

http://thehockeywriters.com/personnel-check-bad-coaching-decisions-hurting-flyers/

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

That's just... yeah...

 

[Legion of Gloom]

anyone but Terry Murray.
I propose a cardboard cutout of Babcock

Bill Barber

 

[Garbage Goal]

Just so full of Truthiness (in honour of Stephen Colbert's last show). I have exactly the same complaint about the nepotism that just reshuffles the same faces and populates teams and broadcast booths with retired players. I assume that part of the "ex NHLer" thought process – beyond your clear identification of perpetuating continued employment of retired fellow players – is that the coach gets a lot of camera time and faces daily questioning. There is probably some intimidation factor when a coach carries a CV of having been out on NHL ice. It's not a big factor, but probably part of the FOs' rationales.

I'd be thrilled if the Flyers looked past their own navels and targeted a non-NHL team system they liked, and aggressively pursued that team's coach. I don't care if he or she (wouldn't that be a kick in the pants?) is working in Europe, the CHL or the NCAA. I would solicit the agreement of Giroux to ensure that the team is committed to adopting a new system.

Unfortunately, though, teams don't commit nearly as many resources as you suggest to properly scout and vet potential head coaches.

My single biggest gripe with the NHL (and, frankly, a reason why I'm beginning to question my intense interest in the NHL) is the process by which coaches and GMs are hired. It's frighteningly inefficient and inadequate for a multi billion dollar entity. I mean for new talent, it comes down to "Are you a moderately well-spoken former NHLer who is seeking to get involved in coaching or management?" If the answer is yes, then you have a VERY good chance at being given a shot whether or not you deserve one. If you don't, you're not likely to ever find an opportunity no matter how well you understand the game.

There are diamonds in the rough in Europe, in the USHL, in the CHL, in college hockey...hell, there are probably diamonds in the rough coaching youth teams on the side. But there's minimal effort by NHL teams to scout this talent. I'd suggest there are plenty of Mike Babcocks out there who have comparable levels of knowledge with similar work ethics who bring new and exciting ideas to the NHL...but NHL teams just don't have a shred of desire to find them.

And why is that? Probably because coaches and GMs are cut from the same cloth. Picking someone fresh and unorthodox would be 1) risky and 2) bring a halt to the self perpetuating nature of the system. I'm not saying it's a conspiracy or anything, but there is an element of self preservation involved. In other words, why make the pool of candidates bigger when you're a beneficiary of having such a ludicrously small pool to begin with?

When I think too hard about it, it actually makes me sick how the system works. What did Laperierre ever do that qualified him to coach? Rick Tocchet? Martin Gelinas? The list is a mile long. Most asst. coaches in the NHL are recently retired players with absolutely no coaching experience. They'll be head coaches soon. And then everyone gets recycled, too. Rinse and repeat. This is the stuff that pisses me off most about the NHL. Craig Berube is obviously an unqualified, brute of a coach. I mean, can anyone wonder what his interview was like when he got hired? Think about that for a second. WTF was said in that room on that day? Is there any chance Berube impressed anyone with his brilliant coaching philosophy or new and innovative methods that hadn't been tried before?


Sorry for the rant, GG. It's not directed at you other than to just say I don't trust management to make a good choice here. I agree-- I don't want a retread. None of them are good. In fact, by definition, they're all proven failures. I want someone fresh who is not afraid to be unconventional and break from tradition. Someone who can say, "Why do I need to have a meathead on my fourth line?" or "Let's keep the best PP player in the NHL out for the full 2 minute PP" or "Hmm, are my big, shutdown defenders really shutting the opposition down or is it an illusion?" or "Should I be afraid of playing a rookie just because he's a rookie?" or "Is it true that some instances call for 'big and tough' players or is this a myth that's been passed down based on hockey tradition?", etc. (all very tame thoughts, too, imo).

I have no clue who that person is, but I know many people like that are out there. I want them to be found, but I have very, very little confidence that they will be. The NHL is just not looking for these people, yet. My hope and expectation, though, is that when the Dubas type managers in the NHL start running the show, we will see some teams dip into Europe and become a bit more liberal with these practices. At least, I hope so.


EDIT: Lol, I see you made a very similar post in the other thread, though, GG. Kudos.

Yeah I made the same statements you did (not as eloquently) and what I already did in another topic...or earlier in this topic. Whichever. Had a similar discussion with one or both of you too.

The NHL is full of nepotism and cronyism. Front office and coaching employments are mostly an insiders club and it's really silly. Sadly, that's never going to fully go away. None of the players have a reason to change that and, by extension, the league doesn't have a reason to either. They also just can't tell people who they can and can't hire (well, mostly).

Grabbing coaches from the AHL or one of the developmental leagues isn't as rare as you say though. Doesn't happen nearly enough, granted, but it does happen. Go through a list of the GM's and coaches in the league and there's a fair amount that never had much of, if any, playing career.

The hiring of guys like Dubas and bloggers for front office positions is a nice step that way too.

Either way, the point remains. I expect the Flyers to be able to and want to do that. If they don't then they aren't doing that part of their responsibilities up to snuff in my eyes. Which is the reality obviously.

I agree that it's made me less enamored with the NHL though, I feel you two there. If we're talking NHL retreads or NHL experienced guys (to be fair, I guess) they're mostly currently hired and I'm struggling to think of one good one that is not employed. I can think of guys like Tortorella but he doesn't fit the "good" prerequisite. Laviolette is probably one of the best NHL retreads around, funnily enough. Ken Hitchcock too I guess.

 

[Larry44]

seriously.

Scott Stevens.

and it took every ounce of strength to type that .

Where is Stevens coaching?

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Where is Stevens coaching?

Currently in his second year as an assistant with the Devils.

I rather have DoBoer if we're looking their way (if he gets canned).

 

[bennysflyers16]

If anyone has ever defended this loser at all, Google the Jets Defense tonight and then look what they did to the Bruins

Maurice has turned a below average defensive team into a team with insane possession numbers and team Defence.

Damn I wish they would fire him so they can start on next year already. Keeping Berube is disgusting.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

**** you Berube. **** you, **** you. **** YOU!

 

[Beef Invictus]

Fat Slob.

 

[Tripod]

Keeping him hired is all part of the master plan.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

We're going to be the Edmonton of the east soon because our internal management and coach are all buddy buddy. We're probably going to be seeing this for a long time.

 

[Cootsfanclub]

We're going to be the Edmonton of the east soon because our internal management and coach are all buddy buddy. We're probably going to be seeing this for a long time.

They've draft too well for that to happen.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

They've draft too well for that to happen.

Edmonton drafts really good players and look at how they are doing now.

With Berube, NAK, Sanheim, and Ghost will never be allowed to play because lack the "physical" element. Berube would cream his pants if he could have a 1st line of VdV-Umberger-Rinaldo.

 

[BernieParent]

Edmonton drafts really good players and look at how they are doing now.

With Berube, NAK, Sanheim, and Ghost will never be allowed to play because lack the "physical" element. Berube would cream his pants if he could have a 1st line of VdV-Umberger-Rinaldo.

Edmonton gets gifted the top player in the draft and then takes the rest of the draft off. Plus, they make poor trades and Edmonton is not an attractive UFA spot so the Oilers can't bring in a reasonable supporting cast.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

Berube would cream his pants if he could have a 1st line of VdV-Umberger-Rinaldo.

i'd say hes getting quite close to doing that..

after tonites game i bet Grossmann doesnt even miss a shift, let alone gets the bench for a game..

heaven forbid he should have to answer for his crap play...

 

[PALE PWNR]

I want a no-name coach out of the CHL or NCAA

 

[DeflatedFootball7]

Anyone on this board is a better coach then Berube and I really do think that.

Maybe bring in a European coach?

Try anything!

 

[Nizzle]

Fire Berube and replace him with Oleg Znarok. Hire Jere Lehtinen to fix the PK. I mean it can't get any worse.

 

[dats81]

Just select someone with no whatsoever connections to the Flyers, prefereably someone younger who knows how to win now with the way the play is evolving.
Sign him before the FA signings go down to have his opinion in what to look for.

 

[sharpeye97]

Gordon Bombay

 

[RJ8812*]

Just select someone with no whatsoever connections to the Flyers, prefereably someone younger who knows how to win now with the way the play is evolving.
Sign him before the FA signings go down to have his opinion in what to look for.

This team is not even built to win now, so that won't make a difference

 

[sharpeye97]

Or Kurt Russell

 

[Rebels57]

I'm going to puke if I have to watch Grossmann do this next season too..that is..continue to back in on the goalie on the rush and either screen him for a goal or deflect one in. He has no confidence in his one on one defending ability so he just backs up. He looks like a mens league defensemen.

 

[sharpeye97]

I wish we could resurrect Reggie Dunlop