Value of: If Arizona offersheets Matthews what do you do?

[Stephen]

The only reasonable thing would be for MLSE to let him walk, then buy the Arizona Coyotes and trade him back to Toronto for nothing, while pocketing the four first rounders.

I mean, the scenario is so implausible, the above solution is only slightly dumber.

 

[hbk]

They cheat to reach the cap floor. The organization owes more debt than value the entire franchise. Owner in every way, shape and form appears to be spending the bare minimum

The Coyotes have never cheated to hit the cap floor.

I'm assuming you are referring to them using cap space as trade currency to acquire other assets. At no time have they ever actually required those cap hits to hit the floor. It has never happened. Not once.

Quit spreading a false narrative.

 

[LeafFever]

The Coyotes have never cheated to hit the cap floor.

I'm assuming you are referring to them using cap space as trade currency to acquire other assets. At no time have they ever actually required those cap hits to hit the floor. It has never happened. Not once.

Quit spreading a false narrative.

False narrative? They don't actually spend the floor amount any year. They use LTIR and retired players' cap hits to reach the cap floor, but often pay little to no $ for it.

 

[hbk]

False narrative? They don't actually spend the floor amount any year. They use LTIR and retired players' cap hits to reach the cap floor, but often pay little to no $ for it.

They spend above the floor in players salary. They have every single season.

On a rebuilding team I have zero issue with this. Using cap space as an asset is fair game in the cba.

 

[Martin Skoula]

They spend above the floor in players salary. They have every single season.

On a rebuilding team I have zero issue with this. Using cap space as an asset is fair game in the cba.

Their most expensive possible (no Hossa or Bolland) on-ice 23-man roster this year is below the cap floor. The only thing putting them over is their IR, salary retention, and buyouts.

 

[hbk]

Their most expensive possible (no Hossa or Bolland) on-ice 23-man roster this year is below the cap floor. The only thing putting them over is their IR, salary retention, and buyouts.

Of course their IR is included in the calculations. Half their team is on IR. if you ignore the dead space acquisitions they are still above the cap floor. As they have been every year since cap was implemented.

 

[LeafFever]

They spend above the floor in players salary. They have every single season.

On a rebuilding team I have zero issue with this. Using cap space as an asset is fair game in the cba.

22 years? Seriously, there's been very little spending since they came to Arizona.
My point was correct. They can't afford to actually reach the cap floor in real money. That's why people question where the Matthews record contract comes from.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Of course their IR is included in the calculations. Half their team is on IR. if you ignore the dead space acquisitions they are still above the cap floor. As they have been every year since cap was implemented.

Not counting the BS contracts (Hossa and Bolland), even if every player was healthy and replaced the cheapest option at their position, the Coyotes would only be over the cap floor with retention and buyouts overages counted. If you don't count either of those and Hossa/Bolland, they're a couple hundred thousand under the cap floor.

The actual roster that is capable of playing a game in 2019 is below the cap floor.

 

[hbk]

22 years? Seriously, there's been very little spending since they came to Arizona.
My point was correct. They can't afford to actually reach the cap floor in real money. That's why people question where the Matthews record contract comes from.

They still pay players on IR.

If we want to talk about teams cheating the system I'm not sure the Leafs have a moral leg to stand here. Lupul's mysterious LTIR placement for example.

I have my own thoughts on Mathews. Chayka has indicated he is open to using offer sheets. Believe what you want. It all plays out in July.

Everything depends on what the new owner will want to do and if he wants to make a splash this is certainly an option. I don't believe AZ would be the only team interested either. But supposedly offer sheets don't happen so Leafs fans likely have nothing to worry about.

 

[Martin Skoula]

I did the math in another thread:

As per Cap Friendly:

Forwards: $23,894,166
Defense: $18,950,000
Goalies: $3,375,833
IR: $25,326,667 - Hossa and Bolland's deals = $14,551,667

Total: $60,771,666
On-Ice total: $46,219,999
Cap floor: $58,800,000

Assuming a healthy 23 man roster with Demers, Raanta, Grabner, Richardson, Schmaltz, and Dvorak back in the lineup, if we assume the player they're replacing is the cheapest player at their position, we get the following:

Forwards: $27,268, 647
Defense: $22,237,500
Goalies: $6,900,000

Total: $56,406, 147

The best case scenario without the Hossa/Bolland contracts, retention, and buyout overages is over 1.5 million under the cap floor for your most expensive possible 23-man roster that will actually be on the ice.

 

[LeafsNation75]

@hbk

You forgot that it was investigated and the Leafs were found to have done nothing wrong or illegal under the CBA. Plus Lupul had a history of injuries prior to his most recent one that got him placed on LTIR.

 

[Red Piller]

They still pay players on IR.

If we want to talk about teams cheating the system I'm not sure the Leafs have a moral leg to stand here. Lupul's mysterious LTIR placement for example.

I have my own thoughts on Mathews. Chayka has indicated he is open to using offer sheets. Believe what you want. It all plays out in July.

Everything depends on what the new owner will want to do and if he wants to make a splash this is certainly an option. I don't believe AZ would be the only team interested either. But supposedly offer sheets don't happen so Leafs fans likely have nothing to worry about.

Yeah I mean Nathan Horton is another good one. Robidas too. I guess it’s different when someone else does it though, it’s cheating then.

It makes perfect sense why Arizona would sheet him. Leaf fans are just scared of it actually happening so they need to go on the offensive and try to shut down the conversation.

 

[Red Piller]

You forgot that it was investigated and the Leafs were found to have done nothing wrong or illegal under the CBA. Plus Lupul had a history of injuries prior to his most recent one that got him placed on LTIR.

Right and neither did the yotes so wtf is your point besides you did exactly the same thing

Edit. Ahhh I get it now. Nice little thread you started on your board whining about this thread. Priceless.

 

[hbk]

I did the math in another thread:

As per Cap Friendly:

Forwards: $23,894,166
Defense: $18,950,000
Goalies: $3,375,833
IR: $25,326,667 - Hossa and Bolland's deals = $14,551,667

Total: $60,771,666
On-Ice total: $46,219,999
Cap floor: $58,800,000

Assuming a healthy 23 man roster with Demers, Raanta, Grabner, Richardson, Schmaltz, and Dvorak back in the lineup, if we assume the player they're replacing is the cheapest player at their position, we get the following:

Forwards: $27,268, 647
Defense: $22,237,500
Goalies: $6,900,000

Total: $56,406, 147

The best case scenario without the Hossa/Bolland contracts, retention, and buyout overages is over 1.5 million under the cap floor for your most expensive possible 23-man roster that will actually be on the ice.

Your math is incorrect.

Cap Friendly
Total cap hit: $72,953,910
Dead cap hits: $10,775,000 (Hosea and Bolland)
Smith Retention: $1,416,667
Ribeiro buyout: $1,944,444
Sub Total: $58,817,799

Cap Floor $58,800,000

Above the floor by $17,799

 

[Martin Skoula]

Your math is incorrect.

Cap Friendly
Total cap hit: $72,953,910
Dead cap hits: $10,775,000 (Hosea and Bolland)
Smith Retention: $1,416,667
Ribeiro buyout: $1,944,444
Sub Total: $58,817,799

Cap Floor $58,000,000

Above the floor by $817,799

When your IR is no longer injured, the players that are taking their place will be sent down or traded. Those cap hits are greater than 817k. Your most expensive possible on-ice 23-man roster is under the floor by 1.5 mil.

 

[hbk]

When your IR is no longer injured, the players that are taking their place will be sent down or traded. Those cap hits are greater than 817k. Your most expensive possible on-ice 23-man roster is under the floor by 1.5 mil.

So we are cheating the system by retaining salary on a trade. Ok I will admit you are right.

I will revise my statement to the team has never required dead contracts from non-active NHL players to reach the salary cap floor.

 

[drewjenks]

Again I'm only talking about if Arizona offersheets Matthews and the value is 4 1sts (any legitimate offersheet for Matthews will be 4 1sts)

Toronto's offer for McDavid could be something crazy like

4 1sts (remember those are Arizona unprotected 1st round picks)
2 1sts (from Toronto)
Sandin

Again I'm asking if Toronto should call Edmonton first before match Arizona offer, I have no idea what the offer would have to be with 6 1st round picks going one way (I'm just spit balling on the offer but the bulk of the value will be be Arizona 4 1sts).

For a team like Edmonton if they want to restart their rebuild but this time doing it properly this could be one hell of an offer

So Arizona (with an internal cap of $70,000,000) wants to....

- Pay one player $15,000,000 (21.5% of their cap).
- While hovering near the bottom of the standings.
- With zero first round picks for the next four years.


HOUSTON.



SAYS.



DO IT.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Right and neither did the yotes so wtf is your point besides you did exactly the same thing

Edit. Ahhh I get it now. Nice little thread you started on your board whining about this thread. Priceless.

At least by me posting that on the Leafs boards it's something they understand, unlike you or others who want to see Matthews leave Toronto. The truth you are and all those other people are jealous of the success the Leafs have had since the winning the draft lottery in 2016 and hate it when the Leafs are a winning team.

 

[Red Piller]

At least by me posting that on the Leafs boards it's something they understand, unlike you or others who want to see Matthews leave Toronto. The truth you are and all those other people are jealous of the success the Leafs have had since the winning the draft lottery in 2016 and hate it when the Leafs are a winning team.

I’m jealous of a sports team winning a draft lottery? Strange thing to be jealous about. Not once have I said I wanted to see him leave. You are obviously very triggered by this scenario but we are allowed to talk about it happening and if you don’t like that too f***ing bad, don’t read it.

 

[LeafsNation75]

I’m jealous of a sports team winning a draft lottery? Strange thing to be jealous about. Not once have I said I wanted to see him leave. You are obviously very triggered by this scenario but we are allowed to talk about it happening and if you don’t like that too ****ing bad, don’t read it.

So I'm also allowed to say on the Leafs boards (Not the National Hockey League Talk boards) that we are sick of these Matthews offer sheet threads about him going to the Coyotes, because it won't happen since the Coyotes won't have the money based on their constant problems and their owner wanting to sell them.

 

[Martin Skoula]

So we are cheating the system by retaining salary on a trade. Ok I will admit you are right.

I will revise my statement to the team has never required dead contracts from non-active NHL players to reach the salary cap floor.

It's not cheating the system, it's just embarrassing that you can't afford to ice a roster that's above the cap floor without resorting to on-paper transactions. Western teams get to beat up on a roster that isn't cap competitive while eating up their revenue sharing to barely stay afloat while absolutely hemorrhaging money. It's a strange and unnecessary experiment. The strangeness is really punctuated when some delusional people actually think that this organization can afford a 15+ million offer sheet on top of all that. You actually have to pay those, you know?

 

[Red Piller]

So I'm also allowed to say on the Leafs boards (Not the National Hockey League Talk boards) that we are sick of these Matthews offer sheet threads about him going to the Coyotes, because it won't happen since the Coyotes won't have the money based on their constant problems and their owner wanting to sell them.

Yes that is also correct.........

You can be sick of them all you want but boohoohoo

 

[Red Piller]

It’s more embarrassing that the richest team in the league hasn’t won a playoff round in 14 years and they spend to the cap.

 

[LeafsNation75]

It's not cheating the system, it's just embarrassing that you can't afford to ice a roster that's above the cap floor without resorting to on-paper transactions. Western teams get to beat up on a roster that isn't cap competitive while eating up their revenue sharing to barely stay afloat while absolutely hemorrhaging money. It's a strange and unnecessary experiment. The strangeness is really punctuated when some delusional people actually think that this organization can afford a 15+ million offer sheet on top of all that. You actually have to pay those, you know?

Since you brought up revenue sharing I'm sure a good amount of money the Coyotes get comes from the Leafs.

 

[LeafsNation75]

It’s more embarrassing that the richest team in the league hasn’t won a playoff round in 14 years and they spend to the cap.

You do know that it's not 14 consecutive years, because there was those seasons when the Leafs missed the playoffs and could not get a chance to win a playoff round.