Prospect Info: Hurricanes Prospect Info and Discussion - Part VII - Cliff Pu and other shit

[emptyNedder]

Trying to find any positive from this ugly night--Helvig continues to excel in the ECHL. Tonight he stopped 36 of 37. Last four starts 101 saves 5 goals.

 

[emptyNedder]

Canes Prospects are putting up strong seasons. Some of the highlights.

Nedeljkovic--1st in Wins and Games Played among all AHL goalies; 2nd in GAA for all goalies with more than 30 games.

Bean--1st in goals and scoring for defensemen under 21 in the AHL; 11th overall in scoring for d-men.

Necas--1st in assists and total points for all players under 20 in the AHL.

Helvig--3rd in GAA for all goalies with minimum 30 starts in ECHL.

Fox--3rd in scoring in the NCAA for defensemen; 1st in assists for d-men.

Cotton--4th in goals in the NCAA.

Mattheos--4th in goals and 5th in points in the WHL. (2nd in goals and 3rd in points for players under 20).

Luostarinen--tied for 6th in points for players under 21 in Liiga.

 

[DougieSmash]

Pretty hyped for Mattheos. Big fan of Luostarinen and Sellgren.

 

[emptyNedder]

Pretty hyped for Mattheos. Big fan of Luostarinen and Sellgren.

I was remiss in not including Sellgren.
He leads all under 21 SHL defensemen in scoring.

 

[AhoLottaLove]

Not sure if this has been discussed but Raleigh native and free agent Josh Wilkins leads Providence in scoring. Maybe there is a chance he signs with canes.

Josh Wilkins at eliteprospects.com

 

[DaveG]

I think it's pretty likely that we sign him to a contract after his season is done. We're only at 42 contracts currently and they're currently at #9 in Pairwise which means it's a fairly safe bet they make the tourney. FWIW Harvard's at 14 there which is the very definition of the living on the bubble.

 

[Drivebytrucker]

Canes Prospects are putting up strong seasons. Some of the highlights.

Nedeljkovic--1st in Wins and Games Played among all AHL goalies; 2nd in GAA for all goalies with more than 30 games.

59-19-3 in his last two season in the AHL. He has nothing to prove at the AHL Level. He'll be in Raleigh next year

 

[NotOpie]

59-19-3 in his last two season in the AHL. He has nothing to prove at the AHL Level. He'll be in Raleigh next year

That's my feeling as well. Like it or not, one of Mrazek or McElhinney will be gone next season.

 

[A Star is Burns]

Winning a lot of games doesn't have anything to do with nothing to prove. Even having great stats has nothing to do with it. It's whether they are comfortable with what they see from Ned translating to the NHL level next year while playing a meaningful number of games. I've said it before, but I would be wary of taking that risk. I'd try to sign the two guys we have, Mrazek 2-3 years, McElhinney for 1 if he'll take it. If Ned claims the job, awesome, McElhinney can be traded easily enough most likely. If not, I think it was determined that Ned can be sent down with no waivers.

 

[SaskCanesFan]

Winning a lot of games doesn't have anything to do with nothing to prove. Even having great stats has nothing to do with it. It's whether they are comfortable with what they see from Ned translating to the NHL level next year while playing a meaningful number of games. I've said it before, but I would be wary of taking that risk. I'd try to sign the two guys we have, Mrazek 2-3 years, McElhinney for 1 if he'll take it. If Ned claims the job, awesome, McElhinney can be traded easily enough most likely. If not, I think it was determined that Ned can be sent down with no waivers.

100%. You don't count on Ned to be anything more than a #3 that can be rotated in if there's injuries. If he lights things up you can move a guy like McBackup. But if he fails and you had him pencilled into a spot on the main roster, there's a good chance you just threw a season away.

 

[emptyNedder]

Winning a lot of games doesn't have anything to do with nothing to prove. Even having great stats has nothing to do with it. It's whether they are comfortable with what they see from Ned translating to the NHL level next year while playing a meaningful number of games.

I totally agree that Ned will have to replicate his success in the NHL before he is proven. However I hope the organization is beyond "comfortable with what they see." Statistics are much more predictive than human comfort level. While it used artistic hyperbole, the scene from Moneyball where the scouts are salivating over the "five-tool" kid who only every hit .220 is pretty close to the truth. Behavioral economics/psychology has clearly demonstrated that we all rely on biases, which lessen our ability to do our jobs. Ned's record in the AHL should have quite a bit to do with the opportunity he gets in the NHL.

 

[bleedgreen]

Doesn’t matter how many games the guy has won on the farm, he hasn’t proven a thing in the NHL.

To me he hasn’t looked any better than Justin Peters yet. He has had how many good games?

 

[Unsustainable]

Doesn’t matter how many games the guy has won on the farm, he hasn’t proven a thing in the NHL.

To me he hasn’t looked any better than Justin Peters yet. He has had how many good games?

He took us to victory in Vancouver.

Breakfasts come and go,
Hartford, the Whale, Beating Vancouver in Vancouver, that happens once in a lifetime.

 

[Incubajerks]

Geekie on a roll...i like it!

 

[NotOpie]

I'm not sure I understand the, "....hasn't proven anything yet at the NHL level". There's exactly 1 way to do that and it is to play at the NHL level. When forwards and defensemen at the AHL level grow and progress, they are often referred to as, "....done all he could do" at that level. I don't see how it would be different for a goaltender. At some point, we're going to have to give the kid his shot. My read is he's done what he needs to do at the AHL level and then, if/when he earns it in camp, you give him his shot.

I'm not opposed to signing the two we have and having a 3 way battle for the net in Raleigh and trading the odd man out could make sense....or you just waive him...if necessary. But I'm not sure that sends the right message either.

 

[Canes]

I just don't feel comfortable rolling with Mrazek/McElhinney and Nedeljkovic combo. If we brought in a proven starter and let Ned get 20-25 games, I'd be a lot more comfortable. As well as the Mrazek/McElhinney tandem has played this year, I don't have a lot of confidence in them replicating it next season due to goaltender volatility. We might not have much of a choice but to gamble on a combination of 2 of those 3 though.

 

[Cardiac Jerks]

He’s definitely ready to move up to the nhl level on the basis that he has nothing left to prove in the ahl. Whether or not he can hack it with the canes remains to be seen. I wouldn’t bank on him.

If we had a clear cut #1 goalie it would be much easier to work a rookie into the lineup and give him a few games here and there as you have a guy who can handle the bulk of the workload. While the platoon system is winning us games it makes it hard to bring Ned in.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Once concern with Ned is his size. It's not to say that size is everything in an NHL goalie, as Lundqvist and Quick are only 6'1", but there are very few starting NHL goalies under 6'2" and the "athletic but small goalie" isn't very prevalent in the NHL these days. Ned is listed as 5'11", 190 lbs on the Checker's website so he would be one of the smallest goalies in the NHL.

Khudobin and Halak are both 5'11" and has had some success in the NHL. Raanta is 6'0" and has had some success, etc... so it does not preclude Ned from being a successful NHL goalie, just that it's a disadvantage that he needs to overcome.

 

[DougieSmash]

Once concern with Ned is his size. It's not to say that size is everything in an NHL goalie, as Lundqvist and Quick are only 6'1", but there are very few starting NHL goalies under 6'2" and the "athletic but small goalie" isn't very prevalent in the NHL these days. Ned is listed as 5'11", 190 lbs on the Checker's website so he would be one of the smallest goalies in the NHL.

Khudobin and Halak are both 5'11" and has had some success in the NHL. Raanta is 6'0" and has had some success, etc... so it does not preclude Ned from being a successful NHL goalie, just that it's a disadvantage that he needs to overcome.

Binnington is fine.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Binnington is fine.

Maybe. He's 25 years old and has 23 NHL games to his resume. Maybe he will be fine, but 22 games this season isn't enough of a track record to say he's "fine" for a goalie.

Like I said, Ned's size doesn't PRECLUDE him from being an effective NHL goalie, just that he's bucking the trend and is at a disadvantage from a size POV. Clearly size isn't everything (as we saw from Darling).

 

[The Faulker 27]

Once concern with Ned is his size. It's not to say that size is everything in an NHL goalie, as Lundqvist and Quick are only 6'1", but there are very few starting NHL goalies under 6'2" and the "athletic but small goalie" isn't very prevalent in the NHL these days. Ned is listed as 5'11", 190 lbs on the Checker's website so he would be one of the smallest goalies in the NHL.

Khudobin and Halak are both 5'11" and has had some success in the NHL. Raanta is 6'0" and has had some success, etc... so it does not preclude Ned from being a successful NHL goalie, just that it's a disadvantage that he needs to overcome.

There was article on nhl.com concerning this very thing last year.

Shorter goalies find niche in what has become big man's position

Some other honorable mentions from the article: Jusse Saros, and Aaron Dell. Both backups.

I think Ned could be a good backup. I don't think he could steal the starting position. That seems to be a throne that may go unclaimed for another season or 2. Which is fine. As long as we're getting wins.

 

[A Star is Burns]

That's the problem with goalies. You only need two of them on the NHL roster. So, ideally to bring up someone in Ned's position, you want to have a starter you can rely on for 55-60 games at a minimum while they work themselves in. Or you want to be in a position where you aren't necessarily worried about competing. If you are in are position where you want to compete for the playoffs, it's tough to risk counting on Ned for any significant workload. The difference between forwards/dmen and goalies is a goalie can't really be sheltered as easily as a forward or a dman, and can more easily torpedo your season if they don't work out. And if a forward, like Necas this year, doesn't work out you usually have plenty of options to work with the replace them a la Saku, McKegg, Kuokkanen, Bishop, Roy that all got chances this year. You may have a tougher time finding an adequate replacement for Ned in season if he doesn't work out. That's why, to me, you have two proven guys, whether M&M or adding another vet to one of them, make sure one is on a short/tradeable deal, and let Ned steal it if worthy. Nothing left to prove at that level means nothing.

 

[HisIceness]

Eh, just have Ned build a wall around his net, make the NHL pay for it, and all will be well.

 

[emptyNedder]

That's why, to me, you have two proven guys, whether M&M or adding another vet to one of them, make sure one is on a short/tradeable deal, and let Ned steal it if worthy. Nothing left to prove at that level means nothing.

I think it makes sense to re-sign both Mrazek and McIlhinney. Ned can get several starts in October. If he is as good as I expect, then McIlhinney should be easy to move either through a trade or waiver claim. If Ned is so good he looks to be a #1, then you can try to move Mrazek and keep McIlhinney for 30 starts, which makes him perhaps the best backup in the league.

 

[Joe McGrath]

I think McBackup is going FA whether the Canes like it or not. And he damn well should. Whoever gives him the most total$ in a contract. This is his last one coming off an amazing year. Cash in one last time old man. If that’s not here, can’t blame him.