Pre-Game Talk: How Would You Like To See The Blues Use Their Three 1's?

How Do You Want The Blues To Handle Their Three 1st Round Picks?

  • Restock the pipeline - make selections at 10, 25, and 29

  • Make a pick at 10, trade 25 + 29 for immediate help

  • Trade all 3 picks to move up as high as they can

  • Make picks 10 and 25, trade back from 29 (see OP)

  • Make a pick at 10, trade 25 + 29 to move up as high as possible

  • Other (what?)


Results are only viewable after voting.

BadgersandBlues

Registered User
Jun 6, 2011
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1,184
It depends on what other teams are looking to do - I think we can be pretty competitive next year with our goalie and our forward core, but it's obviously our D that is lacking - so if we can move picks to package with some of our current dead weight cough Krug cough to make a major upgrade - then I say we go for it - if not, then just make all three picks, unless we love a guy who's at like say 15 and think the drop off between 15 and the guy we'd get at 23 is worth the extra pick at 29. Too many moving parts to decisively say, "This is exactly what I'd like to see happen."
 

BrokenFace

Registered User
Aug 15, 2010
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BPA with the 10th.
The later 2 need to be used on something that will bring us value for at least 3 years. That could mean drafting with them, trading them away for someone with 3+ years of control left, or using one to dump Krug. I'm hoping we draft at least 2 prospects with our 3 firsts and I would be fine with trading none of them away.
 

TurgPavs

Registered User
Jan 7, 2019
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Who outside of Snuggy and Dean is going to be a true impact NHLer? Guys like Loof, Buchinger, Bolduc etc. are dime a dozen. That level player can be had any off-season for like a third round pick.

And I don’t understand how I’m possibly selling the roster short by calling it bottom ten when we’re picking 10th because we’re a bottom ten team.
Wait we are already bailing on the 20 year old Bolduc?

How will history remember the Bolduc Draft Bust?
 

TurgPavs

Registered User
Jan 7, 2019
403
267
I would like to see them pick at #10, wouldnt be to upset if they traded down a couple of spots from 10. That 3rd tier of prospects pretty much goes from #9 - #21

Would also like to see them use 1 or 2 of the late 1sts in a package for Keller.
 

Xerloris

reckless optimism
Jun 9, 2015
7,138
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St.Louis
trade down enough times to see how many 7th rounders we can make from three firsts and two thirds. I'd venture to guess we could get 20-24 7th rounders out of those 5 picks.

Anyone who says they could get 25 or more 7th rounders is crazy! Fools.

I've always wondered what it would be like to trade all players and draft picks in exchange for every teams 1st round pick in like 2030. Could we end up with 20 1st round picks?
 

Brian39

Registered User
Apr 24, 2014
7,156
13,131
Wait we are already bailing on the 20 year old Bolduc?

How will history remember the Bolduc Draft Bust?
There are definitely warts to his game that could lead to him never sticking as an NHL player, but I completely agree with you that it is way too early to write him off. He's an average-sized prospect who scored 105 goals and 209 points in the 126 regular season junior games he's played since being drafted. Plus 19 goals and 31 points in 30 playoff games, a QMJHL championship and a Memorial Cup championship.

Junior production and success isn't a clear predictor of NHL players, but I think that it is written off as meaningless too often.

I would be very surprised if he got more than a cup of coffee in the NHL next year and he needs to round out his game in the AHL. But this notion that he clearly isn't an NHL prospect is getting a bit out of hand.

I've always wondered what it would be like to trade all players and draft picks in exchange for every teams 1st round pick in like 2030. Could we end up with 20 1st round picks?
Have you been watching me play NHL 22 at home?
 

Brian39

Registered User
Apr 24, 2014
7,156
13,131
I voted other for pretty much the same reason as @Majorityof1

I was tempted to vote for 'pick at 10 then trade the others for immediate help' but that doesn't really summarize my opinion. I want to use picks to trade for roster help. But I want that help to be guys that help for half a decade (or more), not just with an eye toward the next couple years. I'm also open to trading the 10th for the right kind of medium-to-long term roster guy. And as much as I want Army to be aggressively shopping these assets for a medium-to-long term D fix, I also don't at all believe that we should simply trade them for the best deal available by the end of the 1st round. If the right player or value isn't there, then just make the picks and try to trade some of your prospect pool strength in the future.
 

BrokenFace

Registered User
Aug 15, 2010
1,572
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STL
I've always wondered what it would be like to trade all players and draft picks in exchange for every teams 1st round pick in like 2030. Could we end up with 20 1st round picks?
In the NHL games you sign free agents, immediately trade them for future draft picks, package those picks for the top 3 picks overall in a given draft, let those franchise players get to RFA, let other teams sign them to huge contracts and accept the draft compensation, then trade more 1st round picks for those players back with the other teams retaining 50%.
 

Xerloris

reckless optimism
Jun 9, 2015
7,138
7,701
St.Louis
I voted other for pretty much the same reason as @Majorityof1

I was tempted to vote for 'pick at 10 then trade the others for immediate help' but that doesn't really summarize my opinion. I want to use picks to trade for roster help. But I want that help to be guys that help for half a decade (or more), not just with an eye toward the next couple years. I'm also open to trading the 10th for the right kind of medium-to-long term roster guy. And as much as I want Army to be aggressively shopping these assets for a medium-to-long term D fix, I also don't at all believe that we should simply trade them for the best deal available by the end of the 1st round. If the right player or value isn't there, then just make the picks and try to trade some of your prospect pool strength in the future.

Would K'Andre Miller be worth all 3 1sts? Would all 3 1sts get him?
 

67Blues

Got it for Bobby
Mar 22, 2013
4,551
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Section 111
trade down enough times to see how many 7th rounders we can make from three firsts and two thirds. I'd venture to guess we could get 20-24 7th rounders out of those 5 picks.

Anyone who says they could get 25 or more 7th rounders is crazy! Fools.
I'm picturing all the teams getting up and leaving after the 6th round except for the Blues table. "And for the 7th round, the Blues have turned in their draft list and here they are. That concludes the 202x draft".
 

Hrkac Circus

Registered User
Dec 11, 2014
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Vienna, IL
As Majority of 1 mentioned above, it depends on how good the possible deal is. I voted all three picks because I’m skeptical any trades are going to be worth it. But if you could trade all three picks for the 2nd or 3rd overall I would leap at that.
 
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Xerloris

reckless optimism
Jun 9, 2015
7,138
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That feels like quite an overpayment. He is good, but he ain’t miro heiskanen. He’s basically younger Parayko.

I'll admit I only really saw him once Tarasenko was traded but he seemed very good in my very small sample size of watching.
 

PJJJP

Registered User
Dec 2, 2021
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As Majority of 1 mentioned above, it depends on how good the possible deal is. I voted all three picks because I’m skeptical any trades are going to be worth it. But if you could trade all three picks for the 2nd or 3rd overall I would leap at that.
There was an quote from Army saying he doubts trading all 3 picks would even get you to #5. Most likely it will only move you up a slot or two
 

Brian39

Registered User
Apr 24, 2014
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Would K'Andre Miller be worth all 3 1sts? Would all 3 1sts get him?
I love the player, but that's a bit too much for me if we're not also shedding Krug in the deal. Acquiring Miller would demand that we shed salary, so using all of our 1st rounders without moving Krug creates a big issue.

That feels like quite an overpayment. He is good, but he ain’t miro heiskanen. He’s basically younger Parayko.
His 43 points (38 at even strength) is pretty well past Parayko's career highs of 35 (34 at even strength). His 162 hits this year is noticeably higher than Parayko's career high of 127 and he carries the puck much more than Parayko. I don't think he defends as well as peak Parayko, but his offensive skills and aggression levels are what everyone hoped Parayko would develop.
 

MissouriMook

Still just a Mook among men
Sponsor
Jul 4, 2014
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I love the player, but that's a bit too much for me if we're not also shedding Krug in the deal. Acquiring Miller would demand that we shed salary, so using all of our 1st rounders without moving Krug creates a big issue.


His 43 points (38 at even strength) is pretty well past Parayko's career highs of 35 (34 at even strength). His 162 hits this year is noticeably higher than Parayko's career high of 127 and he carries the puck much more than Parayko. I don't think he defends as well as peak Parayko, but his offensive skills and aggression levels are what everyone hoped Parayko would develop.
We can’t lose sight of the fact that he is their best LD by far and is not arbitration eligible. The flat cap means that the risk of an offer sheet is fairly low and, absent an offer sheet, he can accept a bridge deal, accept his qualifying offer or sit. He doesn’t have a lot of options and could do worse than signing a one or two year deal and cash in bigger when the cap goes up.
 
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TurgPavs

Registered User
Jan 7, 2019
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Why would waste 3 first round picks on signing Miller?
You can likely trade one or two first round picks and get a top pairing defensemen without PO another GM by signing a RFA.

Signing RFA....that always seems to work out well for the Blues.......
 

Brian39

Registered User
Apr 24, 2014
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We can’t lose sight of the fact that he is their best LD by far and is not arbitration eligible. The flat cap means that the risk of an offer sheet is fairly low and, absent an offer sheet, he can accept a bridge deal, accept his qualifying offer or sit. He doesn’t have a lot of options and could do worse than signing a one or two year deal and cash in bigger when the cap goes up.
For all the reasons you stated, I'd say there is about a 95% chance that he starts next season as a Ranger.

However, their cap situation in the short-to-medium term is pretty rough. Panarin, Zibby, Trocheck, Kreider and Trouba combine for $40.267M in 3+ year long cap commitments who currently have full NMCs. Fox is at $9.5M long term and isn't being moved. Shesterkkn is at $5.67M for 2 years and isn't being moved. That's $55.427M of cap on just 7 players that absolutely isn't going anywhere to make space for a Miller extension. Kreider and Trocheck's trade protection weakens in 2024/25 and 2025/26 respectively, but Shesterkin will be due a large raise in 2025/26. Goodrow is the most obvious candidate to shed some salary, but he has a 15 team no-trade list and his $3.6M cap hit for 4 more years probably makes him a negative-value asset.

If (and this is a big if) Miller is currently telling him that he will use every tool at his disposal to get a 5+ year long deal at $7M+ and won't accept anything less until days before the 12/1/23 deadline, then it would make sense for the Rangers to quietly see if a team blows them away with an offer. Signing him to such a deal (or matching an offer sheet like that) would require them to move at least 1 good asset out (either a player like Chytil/Lindgren or whatever it takes to move Goodrow). I think there are trade packages you can offer them to make it more appealing to let Miller walk than to keep Miller AND lose more stuff.

If Miller is content to sign a 2 or 3 year bridge and then cash in with a higher cap, then he will absolutely not be available. A 2 year bridge gets the Rangers through the worst of the trade protection they've given out and gives them time to move a genuinely big contract to fit his monster deal. Panarin's $11.6M and Trouba's $8M come off the books naturally in 3 years so a 3 year bridge would mean that they simply have to re-allocate that $19.6M with Miller getting a nice chunk.

Players signing offer sheets rarely happens, but I think that the threat of offer sheets, and RFA negotiations (without a signed offer sheet) impact negotiations more than people think. Let's say the Blues were offering the #10 overall, the #29 overall, and one of our 2023 3rds for MIller's rights at the moment. you can nudge them toward negotiating by telling them that we have every intention of calling Miller's agent on July 1st and offering $7M x 6 years. The compensation on that is our 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round picks in 2024. The trade offer we're making today is clearly better than the compensation unless the Blues truly bottom out and have a top 5 pick next year. If Miller's agent is currently telling the team that he won't even consider a bridge until talking to teams in July, then the Rangers have a decision to make: commit to doing what it takes to ensure that they can match such an offer in the summer or negotiate a trade right now. Such a scenario likely doesn't lead to an actual offer sheet, but the threat of one gives the player leverage.

Again, I think you are right that he has very little chance of wearing any other jersey next season. He very well might want to bet on himself to take another step as a player and get a $10M+ AAV in 2 years rather than locking in generational wealth but potentially leaving millions on the table right now. There are a lot of paths that leave Miller discussions fully moot, but until he signs or the Rangers start blocking Army's number, he shouldn't be off the table.

Why would waste 3 first round picks on signing Miller?
You can likely trade one or two first round picks and get a top pairing defensemen without PO another GM by signing a RFA.

Signing RFA....that always seems to work out well for the Blues.......
Like I said above, all 3 firsts is too rich for my blood.

However, the logic of paying more for Miller than trading less for a different to pair D is that he is the higher value asset than whichever other top pair guy you can plausibly acquire via trade. He has the greatest chance of being a true #1 D man of all the guys who are potentially available via trade. He's a 23 year old 6'5" D man who can skate very well and was just 12th among all NHL D in even strength scoring with positive underlying metrics despite an O-zone start rate of just 41% at 5 on5.
 

LetsGoBLUES91

Registered User
Jan 8, 2013
9,158
3,096
Make all three picks. We have one prospect with top six forward upside, one with top nine upside, and then a whole bunch of nothing along with no defensive prospects of note and a bottom ten roster. There’s no reason to go for a quick fix. Make all the picks. Trade roster players for even more picks if possible.

Well this is...crazy. Are you just forgetting guys?
 

LetsGoBooze

Buium or bust
Jan 16, 2012
2,308
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Make pick 10.
Trade pick 25 for a Dean like return, young player ready to make the leap, with plenty of control.
Trade pick 29 for two 2nds and make both picks.
 
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Xanadude

Registered User
Jun 12, 2018
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I'm more bullish on this roster than most.

Package 29 with Krug to trade to someone like NYI who need a PP quarterback,

Package 24 with other futures to try and pry a LHD partner for Faulk

Draft BPA at 10.

I'm down on the west in general. make those moves and I think we're a wild card team; literally anyone breaks out (neighbors, Hofer, Perunovich, Bolduc) and we could be looking at a contender.

Then again, I can see drafting all three to restock the pipeline being a decent call too. As bullish as I am on this roster, I trust our draft pedigree to get us three difference-makers.
 

hockeywiz542

Registered User
May 26, 2008
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25. Blues’ First Round Picks

St. Louis (25th and 29th Overall)


Scoop: We’ve reported on the availability of these picks, as it will be shocking if Blues GM Doug Armstrong is walking to the podium all three times in the first round on June 28 in Nashville. The Blues are looking to move the picks they got for Ryan O’Reilly and Vladimir Tarasenko in exchange for 25-year-old and younger players who can make an impact on their team with cost control.
 

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