How long will David Quinn be coach?

[Friday]

Interesting, I mean some lip service. Buts its like MG you built this team and coaching staff. When he gives them a stern talking to haha you're supposed to lose but dont lose as pathetically?

 

[sharski]

Randy: "Bah gawd that's Gerard Gallant's music!"

HCDQ: "Oh no... Not again..."

 

[Cas]

The way this dumpster fire is being ran right now the sharks might find themselves in a Quebec Nordiques/Lindros situation even if they get the #1 overall

If Celebrini wants to cost himself millions of dollars, sure.

Refusing to play for the team that drafts you, if you are a blue chip prospect, is an astonishingly stupid move. Someone like Celebrini debuts two to three years later, pushing his ELC back, probably pushing his first RFA contract back a year or two, and ensuring that his first UFA contract covers fewer prime years, all while absorbing greater risk of injury with zero compensation, and pissing off teams and potentially reducing your actual earnings due to your new reputation.

It will cost millions, because you shift prime years into past-prime years, and potentially costs everything (if he breaks his knee in a game against UMass, he never gets a contract; if he breaks his knee in a game against Anaheim, he at least has his ELC earnings, plus NHL health insurance).

It's not a realistic risk, any more than relocation or contraction are a risk. There's no reason to worry about it, and worrying about it is just about as meaningful as worrying about the sky falling.

 

[sharski]

Interesting, I mean some lip service. Buts its like MG you built this team and coaching staff. When he gives them a stern talking to haha you're supposed to lose but dont lose as pathetically?

In their GM search, I recall them saying they wanted someone who would be the face of the organization like DW often was

GMMG signed up for this and it especially makes sense for him to be front and center when the entire league is currently unified in calling your franchise a joke

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

If Celebrini wants to cost himself millions of dollars, sure.

Refusing to play for the team that drafts you, if you are a blue chip prospect, is an astonishingly stupid move. Someone like Celebrini debuts two to three years later, pushing his ELC back, probably pushing his first RFA contract back a year or two, and ensuring that his first UFA contract covers fewer prime years, all while absorbing greater risk of injury with zero compensation, and pissing off teams and potentially reducing your actual earnings due to your new reputation.

It will cost millions, because you shift prime years into past-prime years, and potentially costs everything (if he breaks his knee in a game against UMass, he never gets a contract; if he breaks his knee in a game against Anaheim, he at least has his ELC earnings, plus NHL health insurance).

It's not a realistic risk, any more than relocation or contraction are a risk. There's no reason to worry about it, and worrying about it is just about as meaningful as worrying about the sky falling.

I mean he’s not a generational talent so there’s that but he could just re-enters the draft after a few years

Interesting, I mean some lip service. Buts its like MG you built this team and coaching staff. When he gives them a stern talking to haha you're supposed to lose but dont lose as pathetically?

The dreaded team meeting, It’s not going to change anything this team is directionless right now

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

Pretty much the only coaches you'll be able to bring in with this debacle are other similar type desperate outcasts or complete unknowns, who I doubt would do any better.

I'd still love to bring in Ted Nolan for the circus aspect.

That would almost make the season pay per view worthy

 

[Cas]

I mean he’s not a generational talent so there’s that but he could just re-enters the draft after a few years

No, Celebrini would not reenter the draft - he remains Sharks property (in this example) until he leaves college in three years, then becomes a free agent in mid-August 2027.

He can then sign an ELC with any team, but he will be 21 and thus must sign a three year ELC. He does not have the option to burn a year. He becomes an RFA in summer 2030, at age 24. He is ineligible to become a UFA earlier than summer 2033.

Meanwhile, if Celebrini signs with the Sharks after his 24-25 season ends, he can burn a year and becomes an RFA in summer 2027 and potentially a UFA in summer 2032. Sign immediately after being drafted and he becomes a UFA in summer 2031, where he can sign for 7 years at ages 25-32, rather than 27-34. That should be worth several million dollars alone, plus he could sign another long-term contract earlier if he's still a good player and add even more millions (especially as he avoids the 35+ contract penalty).

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

No, Celebrini would not reenter the draft - he remains Sharks property (in this example) until he leaves college in three years, then becomes a free agent in mid-August 2027.

He can then sign an ELC with any team, but he will be 21 and thus must sign a three year ELC. He does not have the option to burn a year. He becomes an RFA in summer 2030, at age 24. He is ineligible to become a UFA earlier than summer 2033.

Meanwhile, if Celebrini signs with the Sharks after his 24-25 season ends, he can burn a year and becomes an RFA in summer 2027 and potentially a UFA in summer 2032. Sign immediately after being drafted and he becomes a UFA in summer 2031, where he can sign for 7 years at ages 25-32, rather than 27-34. That should be worth several million dollars alone, plus he could sign another long-term contract earlier if he's still a good player and add even more millions (especially as he avoids the 35+ contract penalty).

A player not signed by drafted team within two years can reenter draft, assuming they are still eligible, and if they are not eligible, will become unrestricted a free agent. A team has the rights of an NCAA player until 30 days after the player leaves the college.

So it’s dependent on when he leaves college

 

[coooldude]

You guys are way overreacting... this is a bad team, but we'll be a different team next year. High draft picks want to play in the league. SJ isn't nearly as toxic as some other franchises (Arizona, Winnipeg, CBJ, CGY, even TOR or MTL for some players).

There is next to zero chance that a player decides to try to skirt the team they're drafted to. People have been getting drafted to bad teams forever, and reporting. The examples you can think of, you can count on one hand (Lindros, Jagr, Michkov maybe).

 

[StanleyCup2035]

Interesting, I mean some lip service. Buts its like MG you built this team and coaching staff. When he gives them a stern talking to haha you're supposed to lose but dont lose as pathetically?

Hasso, most definitely, doesn't deserve better! He pushed out full re-build under Wilson, so now he gets it 5 years too late...Hope he embraces the suck for the next few years and negative cash flows. He can afford it. Bet he wasn't watching too many games anyway...

 

[landshark]

I think they have to graduate to get the "instant unrestricted free agent" badge.

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

You guys are way overreacting... this is a bad team, but we'll be a different team next year. High draft picks want to play in the league. SJ isn't nearly as toxic as some other franchises (Arizona, Winnipeg, CBJ, CGY, even TOR or MTL for some players).

There is next to zero chance that a player decides to try to skirt the team they're drafted to. People have been getting drafted to bad teams forever, and reporting. The examples you can think of, you can count on one hand (Lindros, Jagr, Michkov maybe).

And that kid from I think from Ottawa and then Ottawa redrafted him when he re-entered lol. Anyway this team is far worse than any of the handful of bad teams you mentioned it’s not an overreaction it’s a plausible possibility

 

[Cas]

A player not signed by drafted team within two years can reenter draft, assuming they are still eligible, and if they are not eligible, will become unrestricted a free agent. A team has the rights of an NCAA player until 30 days after the player leaves the college.

So it’s dependent on when he leaves college

Celebrini would not be eligible for the 2026 draft (too old), and he'd be stuck with the Sharks holding his rights until summer 2027 anyway.

The only way I can see around this is if he somehow quits college and goes to the WHL immediately after the draft, and I'm not sure that's even allowed or how the CBA would treat that. It probably would still delay his eligibility about as much, too, so no benefit to him.

It's just not a reasonable concern. If we draft Celebrini, he will be a Shark, guaranteed.

 

[coooldude]

And that kid from I think from Ottawa and then Ottawa redrafted him when he re-entered lol. Anyway this team is far worse than any of the handful of bad teams you mentioned it’s not an overreaction it’s a plausible possibility

This team is currently as bad, or worse, than many last-place teams, but this is not the worst situation that has existed to be drafted into even in the last 5 years. You added one example -- we now have 4 examples from the past, what, 30 years?

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

Celebrini would not be eligible for the 2026 draft (too old), and he'd be stuck with the Sharks holding his rights until summer 2027 anyway.

The only way I can see around this is if he somehow quits college and goes to the WHL immediately after the draft, and I'm not sure that's even allowed or how the CBA would treat that. It probably would still delay his eligibility about as much, too, so no benefit to him.

It's just not a reasonable concern. If we draft Celebrini, he will be a Shark, guaranteed.

I’d prefer Eiserman, Eklund needs someone who can finish his sweet passes

 

[gaucholoco3]

If Celebrini wants to cost himself millions of dollars, sure.

Refusing to play for the team that drafts you, if you are a blue chip prospect, is an astonishingly stupid move. Someone like Celebrini debuts two to three years later, pushing his ELC back, probably pushing his first RFA contract back a year or two, and ensuring that his first UFA contract covers fewer prime years, all while absorbing greater risk of injury with zero compensation, and pissing off teams and potentially reducing your actual earnings due to your new reputation.

It will cost millions, because you shift prime years into past-prime years, and potentially costs everything (if he breaks his knee in a game against UMass, he never gets a contract; if he breaks his knee in a game against Anaheim, he at least has his ELC earnings, plus NHL health insurance).

It's not a realistic risk, any more than relocation or contraction are a risk. There's no reason to worry about it, and worrying about it is just about as meaningful as worrying about the sky falling.

I don’t see why he wouldn’t sign with the sharks. His dad works for the Warriors and still lives locally. His younger brother 2012 birth year plays for the youth team in Dublin. He was born in Canada but has spent a significant part of his childhood in the Bay Area even playing for the Jr Sharks for a few years. The Sharks might be a shit show this year but they will have lots of cap space next year and even more the year after with multiple top 5 picks to show for it. With him coming into the team at the time he will he will be perfectly positioned to lead a team ready to compete for a decade.

He would be the absolute last player to refuse to sign with the Sharks.

 

[Cas]

I’d prefer Eiserman, Eklund needs someone who can finish his sweet passes

I don't really have the knowledge to actually pick between anyone, but I would say our top pick should be best available prospect, no other considerations. If Celebrini or Demidov or Levshunov are the best overall prospect, we pick them, even if we think Eiserman has the best shot but is weaker overall.

Never, ever, ever, ever make high draft picks based on team positional or skill set needs. First round picks should always be best available player, regardless of anything else. You can always move someone around, but you can't play a guy with the best shot in class if he can't skate at an NHL level.

 

[coooldude]

I don't really have the knowledge to actually pick between anyone, but I would say our top pick should be best available prospect, no other considerations. If Celebrini or Demidov or Levshunov are the best overall prospect, we pick them, even if we think Eiserman has the best shot but is weaker overall.

Never, ever, ever, ever make high draft picks based on team positional or skill set needs. First round picks should always be best available player, regardless of anything else. You can always move someone around, but you can't play a guy with the best shot in class if he can't skate at an NHL level.

I'm on board with this, I would just add that the entire draft class needs to make some sense, given the existing prospect pool.

Like -- almost certainly take the BPA in your first round, but if you take all scoring wingers, or too many D into an overloaded pipeline, that's probably a mistake. Our previous regime obviously picked too many "small forward who has a lot of skill and might be a big steal, or a big bust" forwards (Bordeleau, Eklund, Wiesblatt, Guschin), and now we're suffering for it. If there are two players who are in the same tier and it's really hard to distinguish between the two, then roster construction could play, alongside many other things (post-draft development, a specific attitude or characteristic you're looking for, hell, even family or geographical ties).

I suspect you agree with all this.

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

I don't really have the knowledge to actually pick between anyone, but I would say our top pick should be best available prospect, no other considerations. If Celebrini or Demidov or Levshunov are the best overall prospect, we pick them, even if we think Eiserman has the best shot but is weaker overall.

Never, ever, ever, ever make high draft picks based on team positional or skill set needs. First round picks should always be best available player, regardless of anything else. You can always move someone around, but you can't play a guy with the best shot in class if he can't skate at an NHL level.

Eiserman is being compared to Austin Matthews, granted being compared to vs being like are 2 entirely different things.

Either way besides needing a finisher they are going to need to find a #1 Dman Muk/Thrun are likely solid 3/4’s with spot duty at 2 but they aren’t #1’s

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

This team is currently as bad, or worse, than many last-place teams, but this is not the worst situation that has existed to be drafted into even in the last 5 years. You added one example -- we now have 4 examples from the past, what, 30 years?

This team is going to be the worst team in league history, and there won’t be a close second. In addition to that the franchise appears to be directionless, that’s a key ingredient to be missing in a rebuild

 

[Cas]

Eiserman is being compared to Austin Matthews, granted being compared to vs being like are 2 entirely different things.

Either way besides needing a finisher they are going to need to find a #1 Dman Muk/Thrun are likely solid 3/4’s with spot duty at 2 but they aren’t #1’s

This team needs literally everything, not a finisher and a 1D.

 

[fasterthanlight]

I love the outcome which is really all that matters. But it would be nice to see people being a bit more upset about the outcomes/sticking up for each other/etc.

 

[TheBigDrunkPanda]

This team needs literally everything, not a finisher and

I don’t know about that, as much as I dislike the overall majority of Griers moves he has picked up some decent bottom 6 forwards in Sturm and Zetturlund. Zetturlund looks like he could be a Draper/Maltby caliber 3/4 liner and he’s still young.

Kunin would be fine in the bottom 6 as well, the high end talent which is always difficult is going to be the issue

 

[Cas]

I don’t know about that, as much as I dislike the overall majority of Griers moves he has picked up some decent bottom 6 forwards in Sturm and Zetturlund. Zetturlund looks like he could be a Draper/Maltby caliber 3/4 liner and he’s still young.

Kunin would be fine in the bottom 6 as well, the high end talent which is always difficult is going to be the issue

We have three centers worth a damn in the farm system - Bordeleau, Bystedt, and Smith. Of those three, two likely top out as 3Cs and the other could wind up on the wing. Minimum 50% chance apiece the older two bust, somewhat lower for Smith but still viable.

We have four wingers worth a damn in the farm system - Gushchin, Lund, Musty, and Halttunen. None of them project as first liners, and all of them have greater than 50% chance of busting.

Defensemen worth a damn, we have four - Mukhamadullin, Thrun, Havelid, Cagnoni. 50% chance the first two bust, more than 50% for the latter two.

Everyone else is a lottery ticket, including all the goalies.

By role, we have:

F1 ("puck carriers") - Bystedt
F2 ("playmakers") - Bordeleau, Smith, Musty
F3 ("finishers") - Gushchin, Lund, Halttunen
Depth Fwds - Robins, Cardwell

Offensive Defs - Havelid, Cagnoni
Two-Way Defs - Mukhamadullin, Furlong
Defensive Defs - Thrun

Goalies - Chrona, Makiniemi, Romanov

At least half of these will bust entirely, half of the rest will disappoint. We might get one depth player out of the guys not mentioned. If everything goes well, we get one impact player and two reasonably good players out of this entire bunch. Applied to the whole farm system, one impact player (like Meier or Kane or good Vlasic), two middle of the lineup guys (like Donskoi and Braun), one to two decent depth guys (like Goodrow and Dillon).

They will be added to a hopeful roster of impactful Eklund and Hertl (aging out of being impactful), Couture (now a middle of the lineup guy if not depth or worse), and maybe a couple of depth guys.

This team needs literally everything to be added to the farm system, and we start looking at filling specific roles (like some more finishers or offensive defensemen) later. Just pick BPA and don't try to overthink things. I'd rather pick someone who is a carbon-copy of our best prospect than someone who "fills a specific need" but projects to be a full step below at his peak.

I do also agree that, after the high picks, we should be trying to spread our picks around various roles and positions, so that if we do get hits on our lottery tickets they will hopefully not be concentrated in one area. Ultimately, though, this won't be much of a concern - hitting on two forwards with similar skillsets drafted after pick #100, and not a forward and a defenseman, is just fine.

 

[exchequer]

Just read the article from Sheng re the MG meeting. The org has no clue how to fix this other than to compete more and compete harder. As overrated as Ferraro is, the guy competes - and he’s one of many who have been competing and are willing to compete.

The team is just flat out bad and it shouldn’t be surprising there will be at least one or two 10-1 drubbings this year. Odds are it doesn’t happen back to back but it certainly can happen.