Speculation: How far away from competing for a Cup are the Hawks exactly?

ChiHawks10

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Jul 7, 2009
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Was reading a Lazarus article (or part of as I don’t have a subscription) and he states that if Seabrook retires earlynit will have dire consequences for the Hawks. That cannot be true. That is for the Keith like contracts signed before this CBA is t it?

Even more reason to not read Laz. He's a f***ing meatball. Seabs contract has zero repercussions on the Hawks. It's not a recapture deal. It would simply be the Hawks owing him the money, and nothing more. They'd be paying someone that isn't playing for the team anymore, but it has nothing to do with the cap.
 

RayP

Tf
Jan 12, 2011
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Adding one of Hughes or Kakko as well as Panarin or Stone would absolutely make this team a playoff team.

Not sold on that yet. Not with this defense getting another year older and no prospects coming to help out next year.

They’d compete for a 7-8 seed at best IMO.
 

RayP

Tf
Jan 12, 2011
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This is a total unknown.

People have way too high of expectations for defensive prospects as raw and young as these guys are.

Who steps in and makes a huge positive impact next year?

All I am hoping for is improvement from Joker but he’s still not going to be anything better than a second pairing guy next year IMO.
 

ChiHawks10

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People have way too high of expectations for defensive prospects as raw and young as these guys are.

Who steps in and makes a huge positive impact next year?

All I am hoping for is improvement from Joker but he’s still not going to be anything better than a second pairing guy next year IMO.

Mitchell is likely playing here next season...



So it seems that Denver announcer was full of shit.

Who knows what Boqvist looks like(I don't think it's likely he's on the team, but it's possible.)

Another development year from Joker.

There are reasons to be optimistic of the D. Again, they're unknowns at this point, though.
 

RayP

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Jan 12, 2011
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Mitchell is likely playing here next season...



Who knows what Boqvist looks like(I don't think it's likely he's on the team, but it's possible.)

Another development year from Joker.

There are reasons to be optimistic of the D. Again, they're unknowns at this point, though.


Expecting a guy to go from college to the NHL on the blue line and make a positive impact from his rookie season is a recipe for disaster.

I’m optimist about the D, more so than most, but not next year.
 

ChiHawks10

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Expecting a guy to go from college to the NHL on the blue line and make a positive impact from his rookie season is a recipe for disaster.

I’m optimist about the D, more so than most, but not next year.

Why? He's more mature/developed than the junior prospects. And just about everyone I've seen has said that Mitchell is NHL ready. So why is it a recipe for disaster to expect him to, at the very least, make a positive impact? Joker has made a positive impact, has he not? This D corps would be far worse without him back there. Gus has actually done the same. Just look at the PP. There are plenty of reasons to be optimistic, even for just next year.

And this is barring any kind of trade/FA moves in the offseason, also.
 

BK

"Goalie Apologist"
Feb 8, 2011
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People have way too high of expectations for defensive prospects as raw and young as these guys are.

Who steps in and makes a huge positive impact next year?

All I am hoping for is improvement from Joker but he’s still not going to be anything better than a second pairing guy next year IMO.

This is debatable.

I think it is reasonable to think Boqvist and Mitchell could be on the team next year. Like I have said multiple times, they will have really good moments but they will also have really rough moments. It will be a learning environment and the team will need to out score people.
 

RayP

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Jan 12, 2011
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I have to go back to work but I want to make a list of the current roster and who is likely to stay, list a replacement for who is likely to leave, and with that list then make a + or - note on who will he better vs worse next year.
 

ChiHawks10

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The West is garbage, they'd get in

:thumbu:

We can agree on that. Not sure how anyone could think that this team(after adding Panarin and Hughes/Kakko) wouldn't make the playoffs. They make everyone around them better, on top of what they are themselves.

Like I said in an earlier post. You're talking another 40-60 goals, and another 120-160+ points, IMO. That's a huge difference-maker on offense.
 

Robsker

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Nov 8, 2014
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:thumbu:

We can agree on that. Not sure how anyone could think that this team(after adding Panarin and Hughes/Kakko) wouldn't make the playoffs. They make everyone around them better, on top of what they are themselves.

Like I said in an earlier post. You're talking another 40-60 goals, and another 120-160+ points, IMO. That's a huge difference-maker on offense.

I agree - that is quite a difference. The Hawks would be much more potent offensively. If Delia rounds out and is an average goalie then with the reasonable notion that Strome, D-Cat, Joker, maybe Kahun and a few other young guys being incrementally better next year relative to this year --- making the playoffs in the West is quite doable. I would expect it actually.

But i would also expect that such a roster - in the absence of bringing in 1st pairing people (and, at what cost?) --- would make for a very early exit from the playoffs. Ultimately, far more often than not, the teams that make deep playoff runs do so more on the basis of lack of (or modest) weaknesses to exploit and not so much on strength of strengths. That is, one of Panarin or Stone and one of Kakko or Hughes would strengthen the Hawks strengths (as it were, while our forwards and not great by any means - they are the relative strength of the team). But it would not address the weakness that any playoff team that faces us will exploit.

My position has been - and remains - that something meaningful (like deep playoff runs) will be possible only once the blue line deficiencies are resolved, and no sooner. Panarin or Stone and one of Kakko or Hughes --- their addition would help - but is that the best expenditure of resources? Tough to say.

But you are correct, I'd think, the addition of two of these you mentioned makes us playoff caliber. it is just that a roster loaded up at forward but with unaddressed D problems is going nowhere --- even if they get 4 extra games.
 

ChiHawks10

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I agree - that is quite a difference. The Hawks would be much more potent offensively. If Delia rounds out and is an average goalie then with the reasonable notion that Strome, D-Cat, Joker, maybe Kahun and a few other young guys being incrementally better next year relative to this year --- making the playoffs in the West is quite doable. I would expect it actually.

But i would also expect that such a roster - in the absence of bringing in 1st pairing people (and, at what cost?) --- would make for a very early exit from the playoffs. Ultimately, far more often than not, the teams that make deep playoff runs do so more on the basis of lack of (or modest) weaknesses to exploit and not so much on strength of strengths. That is, one of Panarin or Stone and one of Kakko or Hughes would strengthen the Hawks strengths (as it were, while our forwards and not great by any means - they are the relative strength of the team). But it would not address the weakness that any playoff team that faces us will exploit.

My position has been - and remains - that something meaningful (like deep playoff runs) will be possible only once the blue line deficiencies are resolved, and no sooner. Panarin or Stone and one of Kakko or Hughes --- their addition would help - but is that the best expenditure of resources? Tough to say.

But you are correct, I'd think, the addition of two of these you mentioned makes us playoff caliber. it is just that a roster loaded up at forward but with unaddressed D problems is going nowhere --- even if they get 4 extra games.

It's not all on just the blue line, though. The team defense as a whole can benefit from good two way players. Which is why I'm more inclined to bring in Stone over Panarin. And draft whichever of the two Kakko/Hughes is the more defensively responsible player.

This team misses a Hossa to go with Toews. An absolute beast on D, as well as the PK, and a dynamic offensive player at the same time. Improve the team D, and the actual D Corps isn't nearly as big a weakness, as they have forwards to help them. These young guys on the team are just growing into those roles, so we'll see what we have in some of them after this season, heading into next.
 
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Robsker

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Nov 8, 2014
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It's not all on just the blue line, though. The team defense as a whole can benefit from good two way players. Which is why I'm more inclined to bring in Stone over Panarin. And draft whichever of the two Kakko/Hughes is the more defensively responsible player.

This team misses a Hossa to go with Toews. An absolute beast on D, as well as the PK, and a dynamic offensive player at the same time. Improve the team D, and the actual D Corps isn't nearly as big a weakness, as they have forwards to help them. These young guys on the team are just growing into those roles, so we'll see what we have in some of the after this season, heading into next.

Great post! I agree entirely. Stone every day over Panarin (as much as i like Panarin and find him fun to watch). Stone is clearly more the 200 foot player. Regarding Kakko vs. Hughes --- I agree, take the more rounded, more ready player --- I have no idea which one that is though.

Yes, contribution to team D by forwards helps - but new bodies on D are still needed.
 

Robsker

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Nov 8, 2014
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It's not all on just the blue line, though. The team defense as a whole can benefit from good two way players. Which is why I'm more inclined to bring in Stone over Panarin. And draft whichever of the two Kakko/Hughes is the more defensively responsible player.

This team misses a Hossa to go with Toews. An absolute beast on D, as well as the PK, and a dynamic offensive player at the same time. Improve the team D, and the actual D Corps isn't nearly as big a weakness, as they have forwards to help them. These young guys on the team are just growing into those roles, so we'll see what we have in some of the after this season, heading into next.

You are so right about missing Hossa --- anyone would miss a 1st ballot HOF guy like that. Finding another Hossa-like guy in the entire league would be challenging! Hoss was awesome - he contributed to past Hawks success much more so than many appreciate.
 
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ChiHawks10

Registered User
Jul 7, 2009
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You are so right about missing Hossa --- anyone would miss a 1st ballot HOF guy like that. Finding another Hossa-like guy in the entire league would be challenging! Hoss was awesome - he contributed to past Hawks success much more so than many appreciate.

My favorite player. I could argue that the Hawks don't win a single Cup without him. Maybe 1. He was that impactful on a game to game basis.
 

AmericanDream

Thank you Elon!
Oct 24, 2005
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Chicago Manitoba
This is a big reason I am optimistic that he can help out next season. A few defensemen have recently made the jump from NCAA to NHL and been successful.
they have, these kids coming out of college are really able to step in right away at the defensive position. the NCAA game works so much more on practice, training, and physical maturation over the CHL which is games after games..many of these kids jumping in to the NHL level only played 1 or 2 years of NCAA hockey and are doing just fine here. Mitchell should be no different as he is skilled as most of the recent jumps the past 2 years.
 

Pez68

Registered User
Mar 18, 2010
18,554
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Chicago, IL
I still don't think you can properly gauge where the Hawks are until next season.

1) They are trying to change systems mid-season. This is extremely difficult to do. Especially for the guys that have been playing in the same systems for 10 years. We have already seen massive improvements on the power play, and breakouts. Their D are beginning to play more physically, and the compete level is higher across the board. This is going to be a long process.....
2) They have a ton of young players who are still developing their two-way games. Not to mention physically developing.
3) They have a bunch of newly acquired players, who are still getting accustomed to the culture, the systems, and their teammates(Strome, Perlini, Caggiula).
4) Still dead weight on this team, in Kruger, and Kunitz.

A better assessment of how far away they are happens a couple months into next season.
 

LDF

Registered User
Sep 28, 2016
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I still don't think you can properly gauge where the Hawks are until next season.

1) They are trying to change systems mid-season. This is extremely difficult to do. Especially for the guys that have been playing in the same systems for 10 years. We have already seen massive improvements on the power play, and breakouts. Their D are beginning to play more physically, and the compete level is higher across the board. This is going to be a long process.....
2) They have a ton of young players who are still developing their two-way games. Not to mention physically developing.
3) They have a bunch of newly acquired players, who are still getting accustomed to the culture, the systems, and their teammates(Strome, Perlini, Caggiula).

A better assessment of how far away they are happens a couple months into next season.
excellent point and a very true point.
 

x Tame Impala

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no ****, we have enough personalities here that it would work...can anyone build us a damn website or should I just go to GoDaddy??? lol....

we can do podcasts and interviews - entertaining off the wall **** as well...I would like to host a 1 hour show - American Dream Hour - where for the entire hour I talk about Jack Hughes...make it happen!!

I would seriously SERIOUSLY be all about this
 

x Tame Impala

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Aug 24, 2011
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I still don't think you can properly gauge where the Hawks are until next season.

1) They are trying to change systems mid-season. This is extremely difficult to do. Especially for the guys that have been playing in the same systems for 10 years. We have already seen massive improvements on the power play, and breakouts. Their D are beginning to play more physically, and the compete level is higher across the board. This is going to be a long process.....
2) They have a ton of young players who are still developing their two-way games. Not to mention physically developing.
3) They have a bunch of newly acquired players, who are still getting accustomed to the culture, the systems, and their teammates(Strome, Perlini, Caggiula).
4) Still dead weight on this team, in Kruger, and Kunitz.

A better assessment of how far away they are happens a couple months into next season.

I’d add that it’s almost impossible to gauge the team’s playoff contention status until after the draft+free agency. We haven’t even passed the trade deadline yet. There’s a real chance that one or more of Anisimov, Saad, or even Kieth aren’t on the team next year.

Even if my dream scenario of Hughes/Kakko + signing Panarin/Stone plays out though...the Hawks still need very good goaltending and the defensive pipeline has to mature and do it fast. A lot has to go right.

In the meantime I really hope that...

1) An entire camp+preseason with JC works wonders for the whole roster

2) Stan is 1000% done with the Kunitz/Manning type of signings. They are without question, absolutely terrible and give no benefits to the team going forward. No more of this signing guys for toughness, grit, and/or vet experience. These contracts are a waste of cap space and a roster spot. They need to never happen again.
 

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