Hall of Shame: Alex Mogilny Should be in HOF

[Fantomas]

Bernie Nicholls hockey statistics and profile at hockeydb.com

6th in nhl scoring in 1990, 4th in 1989, a 3rd 100 point season in 84-85. Yeah he was a '1 hit wonder' alright, 1 hit all the way up to 1209 points while actually being able to perform in the playoffs.

You're taking his numbers out of context. Look at the adjustments on hockey-reference, particularly the point shares. He had one big year with Gretzky and after that nowhere close to Mogilny.

As an example, Mogilny had roughly the same overall production in '93-94 in 66 games as Nicholls had in his 100-point season in 84-85 while playing a full schedule.

 

[streitz]

You're taking his numbers out of context. Look at the adjustments on hockey-reference, particularly the point shares. He had one big year with Gretzky and after that nowhere close to Mogilny.

Again this is the type of thing that's hard to explain to someone who looks at stats without having watched the games but I'll do my best.


Gretzky was a center.
Nicholls was a center.

He has 21 pp goals out of 150 points, chop those off and he still had 49 goals and 129 points.
I also don't care about adjusted points, that's a poor argument. What matters is scoring relative to his peers.


Not to mention Mogilny was pretty much useless in the playoffs, lucky for him he was on a stacked team where his 7 points in 23 games didn't matter and he ended up with a cup.

 

[Fantomas]

Maybe the HHOF should get a mulligan on all the 80s players they've admitted. McDonald, Federko, Gillies and many others were not great inductees, playing before the fall of the iron curtain and putting up inflated numbers in a very high scoring NHL.

Then Mogilny, as inconsistent as he is, arrives while the league improves. Has at least three seasons we can classify as elite and league scoring dip halfway through the 1990s so many don't even notice how solid he was in Jersey and with the Leafs. But the precedent was set, so unless the hall gets that mulligan so he should be an easy pick for the hall.

 

[Fantomas]

Again this is the type of thing that's hard to explain to someone who looks at stats without having watched the games but I'll do my best.


Gretzky was a center.
Nicholls was a center.

He has 21 pp goals out of 150 points, chop those off and he still had 49 goals and 129 points.
I also don't care about adjusted points, that's a poor argument. What matters is scoring relative to his peers.

It is very thoughtful of you to explain things to me, but if scoring relative to peers matters so much to you it is not clear why you think Nicholls compares to Mogilny at all.

Also - isn't "scoring relative to peers" established by looking at stats as well? Fill me in.

 

[streitz]

It is very thoughtful of you to explain things to me, but if scoring relative to peers matters so much to you it is not clear why you think Nicholls compares to Mogilny at all.

Also - isn't "scoring relative to peers" established by looking at stats as well? Fill me in.

How many top 10 finishes does Mogilny have?

I'm also well aware the answer isn't zero.

 

[streitz]

McDonald, Federko

I don't think either of those players belong in the HHOF, that being said Federko is better then Mogilny. McDonald is debatable but I'd take him since he didn't character have issues.



Gillies is a whole different skillset, guy was basically the #1 fighter while not looking out of place on the 1st line on a dynasty. I don't think he should be in either but hard to compare him to anyone else.

 

[Fantomas]

How many top 10 finishes does Mogilny have?

I'm also well aware the answer isn't zero.

Top 10 in what?

 

[Fantomas]

I don't think either of those players belong in the HHOF, that being said Federko is better then Mogilny.

By any serious statistical measurement he is not close to Mogilny.

Bernie Federko Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Alexander Mogilny Stats | Hockey-Reference.com

 

[streitz]

By any serious statistical measurement he is not close to Mogilny.

Bernie Federko Stats | Hockey-Reference.com
Alexander Mogilny Stats | Hockey-Reference.com

Wow, Federko has 15 more playoff points in 33 less games.


Such better.

 

[Fantomas]

Wow, Federko has 15 more playoff points in 33 less games.


Such better.

It is true that Mogilny was a serious playoff disappointment. But I think in full context of his era the numbers are better than they look.

 

[streitz]

It is true that Mogilny was a serious playoff disappointment. But I think in full context of his era the numbers are better than they look.

I wasn't aware being outscored by 35 year old Scott Stevens looks good but I guess we have all different standards for excellence.

 

[Fantomas]

I wasn't aware being outscored by 35 year old Scott Stevens looks good but I guess we have all different standards for excellence.

I didn't say Mogilny's playoff production is "good", but we're not comparing him to Conn Smythe trophy winners here.

 

[Vanzig]

There's seems to be a double standard in place. Cam Neely or Pavel Bure get sympathy, for lack of a better word, for being injured a lot of the time but for Mogilny that counts as a negative? While we're on the subject, Neely avoided the DPE altogether and played his entire career in a high scoring era but had less points/game than Alex who played through the heart of the dead puck. And Mogilny played like 300 more games and has a Cup. I don't want to make this a Mogilny vs. Neely thread but most people don't question Neely's spot in the HHOF but it seems Alex is more qualified.

My Best-Carey

There usually is a double standard on hockey forums, Usually people are afraid to stand up to guys/groups who have been on the board a long time or for whatever reason, but your NEELY and BURE post is absolutely correct. If you name a player that should be in HOF then some will argue “well he played in a high scoring era” (WELL SO DID A HELL OF ALOT OTHER PLAYERS IN HOF), I mean rick middleton, richard Martin, Steve larmer, Tom Barrasso, Alex Mogilny, Theo fleury they belong in HOF. MOGILNY played in 3 seasons of the “HIGH” scoring era (1992-93 - 1995-96). I don’t like to compare era’s but I still think he belongs!! NEELY is a good ol Canadian boy and bure was a Russian rock star, Mogilny was neither so I can see how “some” don’t think, but Mogilny WILL get in 1 day. I mean if (EDGAR LAPRADE, BOB GAINEY, PHIL HOUSLEY, GLENN ANDSERSON, CLARK GILLIES, BILL BARBER, STEVE SHUTT etc can get in??). Maybe IF Mogilny played on Montreal/Leafs IN HIS PRIME it be different.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

There usually is a double standard on hockey forums, Usually people are afraid to stand up to guys/groups who have been on the board a long time or for whatever reason,

are you kiddmg me? this board is nothing but hot takes, contrarians, and ppl looking to pick a fight.

 

[streitz]

There's seems to be a double standard in place. Cam Neely or Pavel Bure get sympathy, for lack of a better word, for being injured a lot of the time but for Mogilny that counts as a negative? While we're on the subject, Neely avoided the DPE altogether and played his entire career in a high scoring era but had less points/game than Alex who played through the heart of the dead puck. And Mogilny played like 300 more games and has a Cup. I don't want to make this a Mogilny vs. Neely thread but most people don't question Neely's spot in the HHOF but it seems Alex is more qualified.

My Best-Carey

Yeah Mogilny's 7 points in the postseason really lifted the devils to a cup.

 

[frisco]

Yeah Mogilny's 7 points in the postseason really lifted the devils to a cup.

Well, he was a late season acquisition and never really fit that edition of the Devils. That being said, I'm sure Mogilny detractors would sure mention his lack of championship hardware had he not won one so fact is he's still a SC champion. It is a checkmark in his favor.

My Best-Carey

 

[streitz]

Well, he was a late season acquisition and never really fit that edition of the Devils. That being said, I'm sure Mogilny detractors would sure mention his lack of championship hardware had he not won one so fact is he's still a SC champion. It is a checkmark in his favor.

My Best-Carey

I consider getting outscored by 35 year old Scott Stevens a blackmark against him.

 

[Vanzig]

are you kiddmg me? this board is nothing but hot takes, contrarians, and ppl looking to pick a fight.

Lol true that