NobleSix
High Tech Low-Life.
I made a top 15 only to realize it was almost exactly the same as yours.
Good list.
Prospect Info: Habs top 10 prospects list post WJC
- Thread starter Goldenhands
- Start date
I made a top 15 only to realize it was almost exactly the same as yours.
Good list.
JohnLennon
Registered User
- Mar 26, 2011
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I get that you're passionate about the topic, and I really love how excited you are for Habs prospects. I am too! But this entire post of yours had zero substance and didn't bring up any good points.
You repeatedly asked how some of our top juniors prospects would perform in Liiga or KHL, implying you think a guy like Suzuki or Brook would play lower in the lineup than Ylonen or Romanov, or not even at all. That's pure speculation on your part, and if you wanted my speculation, I do think Suzuki and Brook would play larger roles in adult leagues than Ylonen and Romanov do now - especially Suzuki. If they were all forced to play in the NHL right now, I think Suzuki and Brook would both play larger roles than Ylonen and Romanov. I especially think Poehling will play a larger role than any other player you can mention on our prospect list if they were forced to play in the league right now. I don't think there's much of a question at this point in time. That's not a bad thing, it's just where I feel they are in their development. I agree with your assertion that KHL and Liiga are better leagues than the CHL, but implying that simply playing in those leagues makes one prospect better than another is absurd.
Nick Suzuki is top ten in his entire league in points, and of that top ten, four of them are above 19. The way he is playing is still an impressive feat for a 19 year old. Trying to minimize it by saying it's "easy to do" at his age is not a genuine remark at all and is totally false. Poehling and Suzuki are currently better prospects than Ylonen, and I don't think that's very close right now (nor does almost much of anyone else... except you). Romanov is making progress and doing solid work in the KHL, but he's still yet to score a point in his league after 28 games. It's not all about points obviously, but let's temper expectations a bit here.
I'm curious if you watch any of these players outside of what you saw at the WJHC? You say here that Suzuki still plays like a junior and Ylonen plays like a pro - what exactly indicates that to you? I loved Ylonen's game at the WJHC, but I know better than to make conclusions based off a 7 game sample size.
Your list is formed off recency bias and is too slanted based on WJHC results. Most professional scouts do not weigh the WJHC as much as you do, but of course it plays a factor. At the end of the day, I don't think many others will agree with your assessment that Ylonen and Romanov have completely overcome Poehling, Suzuki and Brook collectively as prospects based on a 7-game sample size. Even in this thread you'll be hard-pressed to find that.
- Aug 21, 2016
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First, you didnt interpret my thought correctly, I never said or implied that Romanov and Ylonen were better prospects than Suzuki or Brook cause they were playing in top men leagues, I only put in perspective that they were playing in much better leagues, against MEN, while Suzuki and Brook were putting higher numbers against KIDS, in a league averaging 18 years old KIDS. You are the one that pretend Suzuki and Brook are better prospects cause they are putting solid numbers in the CHL, not me pretending the opposite, I personally have Ylonen higher than Suzuki mostly based on this tournament right, you can disagree with this as much as you want and you can pretend that its not enough of exposure to come with that kind of conclusions and thats quite fine to me, thats your opinion and I respect this, I also respect your opinion that this tournament means very little when comes time to evaluate or assess prospects properly and that their performances is to take with a grain of salt, thats your opinion and then again, I respect this, I just disagree with you, thats all
Suzuki I could catch a couple of his games before that tournament, we all saw him at the training camp and strangely, Im not the only one who think he needs to improve some important things in order to become a solid top 6 at the NHL level, Ylonen, first time I really had the opportunity to watch him closely and believe me, I didnt miss 1 of his shifts the whole tournament, I dont know if you read the describtion I made on each players (it doesnt seem like, since the only thing you do is saying my ranking makes no sense, nowhere can I find constructive comments on your part about whats wrong with my players descriptions) but I think I explained very well why I was so high on him... As for Primeau, I had him at 1 prior WJC, its no secret that Im a huge fan of this kid, the tournament only solidified that ranking... Finally regarding Romanov over Brook, I mentionned in Brook's description that I could have him ranked at 3 easily and that 3 to 7 was extremmely close in my book, so dont be so offended that I have him only 1 spot lower than Romanov, at this point its up in the air, both are great prospects...Edit: Im more than aware that this ranking may look overboard or marginal since my top 2 is certainly not a concensus, but Im assuming it and thats mine nevertheless, no need to be offended, we are no scouts, we are passionate fans about our prospects thats it.
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calder candidate
Registered User
Brook is also a year older... I don’t actually think Romanov was the best D of the WJC but he was up there and he is playing in the KHL that is impressive for a 18yo D. Brook might be ahead but the gap is so small I have them both at #2.
I think Stapley should be ranked over guys like Hillis and Fonstad. Smart player with nifty hands, close to a ppg in the NCAA..
Make no mistake. Poehling has #1 after winning tournament MVP at the juniors.
That goes to the best potential forward voted by the some of hockeys brightest and influential.
Now maybe they have it wrong this time. But, I believe peohling coming to the nhl as an over twenty is going to show results. Teenagers dont belong in the NHL.
That goes to the best potential forward voted by the some of hockeys brightest and influential.
Now maybe they have it wrong this time. But, I believe peohling coming to the nhl as an over twenty is going to show results. Teenagers dont belong in the NHL.
WinterLion
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- Oct 1, 2017
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- Aug 21, 2016
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Especially consirering that Kupari was jerk centering that first line, a line that only clicked in the quarters against switzerland...
The guy is 19 and produced some highlight reel goal in the NCAA already. His coach said he was the smartest player on the team. His ceiling might be higher than Olofsson.
f***. I could provide some highlight reel goals anywhere i went. So could scherbak.. But does he have the "other" elements..
Stapley so high on your list and mccaron so low must must those inbetween players pretty AHL.
Be a Hab
Registered User
- Sep 17, 2010
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I wonder how Timmons or Bergevin would rank our top 10 prospects.
OP I like your list!
OP I like your list!
I consider upside and age. McCarron upside is a 4th line center and is turning 24 in march. Put any forward from my list in Laval at 24 years old and I'm pretty sure they will be doing better than McCarron is doing now. Stapley is almost producing at a ppg as a rookie in NCAA and if you watch him play, you can tell he has great IQ, have good hands and decent speed. NCAA is a tougher league than the CHL. I think him and Harris are being underrated. That's my reasonning.
Im going to have to watch a few games thanks for the insight.
Montreal Impact FC
.:| Champ's City |:.
okay here is my list.
1- Poehling (not a huge point producer but a complete package player the type you need to compete for championships)
2- Brook (very close to Romanov but with more of an offensive vision great 2 way potential)
3- Romanov (see Brook little less offensive vision more defensive presence and physicality)
4- Suzuki (perhaps can still be a close to ppg in the NHL but his lack of intensity in a once in a lifetime tournament is not a good sign for me)
5- Primeau/Olafson/Ylonen (need to see more of them cant really set them appart yet)
1- Poehling (not a huge point producer but a complete package player the type you need to compete for championships)
2- Brook (very close to Romanov but with more of an offensive vision great 2 way potential)
3- Romanov (see Brook little less offensive vision more defensive presence and physicality)
4- Suzuki (perhaps can still be a close to ppg in the NHL but his lack of intensity in a once in a lifetime tournament is not a good sign for me)
5- Primeau/Olafson/Ylonen (need to see more of them cant really set them appart yet)
He managed to dodge your question twice, third time's the charm?
BJCOLLINS
Registered User
Thanks I like your list.
IMHO;
if Poehling can continue to improve upon his WJC performance we could have ourselves a special #1B or #2 C
I didn’t think Suzuki was utilized properly....his IQ is off the charts & needs linemates that think and play with a high tempo and creativity.
Romanov, if he is in North America within 2 years playing for the Habs in 3 then we have a gem, an absolute steal.....if we don’t see him for 4-6 years then we should have selected McIsaac.
Cheers guys.
Grate n Colorful Oz
Hutson Hawk
Mrb1p
PRICERSTOPDAPUCK
Im getting an early bid on the nickname war.you're impossible
THE HOFF
Registered User
- Sep 26, 2007
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I agree that there is a recency bias, but poehling and romanov looked ahead in my opinion. Their all around game gave me quite a solid impression. Both players looked like pros, and both of them displayed a "clutch mode" and had special moments. Defensively, they are special as well.
That being said, Ylonen and primeau looked great too. That's my top 4, personally.
That being said, Ylonen and primeau looked great too. That's my top 4, personally.
Le Barron de HF
Justin make me proud
On a different topic, which one has the most value and which one would you be most comfortable trading?
- Aug 21, 2016
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Poehling and Suzuki probably have the highest value right now, I wouldnt trade any of them unless the return makes sense...
montreal
Go Habs Go
hopefully it ends up being a strong draft class, when you have this many top 50/60 picks, this is where Timmins needs to nail it as long as the draft class isn't a weak on like '99 or even '12 which isn't looking so hot.
But we'll see what happens, fans went nuts for our draft in '12 and in time that turned south in a hurry. But so far the 1st 3 picks are looking the part for sure. Kotka alone could make this a great draft for us.
I only saw parts of games mostly but I thought Brook played well considering he was on his off-side. Hopefully the Habs keep him at RD for good.
But it can be dangerous to put too much into 5-6-7 games. People have gone overboard in the past for good or bad tournaments. Kostitsyn, Collberg putting up 7 pts as a 17 year old, ppg at 18 and 19. Lehkonen with just 1 pt at 19.
It can be hard not to put too much good or bad into the WJC's but at the end of the day it's just a short tournament. You really want to look at how they do over a full year. How have they progressed since last year, how have they improved on their weaknesses, etc...
I've watched a lot of Romanov in the KHL, if you read in his thread I talk about how hard it has been to get a read on him as you watch one game and he plays a regular shift, looks good and then the next time you see him he barely plays and one shift he's at RD then sits for a long time then next shift he's at LD. It can be hard to get a read on that when it's so disjointed.
That said the biggest thing that stood out to me, what impressed me the most in his KHL play is how mistake free he's been for an 18 year old playing in the 2nd best league in the world.
Have seen a lot of Harris, he's easily a top 10 prospect for us, what he's doing is very impressive. I'd like to see a little more offense from him. He's very much in the Mete mold, undersized, great skating/mobility. Likes to jump in in the offensive zone but needs to get stronger, add mass.
Just some friendly advice, it's easier to read your posts if you break them up a bit. No big deal but with long posts at least for me it can be harder to follow.
Brook of course wouldn't produce like he is in any pro league, be it KHL, AHL, SHL, etc.. as his production is insane. What imo people should be looking at isn't the numbers, it's where does he rank in the league, and how does his skill set look to do as he moves up to the pro leagues.
One thing I always hated on this board is how so often fans must pit one prospect or player vs another when both are on our team. That said it makes for good discussions.
I do think Brook could easily play in the KHL, SHL and in fact I think he could have played in the NHL this year and been a decent bottom pairing D but so glad that didn't happen as I am against rushing prospects.
As for Suzuki, he needs to work on getting quicker, and I can see why some aren't as high on him despite how he's totally dominated the OHL over the last 3 seasons. If he were seen as this great can't miss prospect then perhaps he doesn't get traded. That said he clearly has a very high level of skill and IQ but the question becomes can he overcome his lack of physical tools of size, strength, speed, skating? Not saying they are major issues like say Hudon or others, as I think Suzuki will easily be an NHLer at some point but the question for me is how good will he be?
If he were in Liiga, I don't think he would be setting the league on fire but I do think he would do very well there. In fact I pushed for it, as I didn't want to see him return to the CHL for a 3rd season after putting up 196 pts in 2 years. I think the SHL would have been great for him, or Liiga or the NLA even (although I've never seen one of their games) The bigger ice would force him to work on his skating/speed more imo. And playing against older players would have been a much better challenge. That said we'll see how next year goes for him.
As for Team Canada, I think that the coaching staff made poor decisions leading up to the tournament. No way should Brook have been at LD, at all. I think if they put Suzuki in Tippett's spot it would have gone better as well. That said it's a short tournament, anything can happen in those single game knock out.
keep in mind that Stapley is just one month younger then Poehling.
tough one. Suzuki, Brook, Poehling should have the most value. I'd trade any for the right price though.
- Aug 21, 2016
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Thx for the advice, I recall my prof saying me the same thing in my teens days lol, when I write, I dont wanna lose track of my mains ideas so thats why Im writing those one shot, its especially less easy for me in english since Im far from being bilingual while I have to formulate it properly to make sense... Anyway, I will try to correct it...
As for young players, I only wanted to put in perspective the fact that we cant really know how kids playing in top Euro men leagues or KHL would do in the CHL against kids their own age or younger, its also not evident to speculate how a kid playing in the CHL would do in top men leagues, I think its pure speculation and thats why the WJC is a nice barometer IMO since they all are on the same level in a such competition...
About our top prospects list, I would be curious to know yours post WJC... Feel free to post it when you have the chance...
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