Google Stadia

[18leafsfan18]

Actually I think that's something these data centers would be good at, as it would likely be just some extra number crunching inbetween the input lag. Console shooters already have auto-aim, so I'd see this less about "predicting" and more a low latency auto-aim. Though auto-aim wouldn't be a good term for it anymore as you're probably only talking about a few pixels here.

I think in some of the interviews they actually mentioned auto aim as a basis for why they are playing around with predictive inputs.

 

[PK Cronin]

Have they addressed the existing library issue? If I can't play games I already own then there's no chance I'm going to Stadia for anything on the PC.

 

[18leafsfan18]

Have they addressed the existing library issue? If I can't play games I already own then there's no chance I'm going to Stadia for anything on the PC.

Not sure what the existing library issue is ?

You mean if you have already purchased something on PC you want to be able to play it on Stadia ?

 

[PK Cronin]

Not sure what the existing library issue is ?

You mean if you have already purchased something on PC you want to be able to play it on Stadia ?

Yes, that's a legitimate issue for those of us on PC. Steam allows you to add games to your library that weren't purchased through steam, it'd be pretty neat if Stadia allowed the same thing but they likely won't.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Another issue with Stadia is you don't own anything. If Stadia no longer has access to a game, then you can't play it.

 

[Beau Knows]

Yes, that's a legitimate issue for those of us on PC. Steam allows you to add games to your library that weren't purchased through steam, it'd be pretty neat if Stadia allowed the same thing but they likely won't.

How could they allow that though?

You'd have to upload your games to Stadia's servers. And even if they let you do that who knows what kind of updates are required to the games Stadia adds in order to work on their service. Where does the game save? What are the settings it's going to run at? How do you launch it if it's a steam game? If the games require Steam or any other launcher to work how is that going to work and would there be any legal issues with that?

I doubt that this is something they could do.

 

[PK Cronin]

How could they allow that though?

You'd have to upload your games to Stadia's servers. And even if they let you do that who knows what kind of updates are required to the games Stadia adds in order to work on their service. Where does the game save? What are the settings it's going to run at? How do you launch it if it's a steam game? If the games require Steam or any other launcher to work how is that going to work and would their be any legal issues with that?

I doubt that this is something they could do.

I think it'd need to change the way the industry works. If you buy a game off of Green Man Gaming right now they give you a code that allows you to download the game from Steam if you want (it isn't a requirement all the time). If when purchasing a game you're really only purchasing a code that can be used on various platforms (only once at a time or a limited number of times), then you'd be able to transfer games from one to the other. It also solves the problem of you not really owning the games, so if Stadia fails and gets shut down you'd still have something.

Do we know what version of the games Stadia is using? It has to be PC right?

It's far-fetched and won't happen, but I really don't want to re-buy games I already own and/or run the risk of losing games if the platform fails. There's no insurance against that. I suppose a code isn't really owning it either, but I don't know.

 

[Beau Knows]

It's far-fetched and won't happen, but I really don't want to re-buy games I already own and/or run the risk of losing games if the platform fails. There's no insurance against that. I suppose a code isn't really owning it either, but I don't know.

Yeah I'm with you there and that's one reason I won't be using this service. Google doesn't have the best track record of keeping their products alive either: Killed by Google

 

[18leafsfan18]

I think it'd need to change the way the industry works. If you buy a game off of Green Man Gaming right now they give you a code that allows you to download the game from Steam if you want (it isn't a requirement all the time). If when purchasing a game you're really only purchasing a code that can be used on various platforms (only once at a time or a limited number of times), then you'd be able to transfer games from one to the other. It also solves the problem of you not really owning the games, so if Stadia fails and gets shut down you'd still have something.

Do we know what version of the games Stadia is using? It has to be PC right?

It's far-fetched and won't happen, but I really don't want to re-buy games I already own and/or run the risk of losing games if the platform fails. There's no insurance against that. I suppose a code isn't really owning it either, but I don't know.

Yeah I'm with you there and that's one reason I won't be using this service. Google doesn't have the best track record of keeping their products alive either: Killed by Google

On which console can you currently do this ?

If you buy a game on Xbox you can't get it on Playstation for free.

I don't think it's targeting people who want to switch their library of games over to another system (Just like any other "console").

 

[18leafsfan18]

Another issue with Stadia is you don't own anything. If Stadia no longer has access to a game, then you can't play it.

It seems as though Google has put a ton of time and effort into this, enough to be fairly confident they won't just cancel the service.

Time will tell I guess, but this is not one of those "Killed by Google" projects that Google put minimal time and effort into.

 

[bleedblue1223]

It seems as though Google has put a ton of time and effort into this, enough to be fairly confident they won't just cancel the service.

Time will tell I guess, but this is not one of those "Killed by Google" projects that Google put minimal time and effort into.

I'm not saying they'll cancel the service, I'm saying they'll lose rights to a specific game to stream. Just like Netflix or Hulu or any other type streaming service, they won't just keep rights to all games for eternity.

 

[Beau Knows]

On which console can you currently do this ?

If you buy a game on Xbox you can't get it on Playstation for free.

XBOX and PC for some games, if you buy say Forza Horizon 4 on XBOX you can also play it on your PC and vice versa. You can even play together on both systems at once with two different accounts.

I don't think it's targeting people who want to switch their library of games over to another system (Just like any other "console").

Agreed, hence why it's not enticing at all for me. It doesn't have any exclusives (and when it does will they even be interesting) and I can't use it to play the 1000s of games I already have on my PC so it does nothing for me.

 

[18leafsfan18]

XBOX and PC for some games, if you buy say Forza Horizon 4 on XBOX you can also play it on your PC and vice versa. You can even play together on both systems at once with two different accounts.

I didn't realize that, that's pretty cool.

Agreed, hence why it's not enticing at all for me. It doesn't have any exclusives (and when it does will they even be interesting) and I can't use it to play the 1000s of games I already have on my PC so it does nothing for me.

Exclusives are a big thing, I totally agree.

The nice thing about it though (if exclusives come out and are good), someone such as yourself (PC gamer) literally doesn't have to invest anything to buy the exclusive and play it on your PC (can use your controllers or keyboard and mouse). Once Stadia base comes out in 2020.

Google apparently is opening up studios to bring out exclusives (so we may have to wait a while).

There is 1 that looks interesting however, Gylt.
www.gyltthegame.com

 

[PK Cronin]

On which console can you currently do this ?

If you buy a game on Xbox you can't get it on Playstation for free.

No, you can't (usually), but if I buy a game on PC and then get a new PC I can still use that game. I've owned some games for decades now and can still play them. I can also choose to hook up my Gamecube, PS2, or other systems to my television and play any game I already own.

I don't think it's targeting people who want to switch their library of games over to another system (Just like any other "console").

If I were strictly a console gamer Stadia would be enticing to me. The promise of being able to play on any platform is intriguing, but for someone like me who has an entire library of PC games already, what's the incentive to switch to a potentially less stable/permanent ecosystem?

And to be perfectly clear, I hope they address some of this and it succeeds because I'd love the flexibility to play some games on my television with a controller and others on my PC.

 

[18leafsfan18]

On which console can you currently do this ?

If you buy a game on Xbox you can't get it on Playstation for free.

No, you can't (usually), but if I buy a game on PC and then get a new PC I can still use that game. I've owned some games for decades now and can still play them. I can also choose to hook up my Gamecube, PS2, or other systems to my television and play any game I already own.

I don't think it's targeting people who want to switch their library of games over to another system (Just like any other "console").​

If I were strictly a console gamer Stadia would be enticing to me. The promise of being able to play on any platform is intriguing, but for someone like me who has an entire library of PC games already, what's the incentive to switch to a potentially less stable/permanent ecosystem?​

If I were you, I wouldn't switch, because you have invested too much into your PC (I assume).

But for someone like you (PC gamer), you can buy Stadia games and use all of your existing hardware to play. You would only have to purchase the game (When Stadia basic comes out in 2020).

This is likely only going to be enticing to you if there are exclusives for Stadia. Time will tell how good their exclusives end up (They are starting up studios to create exclusive games).

 

[Beau Knows]

The nice thing about it though (if exclusives come out and are good), someone such as yourself (PC gamer) literally doesn't have to invest anything to buy the exclusive and play it on your PC (can use your controllers or keyboard and mouse). Once Stadia base comes out in 2020.

I don't think it's enticing at all to most PC players. If we can already run a game well on our PC's why we want to play it with a lag/delay and a required internet connection just to play?

I think if there is any audience for this it's people who want to play the occasional game but aren't invested at all in any consoles. They don't mind the limitations and lag so long as they don't have to spend $100s to get a console to play on.

 

[18leafsfan18]

I don't think it's enticing at all to most PC players. If we can already run a game well on our PC's why we want to play it with a lag/delay and a required internet connection just to play?

I think if there is any audience for this it's people who want to play the occasional game but aren't invested at all in any consoles. They don't mind the limitations and lag so long as they don't have to spend $100s to get a console to play on.

Exclusives is the key, as I mentioned to get PC gamers to play anything on Stadia.

We have no idea if it will perform yet, so you can't really say the lag etc is an issue (Yet). All indications point to minimal to no lag.

You wouldn't every want to be able to take the game you play on your PC and play it on a Cell Phone or TV or anywhere else (When traveling or not at home) ?

 

[bleedblue1223]

I don't think it's enticing at all to most PC players. If we can already run a game well on our PC's why we want to play it with a lag/delay and a required internet connection just to play?

I think if there is any audience for this it's people who want to play the occasional game but aren't invested at all in any consoles. They don't mind the limitations and lag so long as they don't have to spend $100s to get a console to play on.

There is still a pretty significant upfront fee for Stadia, along with the monthly payment. Like anything else with cloud, people greatly underestimate the cost over the long-run.

Even for console gamers, what's the total cost that they've invested in their PS or Xbox if they invested in the lastest console from the date it was introduced to now. Now calculate the cost of Stadia over the same time period.

The console would've come out to about $80 a year to this point, then you factor in the games and other costs that someone might have. Stadia would have a their Year 1 would be $220 and $120 in all following years.

 

[18leafsfan18]

There is still a pretty significant upfront fee for Stadia, along with the monthly payment. Like anything else with cloud, people greatly underestimate the cost over the long-run.

You need to do more research.

 

[bleedblue1223]

You need to do more research.

Now, I just updated the post with actual numbers. Cloud services are only cheaper in the short-term, but there is a tipping point where any on-prem service becomes cheaper. There is a reason all these companies are pushing cloud services. I worked with cloud ERP's from the consulting side, the up-front margins are less, but we'll make way more profit over the long-run. Same thing applies here.

What's the average lifespan of a console, now calculate the cost of it over that lifespan and compare it to Stadia.

 

[Beau Knows]

We have no idea if it will perform yet, so you can't really say the lag etc is an issue (Yet). All indications point to minimal to no lag.

How could there be no lag? Sending inputs and receiving a response from Google's servers will take time. Whether or not that amount of time is acceptable to players remains to be seen, but it won't be 0ms.

You wouldn't every want to be able to take the game you play on your PC and play it on a Cell Phone or TV or anywhere else (When traveling or not at home) ?

No, I don't care about that. It's one reason I'd love to see a less expensive Switch that doesn't have a portable mode, I'm not gonna take it with me anywhere. I have no desire to play games away from home, and certainly not with the built-in Stadia lag that I wouldn't get at home.

 

[bleedblue1223]

How could there be no lag? Sending inputs and receiving a response from Google's servers will take time. Whether or not that amount of time is acceptable to players remains to be seen, but it won't be 0ms.

No, I don't care about that. It's one reason I'd love to see a less expensive Switch that doesn't have a portable mode, I'm not gonna take it with me anywhere. I have no desire to play games away from home, and certainly not with the built-in Stadia lag that I wouldn't get at home.

Right, I'm reminded of the Diablo/mobile game announcement disaster. The vast majority of gamers just want to play on their preferred setup and they have no problem making time to do so. Now the Stadia can still be used in that, but playing on the go isn't a big selling point for most people.

 

[Beau Knows]

Now, I just updated the post with actual numbers. Cloud services are only cheaper in the short-term, but there is a tipping point where any on-prem service becomes cheaper. There is a reason all these companies are pushing cloud services. I worked with cloud ERP's from the consulting side, the up-front margins are less, but we'll make way more profit over the long-run. Same thing applies here.

What's the average lifespan of a console, now calculate the cost of it over that lifespan and compare it to Stadia.

That doesn't really apply to my example. The type of customer I gave would likely use the Free version of this service and buy their games individually, unless they're dumb which is possible. Or they just subscribe to the Pro version when they want to play something on there and unsubscribe when they don't - similar to how some use services like HBO Go, they watch GoT then unsubscribe, they don't pay the monthly fee until the end of time.

 

[bleedblue1223]

That doesn't really apply to my example. The type of customer I gave would likely use the Free version of this service and buy their games individually, unless they're dumb which is possible. Or they just subscribe to the Pro version when they want to play something on there and unsubscribe when they don't - similar to how some use services like HBO Go, they watch GoT then unsubscribe, they don't pay the monthly fee until the end of time.

Fair. I wonder what the quality will be on the free version, how Google handles people dropping off and on, and their overall price structure over time.

 

[Beau Knows]

Fair. I wonder what the quality will be on the free version, how Google handles people dropping off and on, and their overall price structure over time.

It's supposed to be 1080p 60fps.