IceNeophyte
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Rumor: Golden Knights reportedly refused to deal Cody Glass in order to obtain Erik Karlsson from Senators
- Thread starter Bart22
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mundyc3
Registered User
Yes but that isn't the only variable. No arena, no practice facility, being the second fiddle in the market. If everything goes perfectly, all that would be together by the end of an eight year contract.
Not saying he won't re-sign. Just saying he would be pretty crazy to.
IceNeophyte
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You make a compelling case.....I've just a feeling when Trotz said he and Lou had spoken with JT the other evening, that there is a chance for them.
He may very well sign with the Islanders again but he's already taken it this far, he may as well let other teams offer him to see all of what's out there for him, both money and competition wise.
danielpalfredsson
youtube dot com /watch?v=CdqMZ_s7Y6k
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(Outsider coming in peace...)
If Vegas isn't going to exceed the cap ceiling over the next two seasons, which they probably won't, a creative way around Ryan's contract would be giving up David Clarkson. A team has to exceed the cap ceiling by the entirety of a contract to get it all back via LTIR, so because VGK aren't likely to do that in the next two seasons, sending Clarkson to Ottawa would mean VGK would have a +2M/+2M/+7.25M/+7.25M cap consequence over the next four seasons.
The sunk cost of David Clarkson makes Ryan's added cap very low for at least the first two seasons. In season 3, there's the potential for a lockout, which if it lasts a full season will buy Vegas a year to deal with Ryan while eating up a year of his contract. So potentially Vegas would only have one nasty year of Ryan's contract where they are adding considerable cap as a result of Ryan's inclusion in the Karlsson deal.
Ottawa would be likely to take Clarkson if he is insured, because it would mean his real salary owed would be a bit under 1M. The Senators are not a cap ceiling team, so the cap hit would be superficial, they won't care about any LTIR benefits.
It's why I was so confident that Karlsson+Ryan would go to VGK at the deadline when the rumours first dropped. It was a perfect storm. Vegas had the assets, they had the long term cap space, and they were having an amazing season that would justify making a big splash like adding Karlsson.
Taking on 7.25M (7.5M real money) a season for four seasons is a huge obligation, but this is a situation where Vegas can offer Ottawa something that almost no other team can. Not only that, if Vegas' ownership is already expecting to Spend 70-80 million a year on player salary, taking on Ryan creates a scenario where Vegas can offer something to Ottawa that is much much more valuable to Ottawa than it hurts Vegas. It's like an ace up Vegas' sleeve (sorry had to), in that even if another team came out with a package Ottawa likes even a little bit better, I have a hard time imagining they'd take it over Vegas' package that includes Vegas taking on Ryan.
Vegas Mac
Golden Shellback
- Jun 26, 2015
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Extremely low chance of that. The Isles have a new team pres whose history does not include paying top dolla. JT is going to hit the market.
LadyStanley
Registered User
mundyc3
Registered User
Yeah that's interesting. Insurance policy if Karlsson doesn't re-sign would be a smart way to go. I still think losing Tuch or Glass or both should be avoided at all costs.
Yeah, we can't afford all of our defensemen if we get Karlsson and want him to re-sign (we do in that scenario) so I don't see why Theodore wouldn't be included in the deal. I'd rather him than Tuch or Glass.
Insurance policy. You trade one of Theodore, Miller, or Schmidt if Karlsson re-signs.
So would we just include extra 1sts/ 2nds in this trade and try to recoup those picks later with a Theodore/ Miller trade?
GKG18
Expansion Fan
Do any of these numbers mentioned include the cost of extending EK going forward? Or is GMGM just renting him for a year?
Pirate Deadpool
Registered User
I doubt GMGM makes a deal for EK thinking rental. I'm sure he'll get to talk to EK and find out if he sees us as a place he'd like to play the rest of his career out. VGK even with EK I still see being as not a true contender until they get a top center or winger. I also don't want to trade away an additional dman unless we sign a bottom 4 pairing dman. I don't see Engelland being here much longer unless he puts out another good season and even then I see him getting another 1 year deal and hopefully will be on the bottom pairing with Miller. His lack of speed got exposed in the finals. I also wouldn't count on any rookies making the team on D this season.
We have a nice core, but still need require 2 to 3 more really good pieces before I see them as a long term contender. Maybe our farm provides that, but likely we won't see any rookies making the team this year.
BattleBorn
50% to winning as many division titles as Toronto
I mean, if we get EK for a decent trade package, I'd say we were only really a good 2C away.
Smith- Karlsson- Marchessault
Tatar- Haula- Tuch
Hyka- Eakin- Ryan
Nosek- Bellemare- Reaves
Our first and fourth lines were great for their roles last season. A 2C helps shift Haula down to 3C and gets rid of Eakin and suddenly those two lines look much more solid. Maybe a deadline day winger pickup for a playoff run or a cheaper UFA instead of Hyka. We would probably have one of Glass/ Suzuki and Gusev make our forward group even better after next season.
McNabb- Karlsson
Schmidt- Miller
?- Engelland
All players would be playing their natural position. We would maybe need a bottom pair veteran LHD this season. Upgrading partners from Sbisa to Schmidt would make Miller a bona fide top 4. After next season we would have one of Brannstrom/ Hague and Whitecloud vying for both bottom pair positions.
We have Hunt, Merill at 7D and 8D spots.
Fleury
Subban/ Lagace/ Dansk
VegasKnightlife
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- Aug 20, 2017
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I hope they don't give up Tuch. Glass could be special too but I think Ottawa would insist on him.
DanyHeatley
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man i don’t even care about ottawa. im on the EK bandwagon. if he goes to vegas then GO VGK GO!
Supermassive
HISS, HISS
If nothing gets done today or tomorrow, one would think that the two sides aren’t close to a deal at all. $2M is a lot to Melnyk.
Maybe Cody Eakin goes to Ottawa if Bobby Ryan comes here. Cody’s making a lot for a 3C. Maybe Colin Miller goes back in a Karlsson trade. He’s RFA and will want a raise. Arbitration might favour his 41 points and end up costing us a bit. Throw in those two guys, Glass and a pick...
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LadyStanley
Registered User
Vegas Mac
Golden Shellback
- Jun 26, 2015
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I have to assume that Georgey already said no re: Glass. I wouldn't discuss him as an option either tbh.
Also have to think that Ottawa will be looking for upside as well as a cost-controlled blue liner and probably draft value on top of those things. So if it were to happen I'd guess it would look something along the lines of Nick Suzuki, Shea Theodore, and next year's round one pick.
Taking Ryan's contract off Ottawa's hands would obviously make things cheaper, as he is due 4 years of $7.5M. That is a significant contract to take on. To what extent it affects things, though, I don't know, since we'd have to start with what VGK think of Ryan and his tendency to disappear, take shifts off, or otherwise coast defensively, i.e. does he fit as a guy they can squeeze a role out of.
Oh and re: Tuck... I'd deal him in a heartbeat as part of a package for EK. I like Tuck, but for all his power forward type ability I don't know that he'll live up to his talent in terms of consistency. He certainly does have value, not trying to rag on the kid. But for this level of addition pull that trigger.
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Super Cake
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- Jun 24, 2013
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