OT: General UFC/MMA/Boxing discussion IX

[Pompeius Magnus]

goddamn it, so sad the dream is over. really hoped for 4 rounds of Lewis doing nothing and then getting a 5th round tko lol

He's still relatively young, with the way this division is, he'll get another chance before too long.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

He's still relatively young, with the way this division is, he'll get another chance before too long.

Lewis hit his peak. Anyone who said he had zero chance vs Cormier is nuts though. DC loves to box and he did not have a single shot if he did that. A bad punch, a failed takedown and more chance of a KO upset.

Still...Lewis has back problems and he's not a mixed martial artist, he's a brawler. Unless he changes his mind and starts rounding out his game + his back holds up I don't see him having a consistent title opportunity.

It's too bad, I think Brock could've won title if he faced Lewis, that would've been hilarious.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Don't forget:

Stipe, Cormier, Blaydes, Ngannou and others are currently on top of the division but Cain is due to be back and it can send some mid level heavyweights down a notch. JDS isn't that bad either.

 

[Deebs]

Stipe should get the next shot at DC without question, but it's not the money fight. Unfortunate we have to watch Lesnar

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Joe Rogan asks some honest questions after the fight. He's challenging the UFC having money fights on a UFC broadcast, god damn.

The question he asked was if doing too many novelty/money fights make MMA/UFC mixed in with WWE type programming?

Not sure what everyone else's opinion is but mine is as long as fans want to see it and it's competitive I have little issue. Brock is a former UFC champ and big draw so easy sell. He's a massive human being so it's always interesting.

If it's CM Punk, Logan Paul and others guys who are fringe that's a different story. I don't think they can beat any UFC fighter in their division. I think Brock can still beat guys steroids or not. So there's at least that.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Stipe should get the next shot at DC without question, but it's not the money fight. Unfortunate we have to watch Lesnar

Love Brock Lesnar, he's a spectacle.

My biggest issue with Brock is actually about his time in WWE recently. His matches are f***ing boring, repetitive and I don't know what it is but it's lazy work IMO.

 

[Mike Mike Caron]

DC can take people down at will, it's actually beautiful to watch.

 

[pistolpete11]

Joe Rogan asks some honest questions after the fight. He's challenging the UFC having money fights on a UFC broadcast, god damn.

The question he asked was if doing too many novelty/money fights make MMA/UFC mixed in with WWE type programming?

Not sure what everyone else's opinion is but mine is as long as fans want to see it and it's competitive I have little issue. Brock is a former UFC champ and big draw so easy sell. He's a massive human being so it's always interesting.

If it's CM Punk, Logan Paul and others guys who are fringe that's a different story. I don't think they can beat any UFC fighter in their division. I think Brock can still beat guys steroids or not. So there's at least that.

Brock is nowhere near as bad as CM Punk. He has a legitimate background in a martial art and whether he deserved the fights he got or not, he still proved he could beat some of the best in the world......

......but him fighting for the belt in 2019 is still an absolute joke. He hasn't won a fight in the UFC in 8 years. He's 41 years old. He's probably never competed without steroids. The only reason I don't hate it is because I like DC and want to see him get paid as much as he can. But from the sport side of it, it's ridiculous.

I didn't like Conor getting a title shot at LW without ever having to fight in the division. I hated GSP getting a title shot after a 4 year layoff without fighting in the division. I really hate Brock getting a title shot without having won a fight in 8 years. I don't know. I guess I'm more of a 'sport' fan than a 'entertainment' fan. The NHL doesn't get to just put the Maple Leafs in the Stanley Cup Final. The NFL doesn't get to put the Patriots in the Super Bowl. MLB doesn't get to put the Yankees in the World Series. So I don't think the UFC should get to put Brock in the HW title fight.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Brock is nowhere near as bad as CM Punk. He has a legitimate background in a martial art and whether he deserved the fights he got or not, he still proved he could beat some of the best in the world......

......but him fighting for the belt in 2019 is still an absolute joke. He hasn't won a fight in the UFC in 8 years. He's 41 years old. He's probably never competed without steroids. The only reason I don't hate it is because I like DC and want to see him get paid as much as he can. But from the sport side of it, it's ridiculous.

I didn't like Conor getting a title shot at LW without ever having to fight in the division. I hated GSP getting a title shot after a 4 year layoff without fighting in the division. I really hate Brock getting a title shot without having won a fight in 8 years. I don't know. I guess I'm more of a 'sport' fan than a 'entertainment' fan. The NHL doesn't get to just put the Maple Leafs in the Stanley Cup Final. The NFL doesn't get to put the Patriots in the Super Bowl. MLB doesn't get to put the Yankees in the World Series. So I don't think the UFC should get to put Brock in the HW title fight.

CM Punk is horrid but don't let Woodley hear you say that, apparently he's upset at Rogan for saying facts.

Yeah, Lesnar does not deserve title shot but HW has always been a very strange division because there aren't guys who defend title for years like Aldo, GSP, Silva, Jones/Cormier, etc... It's a lot more justifiable to let someone skip the line at HW than it is at say WW or LW. Of course, given Lesnar is so inactive and didn't leave as a champion or anything it's still nonsensical but I want DC to get the fight.

As for Conor and GSP. It's different. Conor was a champ, Holloway got to step up this year. BJ Penn stepped up from LW to face GSP years ago. Champ vs Champ fights are fine. Cejudo will likely face DJ too.

GSP is a little different, he never lost his WW title and has a ridiculous resume. The thing DW didn't want was winning and vacating but I can see how when someone as good as GSP returns after never losing a title he gets a chance to pick up where he left off.

 

[ImNeverWrong]

Love Brock Lesnar, he's a spectacle.

My biggest issue with Brock is actually about his time in WWE recently. His matches are ****ing boring, repetitive and I don't know what it is but it's lazy work IMO.

Absolutely...
his last really good match was ironically, against cm punk at summer slam 2013. he's been coasting during most of his return. if he's just going to do suplexes, can't he at least change it up with something other than a german? anyways, he's been horrible in the wwe. But i find his fights in the ufc as always interesting. he hasn't earned shit, but i really look forward to him fighting dc. brock's a monster of a wrestler and i'm intrigued to see if dc can take him down. i think brock goes after dc the same way he did against cain. if brock loses it's probably because of his gas tank.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Absolutely...
his last really good match was ironically, against cm punk at summer slam 2013. he's been coasting during most of his return. if he's just going to do suplexes, can't he at least change it up with something other than a german? anyways, he's been horrible in the wwe. But i find his fights in the ufc as always interesting. he hasn't earned ****, but i really look forward to him fighting dc. brock's a monster of a wrestler and i'm intrigued to see if dc can take him down. i think brock goes after dc the same way he did against cain. if brock loses it's probably because of his gas tank.

The scoop is this.

Kurt Angle who is an actual Olympic gold wrestler and Brock did wrestle for real once. Kurt says it ended 0-0, no one won after X amount of time. Kurt was quick to point out that while it makes Brock look good he had a huge weight advantage on him and that Brock's technique isn't elite of the elite but his freakish strength help him a lot.

I have no idea how that will translate to DC, another Olympic caliber wrestler who hasn't exactly stopped competing for fake wrestling.

As for his run in the WWE. He was good at different times and Vince McMahon was gone on record saying he doesn't even want Lesnar to be at every event because he's such a spectacle that you don't want people to get used to it. He gets a HUGE pop and he's great to watch.

The problem is I find his promos more interesting than his actual fights. He's essentially replaced Goldberg's angle of a champ with two moves. I really like Brock but that's hard to defend. He's a lot better in a 3+ person match though.

 

[pistolpete11]

CM Punk is horrid but don't let Woodley hear you say that, apparently he's upset at Rogan for saying facts.

Yeah, Lesnar does not deserve title shot but HW has always been a very strange division because there aren't guys who defend title for years like Aldo, GSP, Silva, Jones/Cormier, etc... It's a lot more justifiable to let someone skip the line at HW than it is at say WW or LW. Of course, given Lesnar is so inactive and didn't leave as a champion or anything it's still nonsensical but I want DC to get the fight.

As for Conor and GSP. It's different. Conor was a champ, Holloway got to step up this year. BJ Penn stepped up from LW to face GSP years ago. Champ vs Champ fights are fine. Cejudo will likely face DJ too.

GSP is a little different, he never lost his WW title and has a ridiculous resume. The thing DW didn't want was winning and vacating but I can see how when someone as good as GSP returns after never losing a title he gets a chance to pick up where he left off.

I'm not saying the Brock situation is equal to Conor or GSP. But there are some similarities and I don't like it.

There are times where it makes sense. For example, DC getting a shot at Stipe made sense. Both had pretty much cleaned out their division (minus Jon Jones, of course, but he was suspended) and DC had great success at HW before. DJ vs TJ would have been OK, too. DJ was working on cleaning out the division for the second time. I think Assuncao and Moraes deserve a shot at TJ, but to get a fight people wanted to see for for DJ, it would have been worth it. Plus, TJ is a couple of split decisions away from having a 14 fight win streak (and yes, I know if those fights went differently he probably would have fought someone else and maybe lost those, etc.)

Cejudo will probably get a shot against TJ, but if it's because they shut down the flyweight division, I have no problem with that. If they don't shut it down, then I don't like it. Assuncao and Moraes deserve a shot. Cejudo deserves a ton of credit for beating DJ, but it wasn't that impressive where he should get to jump the line in another division.

 

[Pompeius Magnus]

Floyd Mayweather, Rizin FF announce fight vs. Tenshin Nasukawa for Dec. 31 in Japan
Under kickboxing rules maybe ? It's not clear at the moment. Nasukawa has fought under both kickboxing and MMA rules before but I just can't picture Mayweather taking that risk.

 

[Deebs]

[tweet]

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Floyd Mayweather, Rizin FF announce fight vs. Tenshin Nasukawa for Dec. 31 in Japan
Under kickboxing rules maybe ? It's not clear at the moment. Nasukawa has fought under both kickboxing and MMA rules before but I just can't picture Mayweather taking that risk.

At most it will be leg kicks but even then I doubt it.

McGregor commented on it, I actually laughed. Basically called it a rush hour 5 promo.

 

[Pompeius Magnus]

At most it will be leg kicks but even then I doubt it.

McGregor commented on it, I actually laughed. Basically called it a rush hour 5 promo.

Only kicks to the legs allowed could be possible, kinda like Ali vs Inoki. Even then, it would be a pretty big risk.

 

[Deebs]

[tweet]

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Only kicks to the legs allowed could be possible, kinda like Ali vs Inoki. Even then, it would be a pretty big risk.

I just noticed your avatar. ROFL.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

[tweet]

Fair match up. Should be interesting.

 

[Kriss E]

Joe Rogan asks some honest questions after the fight. He's challenging the UFC having money fights on a UFC broadcast, god damn.

The question he asked was if doing too many novelty/money fights make MMA/UFC mixed in with WWE type programming?

Not sure what everyone else's opinion is but mine is as long as fans want to see it and it's competitive I have little issue. Brock is a former UFC champ and big draw so easy sell. He's a massive human being so it's always interesting.

If it's CM Punk, Logan Paul and others guys who are fringe that's a different story. I don't think they can beat any UFC fighter in their division. I think Brock can still beat guys steroids or not. So there's at least that.

Joe Rogan also talked about how incredibly weird it is that the UFC decides who fights.
It is a huge conflict. Although he talked about that on his podcast.

I think some money fights make sense. Others don't. DC fighting Lesnar makes no sense at all.
He fought once in 7 years and he was on roids, which I know you love
It's a big joke.
If the UFC paid their guys properly, maybe they wouldn't accept these nonsense fights.

 

[Pompeius Magnus]

Joe Rogan also talked about how incredibly weird it is that the UFC decides who fights.
It is a huge conflict. Although he talked about that on his podcast.

I think some money fights make sense. Others don't. DC fighting Lesnar makes no sense at all.
He fought once in 7 years and he was on roids, which I know you love
It's a big joke.
If the UFC paid their guys properly, maybe they wouldn't accept these nonsense fights.

The freak show fights do end up hurting the belts and the whole ranking system quite a bit. I know I'd be pissed if I were a guy that busted his ass for a few years to get to the top 5 and I'm seeing a part-timer leapfrog right over me for a big money fight .

 

[Kriss E]

The freak show fights do end up hurting the belts and the whole ranking system quite a bit. I know I'd be pissed if I were a guy that busted his ass for a few years to get to the top 5 and I'm seeing a part-timer leapfrog right over me for a big money fight .

For sure. I'd be pissed if I was Stipe too. Brock Lesnar??? One fight in 7 years, which he lost. Last win is 8 years ago. He's in his 40s..Only 5 wins in his 9 MMA fights...
They're telling me this guy deserves a fight moreso than I deserve a rematch??
Man I'd be pissed.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Joe Rogan also talked about how incredibly weird it is that the UFC decides who fights.
It is a huge conflict. Although he talked about that on his podcast.

I think some money fights make sense. Others don't. DC fighting Lesnar makes no sense at all.
He fought once in 7 years and he was on roids, which I know you love
It's a big joke.
If the UFC paid their guys properly, maybe they wouldn't accept these nonsense fights.

I don't see what paying them does to change anything. Cormier gets paid well, fighting Brock gets him paid more.

I think money fights are fine is the Champ is active. If a champion is fighting 2 times a year minimum and squeezes in a money fight on top of it...sure.

If a champ fights once a year and the one time he times it's not letting your division progress that's unfair.

What CM did was completely unfair as he held division for 2 years.

DC fought 3 actual opponents in 11 months. Oezdemir(#1 or 2 contender at the time), Stipe and the #2 contender at HW in Lewis. He's active so I'll live with it.

For sure. I'd be pissed if I was Stipe too. Brock Lesnar??? One fight in 7 years, which he lost. Last win is 8 years ago. He's in his 40s..Only 5 wins in his 9 MMA fights...
They're telling me this guy deserves a fight moreso than I deserve a rematch??
Man I'd be pissed.

I am very confused as to what Stipe's problem is. In reality Stipe fights every 6 months and DC already fought at heavyweight twice in less time. DC will have 3 fights at heavyweight in 9 months time when all is said and done. Then he'll vacate. Stipe acts like he's been waiting years...


I get it, he deserves a shot at the belt 100% but dude, you fight every 6 months+ anyway and you'll probably get another shot within a calendar year after getting KO'd in round 1. It's not THAT bad.

DC is defending the belt twice in the same span Stipe would defend it once(maybe 1.5 as a ratio) so whatever.

If you're active, I don't care.

UFC also NEVER said Stipe won't get shot at the title. They never told him he has to prove himself or fight a contender. They just said Lesnar is first. We know if Stipe won vs DC he would've put Lesnar ahead of a lot of guys too.

 

[Kriss E]

I don't see what paying them does to change anything. Cormier gets paid well, fighting Brock gets him paid more.

I think money fights are fine is the Champ is active. If a champion is fighting 2 times a year minimum and squeezes in a money fight on top of it...sure.

If a champ fights once a year and the one time he times it's not letting your division progress that's unfair.

What CM did was completely unfair as he held division for 2 years.

DC fought 3 actual opponents in 11 months. Oezdemir(#1 or 2 contender at the time), Stipe and the #2 contender at HW in Lewis. He's active so I'll live with it.

Well...it's all about money. Those guys chase money fights because....they make less in others.
But sure, they will always be around.

I am very confused as to what Stipe's problem is. In reality Stipe fights every 6 months and DC already fought at heavyweight twice in less time. DC will have 3 fights at heavyweight in 9 months time when all is said and done. Then he'll vacate. Stipe acts like he's been waiting years...


I get it, he deserves a shot at the belt 100% but dude, you fight every 6 months+ anyway and you'll probably get another shot within a calendar year after getting KO'd in round 1. It's not THAT bad.

DC is defending the belt twice in the same span Stipe would defend it once(maybe 1.5 as a ratio) so whatever.

If you're active, I don't care.

UFC also NEVER said Stipe won't get shot at the title. They never told him he has to prove himself or fight a contender. They just said Lesnar is first. We know if Stipe won vs DC he would've put Lesnar ahead of a lot of guys too.

Well I can see why he'd be upset.
1- He has to wait for 2 more fights to happen, which means he'll have to wait around 1 full year to get his shot again.
2- Lesnar has no business fighting DC, let alone before Stipe.
3- They're not getting any younger and I'm sure he wants to avenge his fight while DC is still the Champ.
4- There is Lewis, Lesnar....Jones is also lurking in the back, wouldn't surprise me if he'd get a shot before Stipe as it would be a huge one for UFC.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Well...it's all about money. Those guys chase money fights because....they make less in others.
But sure, they will always be around.



Well I can see why he'd be upset.
1- He has to wait for 2 more fights to happen, which means he'll have to wait around 1 full year to get his shot again.
2- Lesnar has no business fighting DC, let alone before Stipe.
3- They're not getting any younger and I'm sure he wants to avenge his fight while DC is still the Champ.
4- There is Lewis, Lesnar....Jones is also lurking in the back, wouldn't surprise me if he'd get a shot before Stipe as it would be a huge one for UFC.

1) That's the thing, if DC retires in March as predicted he can be fighting for the vacant title the next PPV no problem. It's not quite the same as waiting for DC to get ready for another fight.

2) I agree but Stipe would've gladly fought Lesnar. So who cares. Is it okay that Lesnar fights for title if Stipe is champ? Stipe would've done it no problem.

3) Look, Dillashaw lost to Cruz by split decision and he nearly waited 2 years. Stipe got KO'd round 1. It happens. Stipe isn't getting shafted, it happens sometimes. He'll get a shot at title starting from April 2019, not even a year after he got KO'd in round 1 and facing no contender.

4) I'm not sure what Jones has to do with anything. Jones refused to fight DC at HW and refused to give DC a title shot at LHW if he wins back title. DC has said if Brock fight fails, then Jones at LHW is possible. So Jones fight is very unlikely.

Stipe may be the HW champ to defend the most times(3) but that number is still measly. Brock Lesnar defended the title successfully twice too whatever, it's not THAT special. Don't forget Brock and guys like Cain(2 defences, 2 time champ) would've had potentially more if not for injuries. Brock with a intestinal issue and Cain's back.

Oh, and a note about Brock. He was caught cheating like Jones but I'm not claiming he's the GOAT or even worthy of a fight. All I'm saying is if the champ isn't holding up the division and staying active then whatever. If Brock passes the USADA testing then so be it.