Post-Game Talk: Game 76: Washington at Nashville | 7 PM CDT | Fox Sports TN | SO Win 4-3

[gratefulpred]

Don't know which was rarer, seeing the Preds win a shootout tonight or almost hitting a bobcat running across the road on the way home!

 

[Dave is a killer]

I don't want Clune next year on this team at all

 

[Byrddog]

Don't know which was rarer, seeing the Preds win a shootout tonight or almost hitting a bobcat running across the road on the way home!

Im glad im not the only one who has seen a bobcat I thought I was crazier them im certified for saw two of them since new years. Must be the global warming thing there in more populated areas.

On a hocky note Im sure theres more in the east that would have preferred we get the win in regulation and truthfully it would have helped. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth to pull for the Wings but we need them to make the playoffs.


Hook's point streak broken but I do not see any way he does not finish the season here though it would be better for him to go down and help the Ad's playoff run. They should make it even without him and they will have him for the playoffs.


I like the way Weber has stepped up recently and while he is having his best year so far his Norris hopes are hurt by his periods of disappearance.

I know theres another bashing coming my way about Smith just because I bring it up!!!! But the guy just finished March with 2 goals and 5 assists for 7points in 17 games. If he had not had 3 points against the Sabres in the month it would have been more bleak. With the amount of icetime the guy has received I continue to believe hes not a significant part of the team getting better

 

[triggrman]

His PP point production ability. His ES points are far from the top of the pile. Having one of the worst GA/60 among those getting any talk about the Norris doesn't help his case either. If only he played the first 40 games the way he played in January.

Weber is the only one of those "elite" defensemen that actually is his teams shutdown defensive defenseman too.

It's a lot easier to score when you're not playing as tough of defensive match-ups.

Also, how many of these first half games did Shea Weber have a very green 19 year old rookie as his partner for 25 minutes a night?

 

[Preds Partisan]

I don't want Clune next year on this team at all

Sorry, the Predator Way requires at least one roster spot must be wasted every season.

 

[PFL615]

Im glad im not the only one who has seen a bobcat I thought I was crazier them im certified for saw two of them since new years. Must be the global warming thing there in more populated areas.

On a hocky note Im sure theres more in the east that would have preferred we get the win in regulation and truthfully it would have helped. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth to pull for the Wings but we need them to make the playoffs.


Hook's point streak broken but I do not see any way he does not finish the season here though it would be better for him to go down and help the Ad's playoff run. They should make it even without him and they will have him for the playoffs.


I like the way Weber has stepped up recently and while he is having his best year so far his Norris hopes are hurt by his periods of disappearance.

I know theres another bashing coming my way about Smith just because I bring it up!!!! But the guy just finished March with 2 goals and 5 assists for 7points in 17 games. If he had not had 3 points against the Sabres in the month it would have been more bleak. With the amount of icetime the guy has received I continue to believe hes not a significant part of the team getting better

The same thing could be said for the rest of the roster.

 

[Viqsi]

Sorry, the Predator Way requires at least one roster spot must be wasted every season.

"Wasted" is such a strong word. I prefer "underutilized".

Seriously, there has to be someone out there that can be picked up that brings what Clune does without being as bad at the game. Nothing against the guy himself and what he *does* contribute (let's be fair, he does do more than punch people and take dumb penalties), but there's got to be a reasonable upgrade out there somewhere.

 

[Byrddog]

"Wasted" is such a strong word. I prefer "underutilized".

Seriously, there has to be someone out there that can be picked up that brings what Clune does without being as bad at the game. Nothing against the guy himself and what he *does* contribute (let's be fair, he does do more than punch people and take dumb penalties), but there's got to be a reasonable upgrade out there somewhere.

We have already picked that player up. See Eaves Patrick Or for that matter Wilson Colin or Stalberg Victor or Cullen Matt ect ect. The main differences is better production from comparable 4th liners with much higher salaries.

If Clune were the biggest issue then im all in but I would retain him and his what 575k salary before any mentioned above.

 

[Viqsi]

We have already picked that player up. See Eaves Patrick Or for that matter Wilson Colin or Stalberg Victor or Cullen Matt ect ect. The main differences is better production from comparable 4th liners with much higher salaries.

If Clune were the biggest issue then im all in but I would retain him and his what 575k salary before any mentioned above.

Sorry, as soon as you put Colin Wilson in that category I kind of tuned your argument out.

 

[GeauxPreds]

We all think of Wilson as significantly better than everyone else on that list but in terms of living up to expectations he really hasn't this season. 8 goals and 20 assists (fewer goals and assits than Roman Josi) also fewer goals and equal points to Nick Spaling. Now some of that can be his ice time under trotz and coming off an injury, but for someone we drafted 7th overall that's just not the output you're looking for over 75 games and at age 24.

 

[jwhouk]

C'mon, let's just admit it - we think all of our guys suck, and we need to trade them away for prospects and draft picks.

 

[Johnz96*]

Im glad im not the only one who has seen a bobcat I thought I was crazier them im certified for saw two of them since new years. Must be the global warming thing there in more populated areas.

On a hocky note Im sure theres more in the east that would have preferred we get the win in regulation and truthfully it would have helped. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth to pull for the Wings but we need them to make the playoffs.


Hook's point streak broken but I do not see any way he does not finish the season here though it would be better for him to go down and help the Ad's playoff run. They should make it even without him and they will have him for the playoffs.


I like the way Weber has stepped up recently and while he is having his best year so far his Norris hopes are hurt by his periods of disappearance.

I know theres another bashing coming my way about Smith just because I bring it up!!!! But the guy just finished March with 2 goals and 5 assists for 7points in 17 games. If he had not had 3 points against the Sabres in the month it would have been more bleak. With the amount of icetime the guy has received I continue to believe hes not a significant part of the team getting better

I wonder if he might play for Sweden at the WCs. He played their last year. He finished with only 1 assist in 10 games, -2 with 10:08 of ice-time peer game but was one of the leaders in the tournament on Faceoffs with 58.2% and really good on the dot in Grand Rapids, I'm surprised he is doing so poorly on faceoffs here.

 

[Byrddog]

Sorry, as soon as you put Colin Wilson in that category I kind of tuned your argument out.

Sorry for your man crush on Wilson I have pretty much given up on the guy. I really wanted him to do well but it appears like it or not hes just another bottom 6 guy on a team filled with them.

Wilson 8 goals 20 asst for 28
Spaling 13 goals 15 asst for 28
Fiddler 11 g 15 a 26p 06 - 07
Fiddler 11g 21a 32p 07-08


Could go back more but fids and Spaling have been mostly 4th line there entire career and Wilsons results are very similar even with his increased role on higher lines. Again I really wanted to see the guy be a difference maker it does not appear he will be and this can be supported by his drop on the depth chart. If I were betting I see hiom moved either at the draft or before the start of next year.

 

[Viqsi]

Sorry for your man crush on Wilson

My what now?

Y'know, that's a good topic of discussion by itself. Really, how does that work exactly, anyways? I mean, I get that "man crush" is the new 'in' way to say "someone you irrationally like", but when one of the parties in the discussion happens to not be a man, then don't we kind of get into some kind of PC/not-PC rathole or something?

I have pretty much given up on the guy. I really wanted him to do well but it appears like it or not hes just another bottom 6 guy on a team filled with them.

Going strictly by point scoring - specifically, this year - is a little bit disingenuous. If his career was consistently like the way this year's production has gone, then you might have a point. But it's not - this year is a pretty obvious regression in production. Unless he stays here for the remainder of his career, he's still second-line capable. Not exactly great second-line capable, but he's there.

 

[glenngineer]

We move Wilson and we regret it. Power forward types take longer to develop much like defensemen. The other part of his lack of production is on his linemates. People say it shouldn't matter. I say it does for the fact that at least once a game he makes a pass that shouldn't get through to someone who is in a great shooting position and the person can't bury the shot or their like, how did this puck get on my stick, crap, it's already been knocked away. Player awareness needs to be higher overall. Some guys are always looking for the puck and ready to shoot. We have a bunch of guys that don't do that so Wilson's great passes are going to waste because either they're not ready to shoot or they kill the gnat on the goalies chest each and every time or we shoot and miss the net entirely.

Wilson finally looks comfortable in the center position and I have no idea why you draft a kid to be a center, move him to wing, make him a fixture in the doghouse, keep him at wing and then finally move him back to center after what, 6 years of being in the organization? This leads to the question again of are Trotz and Poile on the same page when it comes to these kids? I mean, why move up in the draft to get the kid that you want, who's played center his entire existence only to move him away from the thing he's most comfortable doing and then after years move him back? I'm sorry but how many other teams have taken players that high to jerk them around the forward positions? To me if we drafted him to be a center and a centerpiece of our future, we should've left him there from the get go and let him learn the position as opposed to being lost on the wing for a while. It's like hey, we want you to be this but in the meantime we're going to put you here and when you fail, because it's not what you are, you're going to get less ice time and be in the doghouse. Yeah, that's a smart way to develop players. So either this falls on Poile for his lack of ability to know if Wilson had that talent or if Trotz wants these kids to play his way and his way only be damned. I mean, here's Wilson coming off shoulder surgery in the offseason, is struggling, finally breaks out against Colorado, has a 4 point game that we win mind you and all Trotz has to say is that we didn't play the way he wanted us too. Wilson had fun out there and it showed. The other kids did as well. Then we went back to Predator hockey, lost the next game something like either 2-1 or 1-0 and I'm like, way to take any momentum Wilson might've had moving forward. I get it, you need to play D and pay attention to detail but at what cost? The fact that the kids don't want to come to the arena because at the end of the day, it's still a game?

I remember Trotz making a comment it's not about him developing kids, it's about the team winning. Well, start winning some games there Trotzy. Oh wait, it's too late for that. How about using the kids the way they were meant to be used as opposed to the constant doghouse rules and benching for not paying attention to detail yet allowing vets to get away with the same mistakes and giving them ice time. How about playing your best players more minutes like the big boy teams do. How about adapting your game to the way it's played in the NHL these days as opposed to 10 years ago.

I listened to Burnside talk with Callahan last night and said St. Louis and Hitchcock have adapted to the newer style and while they are not the defensive team most think they are, they are more a puck possession team and it's hard for another team to score when they don't have the puck. Well, we have a hard enough time scoring but when you play the dump and chase as much as we do, now wonder why we don't score, we don't have the puck. Why do you think Detroit has been good for so long, they have the puck more than the other team. When you have the puck you have the ability to shoot it, when you have the ability to shoot, you have the ability to score.

We also complain about the lack of production from Cullen. Well, how many times did we see him with the likes of Clune and some other fourth line scrub. Now that he's playing with more talented line mates, he and those linemates are producing more. Notice how Horny and he have been putting up better numbers lately. Amazing how that happens. Talent playing with more talent equals results. We then complain about Wilson's results yet who did he skate with the other night, Stalberg and MVG. While MVG is a nice story, he's a 30 year old journeyman AHL'er. Way to maximize what you can get out of Wilson pairing him with a guy who's never played in the NHL and the Renaldo Nehemiah of hockey in Stalberg.

Put your players in a position to succeed and more often than not they will.

 

[NSH615]

We move Wilson and we regret it. Power forward types take longer to develop much like defensemen. The other part of his lack of production is on his linemates. People say it shouldn't matter. I say it does for the fact that at least once a game he makes a pass that shouldn't get through to someone who is in a great shooting position and the person can't bury the shot or their like, how did this puck get on my stick, crap, it's already been knocked away. Player awareness needs to be higher overall. Some guys are always looking for the puck and ready to shoot. We have a bunch of guys that don't do that so Wilson's great passes are going to waste because either they're not ready to shoot or they kill the gnat on the goalies chest each and every time or we shoot and miss the net entirely.

Wilson finally looks comfortable in the center position and I have no idea why you draft a kid to be a center, move him to wing, make him a fixture in the doghouse, keep him at wing and then finally move him back to center after what, 6 years of being in the organization? This leads to the question again of are Trotz and Poile on the same page when it comes to these kids? I mean, why move up in the draft to get the kid that you want, who's played center his entire existence only to move him away from the thing he's most comfortable doing and then after years move him back? I'm sorry but how many other teams have taken players that high to jerk them around the forward positions? To me if we drafted him to be a center and a centerpiece of our future, we should've left him there from the get go and let him learn the position as opposed to being lost on the wing for a while. It's like hey, we want you to be this but in the meantime we're going to put you here and when you fail, because it's not what you are, you're going to get less ice time and be in the doghouse. Yeah, that's a smart way to develop players. So either this falls on Poile for his lack of ability to know if Wilson had that talent or if Trotz wants these kids to play his way and his way only be damned. I mean, here's Wilson coming off shoulder surgery in the offseason, is struggling, finally breaks out against Colorado, has a 4 point game that we win mind you and all Trotz has to say is that we didn't play the way he wanted us too. Wilson had fun out there and it showed. The other kids did as well. Then we went back to Predator hockey, lost the next game something like either 2-1 or 1-0 and I'm like, way to take any momentum Wilson might've had moving forward. I get it, you need to play D and pay attention to detail but at what cost? The fact that the kids don't want to come to the arena because at the end of the day, it's still a game?

I remember Trotz making a comment it's not about him developing kids, it's about the team winning. Well, start winning some games there Trotzy. Oh wait, it's too late for that. How about using the kids the way they were meant to be used as opposed to the constant doghouse rules and benching for not paying attention to detail yet allowing vets to get away with the same mistakes and giving them ice time. How about playing your best players more minutes like the big boy teams do. How about adapting your game to the way it's played in the NHL these days as opposed to 10 years ago.

I listened to Burnside talk with Callahan last night and said St. Louis and Hitchcock have adapted to the newer style and while they are not the defensive team most think they are, they are more a puck possession team and it's hard for another team to score when they don't have the puck. Well, we have a hard enough time scoring but when you play the dump and chase as much as we do, now wonder why we don't score, we don't have the puck. Why do you think Detroit has been good for so long, they have the puck more than the other team. When you have the puck you have the ability to shoot it, when you have the ability to shoot, you have the ability to score.

We also complain about the lack of production from Cullen. Well, how many times did we see him with the likes of Clune and some other fourth line scrub. Now that he's playing with more talented line mates, he and those linemates are producing more. Notice how Horny and he have been putting up better numbers lately. Amazing how that happens. Talent playing with more talent equals results. We then complain about Wilson's results yet who did he skate with the other night, Stalberg and MVG. While MVG is a nice story, he's a 30 year old journeyman AHL'er. Way to maximize what you can get out of Wilson pairing him with a guy who's never played in the NHL and the Renaldo Nehemiah of hockey in Stalberg.

Put your players in a position to succeed and more often than not they will.

This right here is the biggest issue this team has had all of this season. The players were not put into position to succeed. On top of that, most of the season the lines were essentially musical chairs. Had Trotz been putting the players into positions to succeed all year, the team would be in the playoffs already and that's without Rinne most of the year.

 

[Byrddog]

Glenn that 4th line scrub Spaling has better numbers than Wilson, Gaustad has more goals than Wilson. To even mention Clune is baffling he is in no matter of any imagination signed on this team as a scoring threat. He is a roll player, every team has role players. Clune is paid accordingly 537k. Now that's pretty much equal to league minimum range for non rookies. Wilsons 2 mil per was paid for pure potential which he has not lived up to. Wilsons three year contract is 6 mil which in average terms would require the average American to work for 134 years at the 44,137 average salary to equal his contract that he has yet to deserve. Blame Trotz if you must but the guy has had the icetime to produce.

 

[Legionnaire11]

To be fair to Wilson's

- even though it seems like he's been here forever, this is just his third full season.

- he's had to come back this year from the shoulder surgery

- he switched positions in the middle of the season

- his supporting cast at forward is among the worst in the entire league.


He's still tied for 5th among this forward group. Technically a "Top 6" player... if only on the Predators. He was going very well last year before the injury, if he doesn't turn it up again next season and particularly if Jarnkrok and Forsberg are here and producing, and/or a nice free agent forward. Then it's time to really be getting worried.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

No way do I give up on Wilson now. Especially if we're heading in a "youth movement" direction (Smith, Jarnkrok, Forsberg, Josi, MDZ, Jones, Watson...). He could be a great piece to add.

Just speculation, but I bet we hear this summer that his shoulder bothered him this entire season.

 

[NSH615]

Glenn that 4th line scrub Spaling has better numbers than Wilson, Gaustad has more goals than Wilson. To even mention Clune is baffling he is in no matter of any imagination signed on this team as a scoring threat. He is a roll player, every team has role players. Clune is paid accordingly 537k. Now that's pretty much equal to league minimum range for non rookies. Wilsons 2 mil per was paid for pure potential which he has not lived up to. Wilsons three year contract is 6 mil which in average terms would require the average American to work for 134 years at the 44,137 average salary to equal his contract that he has yet to deserve. Blame Trotz if you must but the guy has had the icetime to produce.

Getting ice time is just a piece of being setup for success. Playing with grinders does not help him at all.

he would be better off getting 8 minutes a night with quality linemates over 16 minutes a night with the leftovers.

 

[Byrddog]

Ok I get it.. We are all in to hold Trotz and or Poile accountable but that's not the case with players. That is an issue,

 

[NSH615]

Ok I get it.. We are all in to hold Trotz and or Poile accountable but that's not the case with players. That is an issue,

At this point my only gripe with Trotz is his questionable line ups.

 

[Byrddog]

At this point my only gripe with Trotz is his questionable line ups.

That's a method many people who manage people use. Try to put people in positions where they can succeed. Problem is that the miss mosh of talent does not mesh with other pieces. I have the same frustration that there moved around too much as well and can't develop chemistry. But given that even there has been little indication two forwards work together better much less three.

Hopefully with the addition of Jarnkrok will work out as we all hope. But there some decision to be made as to who plays center and what level. I bet we will all be surprised who plays center next season Fish is about the only lock I see but what line? But with Goose, Jarnkrok, Smith, Spaling Cullen Wilson Sissions Watson and Forsberg all in the mix Some are going to be playin other positions or still in Milwaukee. I do not see Watson having much of a chance to crack the roster due to the fact he would not make it on the wing. FF will likely do at least another year on the farm.

 

[Viqsi]

Wilson finally looks comfortable in the center position and I have no idea why you draft a kid to be a center, move him to wing, make him a fixture in the doghouse, keep him at wing and then finally move him back to center after what, 6 years of being in the organization? This leads to the question again of are Trotz and Poile on the same page when it comes to these kids? I mean, why move up in the draft to get the kid that you want, who's played center his entire existence only to move him away from the thing he's most comfortable doing and then after years move him back? I'm sorry but how many other teams have taken players that high to jerk them around the forward positions?

Many, actually. Tyler Seguin and Ryan Johansen are two high-profile current examples of doing exactly this, and we liked it so much with Johansen we're doing it again with Jenner and will probably do something similar with Wennberg. The idea is to get kids used to the pace of an NHL game without overwhelming them with the responsibility.

How about using the kids the way they were meant to be used as opposed to the constant doghouse rules and benching for not paying attention to detail yet allowing vets to get away with the same mistakes and giving them ice time.

Those vets will never get any better. They're known quantities and can be used in those situations. The kids can eventually get better, so teaching moments are useful and valuable. Sure, some of these kids could probably coast along on raw talent and do slightly better than the vet that's out there right now, but at that point you've given up on any hope of future progress. Seems kind of defeatist to me.

 

[triggrman]

Glenn that 4th line scrub Spaling has better numbers than Wilson, Gaustad has more goals than Wilson. To even mention Clune is baffling he is in no matter of any imagination signed on this team as a scoring threat. He is a roll player, every team has role players. Clune is paid accordingly 537k. Now that's pretty much equal to league minimum range for non rookies. Wilsons 2 mil per was paid for pure potential which he has not lived up to. Wilsons three year contract is 6 mil which in average terms would require the average American to work for 134 years at the 44,137 average salary to equal his contract that he has yet to deserve. Blame Trotz if you must but the guy has had the icetime to produce.

The 4th line scrub Spaling plays almost a minute more per game than the top 6 Wilson.