Post-Game Talk: GAME #63: Canucks 4 vs. Ducks 0 on Luke Schenn Appreciation Night

[vanarchy]

Schenn looked like a solid depth dman out there.

Between that and Pou driving play and protecting the puck, I was at a loss for words at some points of the game.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

The hatred for Gudbranson here is so pure it almost worries me. We get outshot by the 4th worst team in the league playing their 4th string goalie (who plays a .862 game) at home but the REAL reason we win in a shutout is because the wicked witch is dead. God help whoever gets voted the next scapegoat on this team by the "fans" here...

He does not fit the "scape goat" bill at all. He was amongst the worst no. 7 Dmen in the league (and even that is being somewhat generous) getting top4 money and somehow never getting the pressbox treatment no matter how poorly he performed.

If you want to look for someone getting unwarranted hate Id say coach Green, Goldobin and Granlund are far more unfairly targetted.

 

[swedehollow]

They got one this time, but the PP still looks abysmal. Einstein: ”: The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results”. That is exactly what they are doing at the moment. They start a cycle that goes from EP on the right, back to a defenceman, then to the left, where Boeser or Leivo shoots it. Not matter if there are a thousand defencemen in front of the goal and no matter if EP is completely open on the other side. Boeser and Leivo has the patience of 3-year olds and the vision of moles. Frustrating when you know it is so easy to fix.

 

[UK Canuck]

So, we finally have a vision of a post-Gudbranson world, and it was glorious

 

[tantalum]

I wasn't able to watch but I have to say I had a good hearty laugh this morning when I saw the score. Game 1 without Gudbranson is a shutout! Lol.

 

[Balls Mahoney]

I was wrong about Hutton by the way. I never felt he was going to be much more than a depth defender but he was very confident and competent playing with Stecher on the top pairing. Looked good. Kind of mind blowing Hutton-Stecher is our current top pairing and I'm enjoying it. Not sure if I'd feel the same way against a playoff team but it was good.

This is the joy of being a hockey fan is watching these kids develop into elite hockey players.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

Good work by the home team! But boy do the Ducks suck.

 

[PhilMick]

Pou driving play and protecting the puck, I was at a loss for words at some points of the game.

Whoa for real? That would be amazing.

 

[krutovsdonut]

Pearson also had negative value.

Del Zotto played every game for Anaheim and was then flipped for a higher pick with no salary retention.

The 7th rounder was completely wasted on having Mazanek back up Markstrom instead of Leighton backing up Markstrom for 1 game.

That whole thing was a complete mess aside from the cap dump we took back from Anaheim being better than a guy Benning gave a $12 million contract to only a year ago.

how does pearson have negative value? pearson had value to a pens team with cap issues when he was playing worse than he is now. they traded hagelin for him, yet you will not find a lot of pens fans lamenting that trade or dumping on pearson. they consider pearson decent but unexciting. they even think he can skate fine.

schenn was a feature not a bug for the mdz trade. he played well in utica and allowed them to trade gudbranson and still have 3 healthy nhl rhd without tanev. to get that for the difference between a 6th and 7th is plenty of value, even if we assume the market value for a depth dman was the same then as it was at the tdl, which is not a reliable assumption.

if we are going hypothetical on the goalie situation, canucks should have spent that 7th earlier to get mazanek to avoid exposing de pietro. the idea of them instead risking starting leighton, who is barely an ahl goalie, is dubious. it is also wrong to assume the same time line occurs if mazanek is not acquired. the flyers were in no hurry to activate elliot and only did so after the canucks traded for mazanek and within 24 hours after they signed leighton. flyers obviously wanted to get mckenna to the farm so that standoff could have gone on for a while.

pearson as he was playing for the pens is a decent pickup for a canuck team with no immediate cap issues. he's overpaid but not a full reclamation project based on current play. it's a little early to start the narrative for him.

 

[Intangibos]

how does pearson have negative value? pearson had value to a pens team with cap issues when he was playing worse than he is now. they traded hagelin for him, yet you will not find a lot of pens fans lamenting that trade or dumping on pearson. they consider pearson decent but unexciting. they even think he can skate fine.

Gudbranson apparently has value to same Pens team. I'm not sure if they're the gold standard for player evaluation right now.

 

[Cogburn]

how does pearson have negative value? pearson had value to a pens team with cap issues when he was playing worse than he is now. they traded hagelin for him, yet you will not find a lot of pens fans lamenting that trade or dumping on pearson. they consider pearson decent but unexciting. they even think he can skate fine.

schenn was a feature not a bug for the mdz trade. he played well in utica and allowed them to trade gudbranson and still have 3 healthy nhl rhd without tanev. to get that for the difference between a 6th and 7th is plenty of value, even if we assume the market value for a depth dman was the same then as it was at the tdl, which is not a reliable assumption.

if we are going hypothetical on the goalie situation, canucks should have spent that 7th earlier to get mazanek to avoid exposing de pietro. the idea of them instead risking starting leighton, who is barely an ahl goalie, is dubious. it is also wrong to assume the same time line occurs if mazanek is not acquired. the flyers were in no hurry to activate elliot and only did so after the canucks traded for mazanek and within 24 hours after they signed leighton. flyers obviously wanted to get mckenna to the farm so that standoff could have gone on for a while.

pearson as he was playing for the pens is a decent pickup for a canuck team with no immediate cap issues. he's overpaid but not a full reclamation project based on current play. it's a little early to start the narrative for him.

Pearson has negative value as he has now twice this season been traded for a player making close to the same amount of money with negative contributions to their team (according to their fan base). I'm not complaining as he might find a better fit here. Ditto Gud though.

Pearson is a good shooter and an above average playmaker. Great senses but he isn't very physical...so Virtanen and/or Horvat might make good partners for him.

Now if we can get Hughes signed when his team is finished we might have a couple of great adds to our powerplay with Spooner.

Schenn wasn't the key piece for MDZ. Neither was the pick. Clearing most of his salary was what did it for me. I expected Schenn to be a rotating call up for us. Then injuries happened and we cleared the similarly rated player in Gudbranson...and now we have a better fit after one game. I find it funny how quickly the average thoughts about him change on this board though:

1. Del Zotto sucks!
2. We dumped Del Zotto! Yay! We got a pick even!
3. Why did we waste that pick on a goalie? We already ruined DiPietro!
4. Benning sucks! Anaheim got a pick that is likely 15ish spots higher in St Louis' 6th compared to Anaheim's 7th!
5. Schenn is GOAT and has nothing to do with that trade.
Nuts. Schenn and Manzanec are worth more to me than a 6th round pick.

 

[MS]

how does pearson have negative value? pearson had value to a pens team with cap issues when he was playing worse than he is now. they traded hagelin for him, yet you will not find a lot of pens fans lamenting that trade or dumping on pearson. they consider pearson decent but unexciting. they even think he can skate fine.

schenn was a feature not a bug for the mdz trade. he played well in utica and allowed them to trade gudbranson and still have 3 healthy nhl rhd without tanev. to get that for the difference between a 6th and 7th is plenty of value, even if we assume the market value for a depth dman was the same then as it was at the tdl, which is not a reliable assumption.

if we are going hypothetical on the goalie situation, canucks should have spent that 7th earlier to get mazanek to avoid exposing de pietro. the idea of them instead risking starting leighton, who is barely an ahl goalie, is dubious. it is also wrong to assume the same time line occurs if mazanek is not acquired. the flyers were in no hurry to activate elliot and only did so after the canucks traded for mazanek and within 24 hours after they signed leighton. flyers obviously wanted to get mckenna to the farm so that standoff could have gone on for a while.

pearson as he was playing for the pens is a decent pickup for a canuck team with no immediate cap issues. he's overpaid but not a full reclamation project based on current play. it's a little early to start the narrative for him.

Pearson has 14 points in 61 games with 2+ years remaining on a deal paying him nearly $4 million/year. That’s literally the definition of a negative-value asset.

Likewise, Schenn cleared waivers earlier this year. This is pretty much concrete proof he was considered a negative value asset. Not a single NHL team wanted him for free on his current deal.

However, it’s par for the course for Benning to place value on an asset with negative value. Did it with Sbisa, did it with Prust.

 

[stampedingviking]

The 4th worst team in the NHL are outshooting us 2 to 1 but we have 3 goals on 13 shots against their 4th string goalie. Somehow this is "proof" of how bad Guddy was and how much better we are instantly on his departure. Hilarious.

Just watching the highlights, but the d has keep them to the outside pretty well.

 

[lush]

Pearson might be on a sharp decline or this season might be an anomaly. Who knows? Does it even matter?
I'm not sure why but I have confidence that if Pearson sucks he'll get the Gagner treatment next year.
But if Guddy were here there's no way they'd send him down. Nobody knows why, but there's no way they were sending him down.

 

[Melvin]

Schenn wasn't the key piece for MDZ. Neither was the pick. Clearing most of his salary was what did it for me. I expected Schenn to be a rotating call up for us. Then injuries happened and we cleared the similarly rated player in Gudbranson...and now we have a better fit after one game. I find it funny how quickly the average thoughts about him change on this board though:

1. Del Zotto sucks!
2. We dumped Del Zotto! Yay! We got a pick even!
3. Why did we waste that pick on a goalie? We already ruined DiPietro!
4. Benning sucks! Anaheim got a pick that is likely 15ish spots higher in St Louis' 6th compared to Anaheim's 7th!
5. Schenn is GOAT and has nothing to do with that trade.
Nuts. Schenn and Manzanec are worth more to me than a 6th round pick.

In what way are these the "average thoughts on the board?" (whatever the f*** that means.) Basically nobody has cared that MDZ got move for a slightly better pick yesterday, although it is mildly amusing.

Calling Schenn GOAT as a sarcastic strawman does nothing to help your argument, whatever it even is.

It's more productive to argue with specific people than to try to generalize the entire board. I have been pretty consisten in hating the MDZ trade since the moment it was made.

 

[krutovsdonut]

Pearson has 14 points in 61 games with 2+ years remaining on a deal paying him nearly $4 million/year. That’s literally the definition of a negative-value asset.

Likewise, Schenn cleared waivers earlier this year. This is pretty much concrete proof he was considered a negative value asset. Not a single NHL team wanted him for free on his current deal.

However, it’s par for the course for Benning to place value on an asset with negative value. Did it with Sbisa, did it with Prust.

we should probably define value. to me there is roster value (e.g., is he a guy you would want on an nhl roster disregarding of salary), market value (e.g., is he a guy earning his salary) and trade value (e.g., is he a guy whose combination of roster and market value makes him desirable). pearson has roster value, is presently paid above his market value, but still has enough roster value to retain some trade value.

pearson had a horrible start but was still traded for hagelin 3 months ago in a trade nobody at the time assessed as one sided and has since improved his play. he was not held fully accountable for the slump based on track record and because nobody would doubt pearson is a complimentary player, and all the guys driving play on the kings were in slumps. he has failed to fully catch fire with the pens, but pearson since the trade has bounced back to a 17 goal pace over 82 games with the pens which is not bad. he's not worth his salary this year, and the term is a risk, but he still has some roster and trade market value as a big strong 26 year old all rounder who can patrol the wing and score given the chance, and could bounce back to be more.

pearson could go off a cliff from here or he could bounce back, or wyswig. in 2 out of the 3 of those outcomes he is a good to great return value for gudbranson. if he goes off a cliff slowly, he might still be acceptable return.

and as for schenn, buriable depth nhl players that clear waivers change hands for value regularly. schenn was arguably worth more in the ahl than in the nhl. i am sure anaheim would have dealt him to someone if they hadn't upgraded to mdz.

 

[Horse McHindu]

So I fell asleep for about 10 minutes and had a dream that Benning farted in Ryan Kesler’s Face.

 

[Hit the post]

Pearson might be on a sharp decline or this season might be an anomaly. Who knows? Does it even matter?
I'm not sure why but I have confidence that if Pearson sucks he'll get the Gagner treatment next year.
But if Guddy were here there's no way they'd send him down. Nobody knows why, but there's no way they were sending him down.

Guds had at least a few moments when he wasnt bloody awful ( when Edler was carrying him). Schaller though much cheaper, has at best maybe a couple good shifts as a Canuck. Total crap.

 

[kanuck87]

Pearson has 14 points in 61 games with 2+ years remaining on a deal paying him nearly $4 million/year. That’s literally the definition of a negative-value asset.

Likewise, Schenn cleared waivers earlier this year. This is pretty much concrete proof he was considered a negative value asset. Not a single NHL team wanted him for free on his current deal.

However, it’s par for the course for Benning to place value on an asset with negative value. Did it with Sbisa, did it with Prust.

I don't believe that Pearson has negative value just yet. He has a very recent track record of being a solid middle-6 player for a good Kings team and he was traded earlier for hagelin who was recently traded again for a 3rd round pick.

With 2 years and 3.75 million left on his contract, I see some teams who strike out on free agency taking a chance on Pearson should we decide to shop him in the off-season, not that I think we will.

 

[Hit the post]

Good work by the home team! But boy do the Ducks suck.

I'm quenching my thirst on Keslers tears.

 

[Hit the post]

I don't believe that Pearson has negative value just yet. He has a very recent track record of being a solid middle-6 player for a good Kings team and he was traded earlier for hagelin who was recently traded again for a 3rd round pick.

With 2 years and 3.75 million left on his contract, I see some teams who strike out on free agency taking a chance on Pearson should we decide to shop him in the off-season, not that I think we will.

Easier to "hide" a bad contract up front than on the blue line . Even if he turns out to be Schaller s twin, we come out ahead.

 

[Ben White]

Ok so we’re back to EP having to steal the puck himself to get it. Boeser is a high end second liner right now, nothing more nothing less.

 

[Zippgunn]

Ok so we’re back to EP having to steal the puck himself to get it. Boeser is a high end second liner right now, nothing more nothing less.

...yet the consensus here is that he'll be worth $7 million when he re-signs...

 

[canuckfan75]

Josh Leivo had a really good game. last night. I was really impressive .....

 

[Ben White]

...yet the consensus here is that he'll be worth $7 million when he re-signs...

Yep, but I disagree...