GDT: Game 2: Penguins @ Coyotes ~ 7:00 P.M. MST ~ 10/10/15 ~ FS Arizona

[Grvmnd]

I am sure that the Arizona Coyotes organization is eager and willing to pander to the 15 or so posters on the Arizona board of HF and so will throw us a bone by waiving Chip. Really, who really gives a **** what we think about Chipchura.

I also doubt the wisdom of firing somebody from his job as a symbolic gesture.

Honestly, everyone is still in 'this is going to be a 'sucky long year' mode. We dont know what to do when we win. It's weird and feels awkward.

 

[Plub]

I am sure that the Arizona Coyotes organization is eager and willing to pander to the 15 or so posters on the Arizona board of HF and so will throw us a bone by waiving Chip. Really, who really gives a **** what we think about Chipchura.

I also doubt the wisdom of firing somebody from his job as a symbolic gesture.

Right, because they've proven to be the the epicenter for genius hockey decisions.

And it doesn't matter what we "think" about Chip. It is what Chip is that matters. He's a ****** hockey player that provides nothing. That's what matters.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

No really? Had no idea. Might as well never post anything.

Post whatever you want. Your posts are usually fantastic. This time I take exception to one. There's no groundswell of support to can Chipchura, just frustration for when he scored goals in meaningless games.

Chip should have been cut after his awful play in 2014. They'll buyout a guy making 5 million bucks but keep around a less than replacement level scrub whose spot is easily filled in by a random minor league player.

If you don't think teams send messages to their fans that changes are being made then I don't know what to say. I guess you missed most coaching firings in the history of sports.

Scapegoat much? Chip wasn't the cause of the Coyotes poor play these last two years. We all know that. So, with an exciting team playing better than expected at the beginning of the season, just what message are you asking the team to send? Perhaps we should rub Chip with incense and fragrant oils and then burn him at some altar?

 

[SniperHF]

Scapegoat much?

Nope, culture change.

I usually don't go on about this because it's utterly insignificant at this point, but it was brought up so what the heck. There was a a group of about 6 players from late 2013 to early 2015 that are the epitome of everything that was wrong with the last few years. They should be gone. Thankfully most of them are now.

There's no groundswell

It's the Coyotes so that goes for just about anything.

 

[Bonsai Tree]

We asked Chipchura to play a role last year for which he was totally unsuited. He's a 3rd or 4th line player, and if you asked me, he's playing better than Shane Doan so far this year. Anyone want to waive THAT overpaid bottom 6 player? Didn't think so. At least Chip isn't overpaid. He provides more bang for the buck than the benighted Sir Doan the Loyal at this point.

 

[Matias Maccete]

Yea, there was even a complaint on this board about Grossman. If Smith becomes a top 10 goalie this season he should give a third of his pay to Grossman for clearing the crease out for him.

That would be me and I stand by that. He's good at shoving guys after the whistle, which looks like crease clearing, but during the play he does very little. It's the same as Campbell last year, a lot of people on here raved about his crease clearing abilities but he didn't really do a whole lot. I know almost everyone disagrees but whatever.

He's also gotten beat one on one quite a few times already, malkin skated right by him untouched. His play with the puck isn't as bad as it looks(which looks atrocious, and is instead merely bad), but it's also sub par. He's big, but because of his poor mobility he's very rarely able to do anything with his size.

Not to mention if it's grossman "clearing the crease" that is making smith better, why is smith playing so well the other 40 minutes when he isn't on the ice? Smith is better because he's not trying to take the whole team on his back every night. He's a bit of a headcase(like most goalies), so him getting his head on straight is having a big effect on his game. Hopefully it lasts.

We asked Chipchura to play a role last year for which he was totally unsuited. He's a 3rd or 4th line player, and if you asked me, he's playing better than Shane Doan so far this year. Anyone want to waive THAT overpaid bottom 6 player? Didn't think so. At least Chip isn't overpaid. He provides more bang for the buck than the benighted Sir Doan the Loyal at this point.

Do you really think that? Honestly I don't mean to offend but I want to make sure you're not just exaggerating to make a point.

 

[SniperHF]

We asked Chipchura to play a role last year for which he was totally unsuited. He's a 3rd or 4th line player, and if you asked me, he's playing better than Shane Doan so far this year. Anyone want to waive THAT overpaid bottom 6 player? Didn't think so. At least Chip isn't overpaid. He provides more bang for the buck than the benighted Sir Doan the Loyal at this point.

If bang for the buck were the only criteria that could make sense.
Also I'd dispute Chip providing any "bang" to begin with. Especially relating to his current deal.

I merely asked that the team do the minimum in cleaning out the complacent types where it's extremely easy to do so. I consider it a debt unpaid.

Doan? Doan is a sunk cost and everybody knew his contact toward the end wouldn't be worth what it is. At least he can score some goals on the PP and generally annoy goalies in front of the net. Those are skills not nearly as easy to find as random 4th liner talents. So yeah purely on hockey skills, Doan @ 4.5 > Chip at 900k. Pretty easily actually.

 

[rt]

Martinook has clearly taken Chipchuras job. So why does Chipchura have a job? Dave Tippett loves him with feelings. So many feels.

 

[rt]

SniperHF is correct. As usual

 

[Sinurgy]

Why any of you care so passionately one way or the other about Chipchura is absolutely perplexing. The term equally ******** comes to mind.

 

[Puck possession wins]

Maybe he has good fancy stats?

 

[Lyotes]

I say they waive him 3 times and when he makes it through that kind of adversity and still remains with the team...give him a letter for his jersey.

 

[Jakey53]

Chips play is OK, not great not bad. We will see what Tip thinks next game. Chip could be replaced by Joe V or maybe Scott. I don't see Martinook coming out of the line up since he has been solid. Z will be back in for Elliot. Duclair will stay in the line up but needs to be better on D and avoid neutral zone/blue line turnovers. Vermette/Bods need to get it going a little more, have not been factors so far.

Correct. Vermette has been invisible which is not like him. It has only been two games so not really worried.

 

[Jakey53]

We asked Chipchura to play a role last year for which he was totally unsuited. He's a 3rd or 4th line player, and if you asked me, he's playing better than Shane Doan so far this year. Anyone want to waive THAT overpaid bottom 6 player? Didn't think so. At least Chip isn't overpaid. He provides more bang for the buck than the benighted Sir Doan the Loyal at this point.

Come on now, Doan and Chip should never be used in the same sentence. Doan is a very useful player, under rated by most on these boards. He can still play the game at a high level.

 

[Jakey53]

Martinook has clearly taken Chipchuras job. So why does Chipchura have a job? Dave Tippett loves him with feelings. So many feels.

I don't think Vitale or Chip make it through the year with the Coyotes. Now, I think it comes down to timing with letting the rookies settle in a bit more, injuries to other teams etc. HS was having a pretty decent training camp then got injured, so I believe he is next in line to bring up when we clear a spot. In the meantime, I have no problem with Chip, Vitale and Scott rotating in the line up.

 

[Bandit34]

This forum needs a Kyle Chipchura thread.

 

[The Feckless Puck]

Smitty started seeing the psychologist after the all-star break last year, and his stats have improved exponentially since then. Hopeffully, it'll be enough to let Smitty keep his head out of his permanently. When he's not spazzing out, he's a very talented goalie.

Smitty is a fine goalie when he plays a simple game. When he starts showing off, glaring at people, throwing his stick, flopping like a dead fish or assassinated President, etc., is when he gets into trouble.

That would be me and I stand by that. He's good at shoving guys after the whistle, which looks like crease clearing, but during the play he does very little. It's the same as Campbell last year, a lot of people on here raved about his crease clearing abilities but he didn't really do a whole lot. I know almost everyone disagrees but whatever.

I've only seen him play in person once, but what I saw wasn't anything disastrous. More than anything he brings attitude, which almost none of our D possessed last year except Murphy. He may have a limited skill set everywhere but his own end, but in his end he plays a self-possessed game. That's valuable, IMO, even though he does have feet of lead and no outlet shot.

Come on now, Doan and Chip should never be used in the same sentence. Doan is a very useful player, under rated by most on these boards. He can still play the game at a high level.

Look, I love Doan. Been my favorite player ever since I started watching hockey. I want him immortalized in statute form about 7 femtoseconds after he retires. But he doesn't have the speed anymore to play at the game's natural pace. He's still strong as an ox and when he's engaged he can bring an edge to the game, but his days on the top lines should be over.

I personally hope he retires after this season, because a) I don't want to see him sign with another franchise or relocate elsewhere with this one and b) I would hate to see him just slowly erode into a space-filler because he can't let go.

This forum needs a Kyle Chipchura thread.

Every thread on this forum seems to be a Kyle Chipchura thread.

 

[cobra427]

I don't think Vitale or Chip make it through the year with the Coyotes. Now, I think it comes down to timing with letting the rookies settle in a bit more, injuries to other teams etc. HS was having a pretty decent training camp then got injured, so I believe he is next in line to bring up when we clear a spot. In the meantime, I have no problem with Chip, Vitale and Scott rotating in the line up.

Exactly, Chip/Vitale/Scott are the last spot on the roster. I doubt the 10 minutes or less of playing time the 12th forward gets really effects us too much. Chip/Vitale will go the way of Klink/Schlemko/Moss eventually. We basically have Duclair/Domi/Martinook/Dhalback as rookies with Reider/Murphy still being very young players. When Elliot is in the line up, another young guy. Basically, 1/3 of our line up is very young, so I am not sure we replace the Chip/Vitale/Scott rotation with another rookie, it might be too much to ask.

If Chip played poor enough, Vitale or Scott will be in the line up. Let the 3 of them fight it out for now.

 

[kihekah19*]

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1963535&page=5

Gdt post 117 is the first comment stating it. You and Jake can get your bifocals and read them to each other if necessary.

That's the exact play, Muppet. Thanks.

I'm not stating that he did or did not turn the puck over, but you went from "multiple turnovers" that "created chances" to this one incident!

Too funny.

 

[cobra427]

Correct. Vermette has been invisible which is not like him. It has only been two games so not really worried.

For whatever reason, it takes the veterans 10-15 games to get going sometimes. Maybe it is still early and they are just not jacked up at the beginning of the season. I am hoping Doan/Bods/Vermette get it going sooner rather than later. Smith has been great but he has something to prove. I expect Bods to get going since this is his UFA year.

The rookies on the other hand, can come out flying, and we are seeing some of that production now. 10-15 games into the season, the rookies could slow down as systems get more in place and veterans are up to speed. Time will tell, but I for one am enjoying our surprising start!

 

[kihekah19*]

Yes, in fact, giveaway and takeaway statistics are literally the only the way to determine the quality of player's performance. It certainly has nothing to do with Chip's poor passing ability, bad decision making, terrible stickhandling, lazy forechecking, or the fact that he's a light enforcer, who literally never sticks up for our guys. Ever. But no, he didn't technically have a giveaway on the stat sheet, so it's all good.

You guys argue that Chip doesn't look horrible (which he does) yet can't seem to point out anything positive that he contributes. So if the best case we can argue for Chip, is that he's possibly not a complete piece of crap, then why keep him around, when we can replace him with a younger, hungrier player, who has higher upside?

Now that is a fair statement, based on opinion. I would wager that he's in the lineup because he is a safe bet at being more responsible than the alternatives. But to sit at the keyboard making statements of grandeur that defy fact, serves no purpose, but to inflame the masses.

 

[kihekah19*]

Everyone knows a quick perusal of the stat line is a better way to evaluate than watching tape, guys. How dare you question the wisdom of Heckle and Jeckle...

You'll find I'm nearly always the last guy to go to stats.

 

[kihekah19*]

Not defending Chip at all, in fact I have stated many times that I would like to see his spot taken by a rookie. What I did say was that Chip's play in the first two games has not hurt this team.

That is indeed what you said and you have been consistent with that. I believe Chip will be gone, or sent down when there is a better option, despite the rhetoric of the posters here.

 

[kihekah19*]

Chips play is OK, not great not bad. We will see what Tip thinks next game. Chip could be replaced by Joe V or maybe Scott. I don't see Martinook coming out of the line up since he has been solid.

An excellent and fair analysis.

 

[kihekah19*]

I am sure that the Arizona Coyotes organization is eager and willing to pander to the 15 or so posters on the Arizona board of HF and so will throw us a bone by waiving Chip. Really, who really gives a **** what we think about Chipchura.

I also doubt the wisdom of firing somebody from his job as a symbolic gesture.