Post-Game Talk: Game 2 .... Oh boy. (Mod Warning #5)

[Stef*]

Pens defence has been soft ever since Hal Gill left.

Good one lol
Hall " the great wall of china" gill

 

[KIRK]

Yup. Meanwhile, we won the Cup with Gill-Scuderi as the shutdown pairing. Kris Letang is NOT the problem with our defense. But he needs a steady partner (Scuderi?) and some support in terms of both steadier defensemen on the other pairings and a new system.




Oh please. Julien was 10 minutes away from losing his job. And he was an OT loss away from losing his job in 2011, too! Hartley is Calgary's coach now so he won't be available for a little while but who cares? Why are recycled coaches the way to go?

It's time to think outside the box. Ron Francis. Ulf Samuelsson. Wayne Gretzky. Shawn Simpson. Those are some of the guys I'd like to see coaching this team, for various reasons. And with a new head coach hopefully comes a whole new group of assistants. They go hand-in-hand.

Um, ok . . .

 

[Crafton]

Yup. Meanwhile, we won the Cup with Gill-Scuderi as the shutdown pairing. Kris Letang is NOT the problem with our defense. But he needs a steady partner (Scuderi?) and some support in terms of both steadier defensemen on the other pairings and a new system.

Scuds has been solid when paired with both Voynov and Doughty. he's affordable if they start actually using the young d-men to fill out the pairings. a Nisky-Murray third pairing next year would make 4.5M. that far too much.

 

[Shady Machine]

Ah. Thank you.

The one and only positive comment that I've read regarding that fight.

I mean... I thought that's the sort of thing you look for in your top players, when this time of year rolls around? Particularly when you are down and momentum is tough to come by. Which is it? Or does it only apply if you are a good ol' Canadian farmhand? Keep your narratives straight, people.

Yeah the reactions around here and from the Pens were pretty strange. I loved every minute of it. Yeah it took him off the PP, but he showed emotion and fought a guy that was frustrating Sid. It was a great thing for the team (I thought). If I'm a penguin player and I see one of my stars step up and do that, then I want to go out there and take it to Boston that much more.

 

[KIRK]

Yeah the reactions around here and from the Pens were pretty strange. I loved every minute of it. Yeah it took him off the PP, but he showed emotion and fought a guy that was frustrating Sid. It was a great thing for the team (I thought). If I'm a penguin player and I see one of my stars step up and do that, then I want to go out there and take it to Boston that much more.

Read the Shawn Thorton quote I put on the other page. To a man, it was 'if Bergeron is doing it, then we've got to step up'.

As I said, why show heart on this team if you're thrown under the bus for it?

 

[sexyllama]

Now that you mention it, I saw this earlier..

Dejan Kovacevic @Dejan_Kovacevic
If #Pens do, in fact, start Jarome Iginla in goal for Game 3, they'll also make him switch blocker and glove hands. #IggyTheGoalie

Funny... but at this point, I literally would not be stunned if DB did this. I just don't understand why he won't use Iginla at RW.

 

[ZapRowsdower13]

Engo was fantastic last night. He was physical in a good way.

Anyone blaming anyone in the bottom pairing/bottom 6 should realize that this team lives and dies by how its top 6 is producing.

As a counter-balance to Thornton and Lucic. Engelland played well last night in belongs in the lineup against a team like Boston.

Engelland was their best player last night

He cleared the net like a beast. He battled Lucic all night and won. He is a warrior

Thanks. Didn't think he was the problem or bad anyways. Just an odd choice. I didn't like it at first bc its saying to the Bruins 'hey let's fight this out' and I don't want to do that with the Bruins. If he's gonna battle and just be there in case it needs to be done ok fine. The lack of speed on the bottom pair worries me but they are the bottom pair so depends on how much time they get.

 

[plaidchuck]

Read the Shawn Thorton quote I put on the other page. To a man, it was 'if Bergeron is doing it, then we've got to step up'.

As I said, why show heart on this team if you're thrown under the bus for it?

I'd say the puzzling thing is why did Malkin have to fight with all of these warm bottom 6 bodies skating around not contributing anything else.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Yeah the reactions around here and from the Pens were pretty strange. I loved every minute of it. Yeah it took him off the PP, but he showed emotion and fought a guy that was frustrating Sid. It was a great thing for the team (I thought). If I'm a penguin player and I see one of my stars step up and do that, then I want to go out there and take it to Boston that much more.

I immediately jumped on here to see the reactions. I figured for sure it would be overwhelmingly positive, based on all of the armchair QB's opinions on what Malkin "needs" to do in order to step up his play.

Needless to say, I wasn't browsing the forum too long. I just... don't really understand what people want from the guy. The goalposts move every single game.

 

[spcastlemagic]

Now that you mention it, I saw this earlier..

Dejan Kovacevic @Dejan_Kovacevic
If #Pens do, in fact, start Jarome Iginla in goal for Game 3, they'll also make him switch blocker and glove hands. #IggyTheGoalie

Kovacevic has been solid lately. Bylsma's stupidity has broken him

 

[Shady Machine]

I'd say the puzzling thing is why did Malkin have to fight with all of these warm bottom 6 bodies skating around not contributing anything else.

He didn't "need to" but he was frustrated and wanted to rile the team up. It apparently backfired.

 

[sexyllama]

Kovacevic has been solid lately. Bylsma's stupidity has broken him

Kova wrote and article last night and I quote, "The defense isn't even the problem..."

 

[Waffle Fries]

My problem with Engelland playing is that it means that Niskanen and Letang are paired together.

I hate that pairing so much. Letang plays his worst hockey when paired with him, and this hasn't happened just once or twice, it's nearly every time they are together.

I might even hate it more than Iggy at LW. And that's saying something.

If Engelland played and Nisky sat for Despres, then I'd be fine with it.

 

[Terrapin]

You know, in one sense, maybe Bylsma's right about the team needing an attitude adjustment, although it includes him too. I think back to the Malkin-Bergeron fight. Here's something Shawn Thorton said:

"When he gets that riled up it's usually for a good reason. I like it. He's not afraid to step up when he has to. We're behind him 100 percent and it gets the guys fired up when you see him get that emotionally involved. If you weren't into it, it probably forces you to be into it at that point."

Did anyone hear anything like that from the Pens, from the coach on down? Two guys who don't fight fought. Both said to their respective teams 'c'mon boys, let's pick it up a notch'. The B's to a man said 'damn straight' and have dominated this series since. The Pens, from the coach to the leader players, lamented the 'mistake' instead of listening to the message.

I wonder, in the end, if this doesn't really epitomize what's wrong with this team's attitude. In the playoffs, there's no offensive star, no designated fighter. Everyone sacrifices and lays it all on the line. Bergeron did when his team needed to kick it up a notch, and his team followed. Malkin unexpectedly did when his team just needed that one last little push, and the Pens yet again turtled. Why show heart when the guy least expected to show it gets roundly critiqued for doing so?

Post of the year right here. Sums up the team's attitude perfectly from the players on up. And by 'up', I'm not just stopping at Bylsma.

 

[KIRK]

He didn't "need to" but he was frustrated and wanted to rile the team up. It apparently backfired.

Bergeron didn't 'need to' either. But, you won't find a guy in Boston saying that. And, if had been Dupuis rather than Geno that he fought, you still wouldn't find a guy in Boston saying that. To a man, unlike the heartless Pens, that it was Bergeron fighting was a message to everyone of 'let's go, let's pick it up'. And, that's what Boston did.

 

[sexyllama]

BTW- Our DEFENSE is definitely NOT SOFT.

Our problem is THEY DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY SHOULD BE DOING...

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Post of the year right here. Sums up the team's attitude perfectly from the players on up. And by 'up', I'm not just stopping at Bylsma.

I honestly wouldn't fault Malkin one bit if he simply coasted the rest of the way through what is likely going to be a very short series. He won't because that isn't in his DNA. But I wouldn't blame him.

His team's response to his gesture couldn't have been more indifferent. And that's just sad.

 

[lastcupever75]

How is it ridiculous? The team lacks a big bodied fourth line player. Too many under-sized bottom-six wingers are on the team.

We might be bigger. But we're certainly not tougher


Not even close

 

[BCeagle]

Post of the year right here. Sums up the team's attitude perfectly from the players on up. And by 'up', I'm not just stopping at Bylsma.

Maybe all the transactions before the playoffs changed the team chemistry as they seem to be playing well at the time. New players take time to adjust and feel part of the team.

It was apparent in the 2nd game when you have players falling down and skating into each other but some of that has to do with Boston playing well too and shutting down the star players so far.

The Bruins team chemistry is as good as I have seen it all season, just at the right time and I think Iggy spurning the Bruins was an extra motivation for the players to play well.

The Bruins so far lucked out, they were able to keep their young players when the trade fell through and so far Iggy has zero points in this series along with other star players.

 

[Terrapin]

I honestly wouldn't fault Malkin one bit if he simply coasted the rest of the way through what is likely going to be a very short series. He won't because that isn't in his DNA. But I wouldn't blame him.

His team's response to his gesture couldn't have been more indifferent. And that's just sad.

Even if Malkin fighting was the absolute worst decision anyone's made in the history of the world, your coach and teammates need to back you. It was pathetic that they didn't, and as Kirk said, set the tone for the rest of that game and game 2. Hell, MAF looks like a complete fool in net, and to a man they make excuses for him. Remember all the questionable hits he dealt with this year, Cloutier from Philly delivering about 12 cross checks in his back? And not a peep of response from anyone on the team.

You wouldn't blame him for coasting the rest of the series? I wouldn't blame him if he told Shero to go F himself when it comes to his next contract. If Bylsma is still the coach, I honestly can't see Geno resigning.

 

[KIRK]

Even if Malkin fighting was the absolute worst decision anyone's made in the history of the world, your coach and teammates need to back you. It was pathetic that they didn't, and as Kirk said, set the tone for the rest of that game and game 2. Hell, MAF looks like a complete fool in net, and to a man they make excuses for him. Remember all the questionable hits he dealt with this year, Cloutier from Philly delivering about 12 cross checks in his back? And not a peep of response from anyone on the team.

You wouldn't blame him for coasting the rest of the series? I wouldn't blame him if he told Shero to go F himself when it comes to his next contract. If Bylsma is still the coach, I honestly can't see Geno resigning.

Why should he? I mean, even if Bylsma is fired, why shouldn't he be like Staal and say 'I'd like to stay, but I also want to consider what my options will be'. Contrary to popular belief, I think Malkin hates this country club ****. Look at the type of guys to whom he responds: Therrien, Maurice, King. You telling me Kovy won't be telling him this summer of the wonders of playing for DeBoer? How about his other Russian buddies telling him about playing on structured teams where the coach doesn't play you a minute less in a period than Craig ******* Adams and will use you in all situations and where you're teammates will go to war to protect you. Only two guys Malkin EVER had on the Pens who fit THAT bill were Talbot and Malone.

EDIT: I don't think he's wired that way. Too bad. It's at a time like this where him actually having a little Jagr in him and calling out the BS would make this debacle slightly entertaining.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Even if Malkin fighting was the absolute worst decision anyone's made in the history of the world, your coach and teammates need to back you. It was pathetic that they didn't, and as Kirk said, set the tone for the rest of that game and game 2. Hell, MAF looks like a complete fool in net, and to a man they make excuses for him. Remember all the questionable hits he dealt with this year, Cloutier from Philly delivering about 12 cross checks in his back? And not a peep of response from anyone on the team.

You wouldn't blame him for coasting the rest of the series? I wouldn't blame him if he told Shero to go F himself when it comes to his next contract. If Bylsma is still the coach, I honestly can't see Geno resigning.

I hear ya. Well said.

And scary to think of. You can't really seriously call yourself a contender anymore if two ultra-competitive, game-changing centers say "thanks but no thanks" to your team in such a short span of time. Hopefully it won't be the case with Malkin.

 

[KIRK]

I hear ya. Well said.

And scary to think of. You can't really seriously call yourself a contender anymore if two ultra-competitive, game-changing centers say "thanks but no thanks" to your team in such a short span of time. Hopefully it won't be the case with Malkin.

Hopefully not.

Here's a thought: What if Ray Shero had stuck with the 2008 model for building the team? Three centers, yes, but really two generational centers surrounded by the equivalent of two good, playoff caliber wingers each and then build from there. That team was better than 2009. Built for the playoffs before hitting the rookie cup jitters and having Malkin hurt against Detroit. As I said elsewhere, the Pens advantage is that they have Sid and Geno. How Shero has built the team from there has served to neuter, rather than exploit, the advantage.

 

[spcastlemagic]

Kova wrote and article last night and I quote, "The defense isn't even the problem..."

I just checked it out - it would be helpful to include what's after the ellipse. He acknowledges that the defense is a weakness, but one that can be (and should be) covered up by a puck possession, grinding, high pressure offense. I can't argue with that. When your forwards don't win a single battle in the offensive zone, your defense will blow.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Hopefully not.

Here's a thought: What if Ray Shero had stuck with the 2008 model for building the team? Three centers, yes, but really two generational centers surrounded by the equivalent of two good, playoff caliber wingers each and then build from there. That team was better than 2009. Built for the playoffs before hitting the rookie cup jitters and having Malkin hurt against Detroit. As I said elsewhere, the Pens advantage is that they have Sid and Geno. How Shero has built the team from there has served to neuter, rather than exploit, the advantage.

I understand what you're driving at but I really don't have any problem with Shero, for the most part. Other than the fact that he gives his maroon head coach too much leeway and too many options. As ridiculous as that sounds.