GDT: Game #12 Columbus Blue Jackets @ San Jose SHARKS 11/3/15 7:30pm PST CSNCa

[CrypTic]

Part of the issue is Donskoi isn't a good fit with the Joes, he may be better on the 3rd or 4th line. That line need someone who is good without the puck, not someone who wants to play with it. Also, Tierney is really struggling right now as a 3rd line center, and I'm afraid that Wingels bad play from last season isn't an aberration. Finally, a 4th line running both Lerg and/or Brown every night is simply not good enough. The 4th line matters with DeBoer, he is a coach who wants to roll 4 lines.

The other issue is the PK, I have no idea how to solve that. It doesn't help that the reffing has not been great in the last few games, but the team needs to be good enough to overcome that.

I agree with all this. Donskoi looked good last night, though, and IMO the Joes could adapt to having another playmaker on the line. If Thornton (and, to a lesser extent, Donskoi) started shooting more, Donskoi on that line could make it a bit like the 1st PP unit composition where all the Fs are a potential threat to either pass or shoot. (Add Burns for an even greater threat.) That can be a potential solution to the Joes' problem of being relatively easy to defend bc everyone knows that Thornton will pass to Pavs who will shoot. Last night was the first time I've seen it, though. If the line plays like in most games, I agree. They need a scoring threat from the LW, preferably someone who can create his own plays.

I agree that Tierney is struggling. IMO that's in large part due to the wingers. I'm not sure Hertl would be much better there bc he can't carry a line either. Either Donskoi or Karlsson on the third line should be an upgrade but will it be enough of one? IMO probably not unless some of the other wingers step up. And unless Wingels and Nieto (or two other wingers) step up, it still doesn't help the 4th line much.

I agree completely about the 4th line being important to DeBoer. He doesn't line match like McLellan and he needs his 3rd and 4th lines to play well. That's why I said I'm not sure what he can do except try various AHLers and also work on special teams. I'd like to see Carpenter and maybe Goldobin again. I'm sure that ppl who follow the Barracuda could offer some good suggestions but IAE it's not like we have a bunch of studs in the AHL who really belong in the NHL. The options seem pretty limited to me.

 

[Led Zappa]

Donskoi looked great last night. He's played 6 WHOLE games in the NHL. He looks to be adjusting to playing on the line and if he continues to improve there is no reason to move him. That steal he made on the Pavelski goal is something I've seem him do many many times. It either slows down the rush going the other way or gives the D time to readjust in the D zone. If he can learn to corral the puck a little more often when he does that it will improve his game even further. He uses that long stick to his advantage well.

Nieto has how many games now and his leash with fans here goes from one side of the rink to the other. Donskoi gets 6 games and he just doesn't work with the Joes. I'm not buying it, yet.

 

[Painful Quandary]

I agree with all this. Donskoi looked good last night, though, and IMO the Joes could adapt to having another playmaker on the line. If Thornton (and, to a lesser extent, Donskoi) started shooting more, Donskoi on that line could make it a bit like the 1st PP unit composition where all the Fs are a potential threat to either pass or shoot. (Add Burns for an even greater threat.) That can be a potential solution to the Joes' problem of being relatively easy to defend bc everyone knows that Thornton will pass to Pavs who will shoot. Last night was the first time I've seen it, though. If the line plays like in most games, I agree. They need a scoring threat from the LW, preferably someone who can create his own plays.

I agree that Thornton needs to shoot more when the line is running Donskoi. But I know an issue I heard here is that Donskoi said he doesn't have a great shot, but at least I can give Donskoi credit for going to the net a lot of the time. The problem is that he tends to get out muscled, but at least he is going to the right area. Also, if the other team is spending their time shutting down the top line, the other lines stepping up is all the more critical.

I agree that Tierney is struggling. IMO that's in large part due to the wingers. I'm not sure Hertl would be much better there bc he can't carry a line either. Either Donskoi or Karlsson on the third line should be an upgrade but will it be enough of one? IMO probably not unless some of the other wingers step up. And unless Wingels and Nieto (or two other wingers) step up, it still doesn't help the 4th line.

Ultimately a third line of Donskoi-Hertl-Wingels and a fourth of Nieto-Tierney-Goodrow/Smith could be work, interchanging wingers as necessary (this of course when Couture and Karlsson gets back). Right now, I think Tierney is playing a little above his head, and it doesn't help that Wingels seems to be dragging things down.

You are right that getting the right wingers is key for the bottom-six. I wound not be surprised if ultimately a minor trade has to be made if Wingels doesn't step it up soon. I am a little reluctant to jump on Nieto, since historically he has a least been good defensively.

I agree completely about the 4th line being important to DeBoer. He doesn't line match like McLellan and he needs his 3rd and 4th lines to play well. That's why I said I'm not sure what he can do except try various AHLers and also work on special teams. I'd like to see Carpenter and maybe Goldobin again. I'm sure that ppl who follow the Barracuda could offer some good suggestions but IAE it's not like we have a bunch of studs in the AHL who really belong in the NHL. The options seem pretty limited to me.

That is tough to swallow. Trying out Carpenter and Goldobin over Lerg and Brown is worth a shot at this point; also, I hope Goodrow getting sent down isn't permanent either.

 

[weastern bias]

I like Donskoi so far, he looks better each game

 

[CrypTic]

But I know an issue I heard here is that Donskoi said he doesn't have a great shot, but at least I can give Donskoi credit for going to the net a lot of the time. The problem is that he tends to get out muscled, but at least he is going to the right area. Also, if the other team is spending their time shutting down the top line, the other lines stepping up is all the more critical.

I haven't seen that much of Donskoi. I occasionally watch the FEL but not much. I mostly saw him in the playoffs (but I only watched a handful or so of his games.) He did manage to score goals at a decent rate in the FEL, though. About the same proportion of goals/assists as Marleau last season. (Donskoi: 19 G/30 A in regular season, 6 G/16 A in playoffs, 7 G/4 A in international; Marleau: 19 G/38 A last season, though he usually has more goals/assists) I agree about Donskoi often getting outmuscled so far but he's been good about stealing the puck and also making good passes to other players. Thornton alone should have had two goals from Donskoi's passes which gave Thornton an empty net (one of them a couple of feet in front of the net). I think all three of them need to adapt to Donskoi on the line and that Donskoi needs to adapt to playing on the left (he usually played on the right) as well as NHL ice/the NHL game.

We'll see how they're doing by the time Karlsson returns. It's good having options.

Ultimately a third line of Donskoi-Hertl-Wingels and a fourth of Nieto-Tierney-Goodrow/Smith could be work, interchanging wingers as necessary (this of course when Couture and Karlsson gets back). Right now, I think Tierney is playing a little above his head, and it doesn't help that Wingels seems to be dragging things down.

I think part of that is the wingers and part of that is that DeBoer doesn't line match so the bottom lines are facing tougher competition than they did last year. (If you look at the corsi qoc for Wingels, Nieto, and Tierney, it's between Couture's and Braun's and higher than almost everyone else on the team. Goodrow's is higher than Couture's. CAUTION: McCarthy's is the highest, followed by Haley's. Small sample size.) I think that might be a difficult adjustment for them. If the bottom lines are seeing the other teams' top lines fairly often, I'm not sure that changing from 3rd to 4th line is going to have much of an impact on any of the players.

 

[Alwalys]

Jones cheats off the posts, it's incredibly obvious and it seems the book on him is already out amongst NHL teams

Pick your corner or fake laterally and shoot short side, goal

sorry but this is absurd. "pick your corner" is how you score on any goalie in the NHL.

 

[bigwillie]

Were they mad ill and off the chain?

I'm sorry, I thought we were ironically using 90s slang. I couldn't help it.

I just had a horrible Mr. Scarface flashback. Mang.

 

[magic school bus]

Were they mad ill and off the chain?

I'm sorry, I thought we were ironically using 90s slang. I couldn't help it.

Yeah baby yeahhhhh

 

[Anomie2029]

sorry but this is absurd. "pick your corner" is how you score on any goalie in the NHL.

I think its definitely an area that Jones needs to work on, but I don't think anyone can claim he was cheating or not hugging the post last night.

To stop that he would have needed to leave the bottom of the net exposed.

 

[weastern bias]

I agree that Jones can't be blamed for when he gets beat on a snipe (see Jarnkrok's goal)

I'm concerned with the flubby dribbles he lets squeak by because he's anticipating the pass (see Nash's goal)

 

[hohosaregood]

I think its definitely an area that Jones needs to work on, but I don't think anyone can claim he was cheating or not hugging the post last night.

To stop that he would have needed to leave the bottom of the net exposed.

Might be an experience thing. Jones probably should've popped out of the reverse vh quicker considering Hartnell was almost at the dots when he got that shot off.

Here's a little article about when to use it and stuff. Jones was right to be in that position but the moment Hartnell got to the faceoff circle, Jones should've been at least standing up. Yes, I know, it was a quick development but still.


Also includes goalies getting victimized.
http://ingoalmag.com/technique/reverse-vh-common-issues-proper-execution/

Goalies are free to follow that picture as closely as they want, but if they remain down in the reverse-VH position while the puck is outside of the blue area, they are at a high risk of getting beat over the shoulder on a shot.

It’s imperative for a goaltender to recognize this and immediately transition out of reverse-VH, or else the technique is not as effective as it can be.

 

[Barrie22]

They can just CBO them after the next lockout.

So they are going to resign both dillion and martin for another 4 and 5 years after this contract? My god if that is the truth please for the love of god please fire wilson now lol

 

[Grave]

Hertl continues to impress and I think Donskoi is really starting to gel with the team. It's nice to see but it will be even better when Juicy comes back.

I'd love to see a Couture - Hertl - Ward line and put Marleau on the third line and possibly putting Wingels or Tienery on the 4th.

 

[Anomie2029]

Hertl continues to impress and I think Donskoi is really starting to gel with the team. It's nice to see but it will be even better when Juicy comes back.

I'd love to see a Couture - Hertl - Ward line and put Marleau on the third line and possibly putting Wingels or Tienery on the 4th.

Couture and Hertl could make an interesting combination, but who would center the third line if you're sending Tierney down to 4th?

The way I see it, Couture returns gives the third line Hertl back where he will be the main driver of possession. I think when Karlsson returned he goes on third with Nieto the other winger, or he slips back on the first and Donskoi sits next to Hertl (which I like better)

 

[hohosaregood]

Couture and Hertl could make an interesting combination, but who would center the third line if you're sending Tierney down to 4th?

The way I see it, Couture returns gives the third line Hertl back where he will be the main driver of possession. I think when Karlsson returned he goes on third with Nieto the other winger, or he slips back on the first and Donskoi sits next to Hertl (which I like better)

I think what probably ends up happening is that Couture gets a couple games on the 3rd line to get back into game shape then if the team is/starts winning with that combo they leave it as is. If Hertl struggles or Couture dominates, they switch places.

 

[Sysreq]

I think what probably ends up happening is that Couture gets a couple games on the 3rd line to get back into game shape then if the team is/starts winning with that combo they leave it as is. If Hertl struggles or Couture dominates, they switch places.

I like this. A line up of:

Karlsson - Jumbo - Pavs
Marleau - Hertl - Ward
Donskoi - Couture - Wingels
Nieto - Tierney - Goodrow

would be some sexy hockey.

 

[Grave]

Couture and Hertl could make an interesting combination, but who would center the third line if you're sending Tierney down to 4th?

The way I see it, Couture returns gives the third line Hertl back where he will be the main driver of possession. I think when Karlsson returned he goes on third with Nieto the other winger, or he slips back on the first and Donskoi sits next to Hertl (which I like better)

Marleau or Wingels could possibly centre the 3rd line. At this point Wingels/Tienery are both not playing well enough on the 3rd line.

 

[Mafoofoo]

Can Marleau still play center? I feel like he hasn't really played that position since Couture became a full time NHLer.

Were they mad ill and off the chain?

I'm sorry, I thought we were ironically using 90s slang. I couldn't help it.

They were pretty hellas.