Proposal: Gallagher for Ovechkin, would you do it?

[habamillions]

So I take it you wouldn't want Crosby or any other players with large cap hits? C'mon. Ovechkin is a legit 50 goal scorer. 422 goals at 28. You make room for him.

crosby is a different story he makes everyone better. he shows up when it matters most. doesnt just care about his stats and himself

 

[Dr_Hook]

So I take it you wouldn't want Crosby or any other players with large cap hits? C'mon. Ovechkin is a legit 50 goal scorer. 422 goals at 28. You make room for him.

I think that's precisely the point : He isn't Crosby. Doesn't have the leadership nor the "complete game". He is THE biggest cap hit in the league, a cap-hit that he'll carry 7 yrs while being arguably a diminishing asset.

Seriously, if I'd ask you : Without considering salary situation, make a list of the most valuable forwards in the league, guys that you'd want to pick and build a winning team around, where does Ovie rank, given age and intangibles ? 5th ? 10th ?
Personnally I'd easily have 15 names before him ; maybe more. Now if you add dmen to the list, I'd easily be up to 30-35 guys in the league I'd rather have than him.

So : Biggest cap hit for 30th most desirable player = bad investment. It's not that crazy.


PS : And it has nothing to do with being a homer. Offer me Seguin, Malkin, heck I'll even go Boston route to prove good faith : Bergeron, It's all a "Yes, of course ! Bring them in !" Ovie just looks poisonous at this point

 

[Kriss E]

ita not that we would rather have gallaghet over ovechkin its trying to fit him under the cap and finding chemistry. its doesnt make sense to lose 2-4 players to bring him in and change game plans to cater to him and his game. he doesnt play defense he wont fit on this team with these coaches

You are not going to lose 2-4 players and the question has nothing to do with the cap space. Look at the title, ''Gallagher for Ovechkin, would you do it?'' Where does it say that we'd have to flip 2-4 guys?? Where does it say we wouldn't fit him under the cap?
This is a simple hypothetical question, the point of it is to see if people value Ovechkin's production more than they value Gallagher's intangibles's.

This.

Obviously Ovechkin is a better hockey player, but Gallagher is 1000 time a better person (and a good hockey player). So no to Ovechkin because we can manage the cap space and the attention he wants/takes in a better way.

I'm assuming you have never met either player and yet have no problem saying one is 1000 times a ''better person''. Based on what?

i think it would be a Kovalev +++ type situation but I wouldnt trade Subban for him - if Subban would be traded ONLY trade him for youth with exceptional talent like a MacKinnon who have YEARS ahead of them

id give ALOT for Ovechkin tho for sure in picks just wouldnt gut the roster to get him especially not defense, if we did get him tho yea cup run time starts then for about the next 3-5 years if we could get him to play a bit of a team game

If you have to put three + next to Kovalev's name then it's time you realize it's not a ''Kovalev'' situation at all.

Look at the title, Subban has nothing to do with the question. This is a pure heads up trade for Galla vs Ovi and assuming we had the space.

 

[HABS win CUPS*]

Gallagher doesnt get you anywhere near Ovechkin so im assuming Washington would want Subban/Galchenyuk ecetc

 

[Aceekay]

its a good thing he has carried his team come playoff time!

and Gallagher has?

 

[Habs 4 Life]

I'm far from being an Ovechkin fan but you would be quite crazy not to make this deal

 

[Kriss E]

I think that's precisely the point : He isn't Crosby. Doesn't have the leadership nor the "complete game". He is THE biggest cap hit in the league, a cap-hit that he'll carry 7 yrs while being arguably a diminishing asset.

Seriously, if I'd ask you : Without considering salary situation, make a list of the most valuable forwards in the league, guys that you'd want to pick and build a winning team around, where does Ovie rank, given age and intangibles ? 5th ? 10th ?
Personnally I'd easily have 15 names before him ; maybe more. Now if you add dmen to the list, I'd easily be up to 30-35 guys in the league I'd rather have than him.

So : Biggest cap hit for 30th most desirable player = bad investment. It's not that crazy.


PS : And it has nothing to do with being a homer. Offer me Seguin, Malkin, heck I'll even go Boston route to prove good faith : Bergeron, It's all a "Yes, of course ! Bring them in !" Ovie just looks poisonous at this point

So, you're saying you would say no to Ovechkin because he's the 10th forward you'd want to build your team around. Hmmm...Where would Gallagher rank? Would he even rank at all? He doesn't fit into the category of players you can build a team around.
So, doesn't that make your argument sound quite silly right from the start?

''Biggest cap hit for 30th most desirable player (debatable) = bad investment''?? Euh no. Biggest cap hit because he can reach 500 goals before reaching 30. That's why.
Biggest cap hit because he has 422 goals in freaking in 679 (of course this is not counting the 31 in 58 PO games). That's why. Biggest cap hit because he should hit 1000pts within a reasonable margin of time, maybe as early as 2years.
Biggest cap hit because he's the active point leader out of everybody born in 1985+.

Management in Washington messed up. They had a great team identity. A serious powerhouse. They got extremely unlucky facing us, they lost and opted to change their style which was dumb. Ever since then, they've never been able to find their identity back. They messed up big time. But Ovechkin is a rare breed. I can't believe how people are undervaluing him here. The guy is a beast and any team would be lucky to have him.

He's not going to lead you to the cup by himself, and for all the love Crosby is getting, his team never changed its style because they lost in the POs. They just brought in players that fit the mold. But from what I remember, the amazing Crosby (and Malkin), only brought one cup back to Pittsburgh. So maybe there's more to winning a cup than just relying on your big guys.

 

[Habs 4 Life]

I'm sure Michel can combine some line "trio redoutable"

Moen-White-Ovechkin

 

[Kriss E]

Gallagher doesnt get you anywhere near Ovechkin so im assuming Washington would want Subban/Galchenyuk ecetc

Of course not, but that was the question. Gallagher vs Ovechkin, heads up, would you do it. That is the question.
Ovechkin is not going to be traded, so any trade proposal is purely fictional and hypothetical.

 

[habamillions]

and Gallagher has?

he doesnt have to he is just a little part of the team.

 

[MasterDecoy]

Of course not, but that was the question. Gallagher vs Ovechkin, heads up, would you do it. That is the question.
Ovechkin is not going to be traded, so any trade proposal is purely fictional and hypothetical.

exactly. seriously, this is an idiotic thread with an idiotic premise. would you trade Gallagher for ovechkin? does a bear **** in the woods? looks like trolling for guys over analyzing the question.

 

[Saintpatrick*]

and Gallagher has?

Take a look at what he did last game.

 

[hockeyfan2k11]

I think that's precisely the point : He isn't Crosby. Doesn't have the leadership nor the "complete game". He is THE biggest cap hit in the league, a cap-hit that he'll carry 7 yrs while being arguably a diminishing asset.

Seriously, if I'd ask you : Without considering salary situation, make a list of the most valuable forwards in the league, guys that you'd want to pick and build a winning team around, where does Ovie rank, given age and intangibles ? 5th ? 10th ?
Personnally I'd easily have 15 names before him ; maybe more. Now if you add dmen to the list, I'd easily be up to 30-35 guys in the league I'd rather have than him.

So : Biggest cap hit for 30th most desirable player = bad investment. It's not that crazy.


PS : And it has nothing to do with being a homer. Offer me Seguin, Malkin, heck I'll even go Boston route to prove good faith : Bergeron, It's all a "Yes, of course ! Bring them in !" Ovie just looks poisonous at this point

You can build around Ovy, though. Just because Washington failed doesn't mean it's not possible. Ovy is a top 5 player over the last decade. I would drive Gallagher to the airport. I can't believe we're having this discussion.

If you'd take 30+ guys over Ovy then I don't know what to tell you. Ovy gets a lot of unfair criticism because he's Russian.

 

[Valois]

I think if you're Montreal and you get offered this trade you complain to EA sports that the game is too easy.

 

[Monctonscout]

I'm far from being an Ovechkin fan but you would be quite crazy not to make this deal

Agree.

For his flaws he is still a big time impact player.

Maybe a change of scenery would really allow him to go to the next level from great as an individual to a great team.

The biggest issues in Washington are more related to having constantly good goaltending and defense than Ovie's play. Because of who he is, when they lose, his every play is disecred.

 

[Monctonscout]

You can build around Ovy, though. Just because Washington failed doesn't mean it's not possible. Ovy is a top 5 player over the last decade. I would drive Gallagher to the airport. I can't believe we're having this discussion.

If you'd take 30+ guys over Ovy then I don't know what to tell you. Ovy gets a lot of unfair criticism because he's Russian.

For one I agree with you 100%.

 

[Lebowski]

Value wise, only Subban and Price are in Ovechkin's league.

Team wise, I'm not sure I'd swap Gallagher for Ovechkin. Seriously. Ovy has shown nothing but signs of decline while not showing much, if any, leadership qualities and is now barely useful (to not say a detriment) to his team for everything, except for the power-play. Do I want that on my team for 10M a year for the next 6 years? He's 28 now, will be 34 by then. Ovechkin's decline has been quick and steady over the last 4 years. Do the math.

I sense some kind of Alexei Yashin type of career ending for Ovechkin. Unless some major changes happen, both in his work ethic and his commitment to the game, I don't see what's all that attractive going for that sort of trade. As cliché as it may sound, Gallagher is a heart and soul type of player that gives it all every shift, loved by the fans and teammates, can already pot 20 a season, could pot near 30 in his prime... That's the kind of player I want on my team. Plus, he's cheap, and young. I don't see him resigning for a more expensive deal than Pacioretty, which bodes very well for us.

Again, from a market value perspective, it would be stupid to decline, but I think there's more that come into play than just that. I'm fine building around Price and Subban. Pacioretty fills the sniper winger role just fine.

 

[Aceekay]

Take a look at what he did last game.

That's one game, let's be honest, if we were going on a cup run who would you rather have Ovechkin or Gallagher?

 

[Lebowski]

That's one game, let's be honest, if we were going on a cup run who would you rather have Ovechkin or Gallagher?

In a vacuum, that's a question that would make sense. In reality, we're talking about a player making 685 000$ on his ELC for one more season, on the upswing of his career, compared to a 10M albatross contract for a player on a steep decline.

We're a team spending at the cap. Adding Ovechkin would mean losing Gallagher on top of Vanek, and we'd still be 2M short of fitting his contract under the cap.

Now, do you prefer Vanek + Gallagher + depth or Ovechkin? A question that may be worth asking for some, but to me building from the wings is a team model that proved to be a failure in the past, and history tends to repeat itself.

 

[Kriss E]

In a vacuum, that's a question that would make sense. In reality, we're talking about a player making 685 000$ on his ELC for one more season, on the upswing of his career, compared to a 10M albatross contract for a player on a steep decline.

We're a team spending at the cap. Adding Ovechkin would mean losing Gallagher on top of Vanek, and we'd still be 2M short of fitting his contract under the cap.

Now, do you prefer Vanek + Gallagher + depth or Ovechkin? A question that may be worth asking for some, but to me building from the wings is a team model that proved to be a failure in the past, and history tends to repeat itself.

Albatross contract?? Really?? Guy scored 51goals this year. Ovi isn't on a decline. Washington had their identity and they tried to change it but it clearly didn't help.
They really messed up. Only 15 regulation losses, over 300 goals for, what a powerhouse they were. They had their flaws in net and on defence, but man, you don't change the system when you reach such dominance. You try to improve it and make yourself even more dominant. But they didn't have the patience. After their disappointing loss to us, they changed everything for the worse.

I think they need to get back to powerhouse ways, but that would have meant not trade Forsberg for Erat, and not lose Semin for nothing a couple years back.
If they can't build it back up, they should move Ovechkin.

 

[Dr_Hook]

You can build around Ovy, though.
Just because Washington failed doesn't mean it's not possible.

That is indeed a very valid opinion. I just happen to disagree.
As I stated in my original post, if you think a 29-to-36 yrs old Ovie at 9,5 can be the centerpiece of a team building for a couple of Cup runs, then by all means, do it. I just think there are many signals that have indicated he might not be that man. Not in my mind anyway.

The 2nd part reminded me of the Georges Costanza line when Elaine was telling him "you know, admitting another man is handsome doesn't necessarely makes you a homosexual" to which Georges answered "It doesn't help !"

Ovy is a top 5 player over the last decade.

That might be true, but irrelevant. The question is : "For how many yrs(if any) of the next 7 is he gonna be a real top gun ? or close to it ? And with enough leadership, dedication to a team concept, etc... to allow you to build a winner. And in a city like Montreal of all places ? Me, I don't like those odds.

 

[madhi19]

That's one game, let's be honest, if we were going on a cup run who would you rather have Ovechkin or Gallagher?

Take a look at what he did tonight instead! loll

 

[Brainiac]

Just close that one, really. It's embarassing for everyone.

 

[29dryden29]

Nope no thanks Gally brings way more to our team than Ovie would. Gally knows how to play a complete team game where Ovie gets the all ME mentality and that doesn't bode well on any team.

 

[Uber Coca]

Ovechkin will be remembered as one of the best scorers of his generation. No need for debate it's obvious.

EDIT : I didn't bother reading the thread at first but seeing some comments on the last page made me curious... I can't believe some people would actually choose Gallagher. I'm sure it's an Internet thing. People would not say things like that in real life for their own sake. Internet can be such an idiocracy.