Frolik Vs Versteeg

[HereCometheHawks]

With the PK being an absolute clown show, I got to thinking about Frolik.

Stanbo let him go because his cap hit (2.3) was too much for a 4th liner/PK specialist. He traded him to the Jets for two picks.

Stan traded two prospects for Versteeg, at a cap hit of 2.2 million. Versteeg has been a great 2nd/3rd liner, but has gotten much (any?) PK time.

Is Versteeg that much of an improvement offensively to justify loosing such a solid PKer?

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[TheDoorDoctor]

I'm sure when stan traded away Frolik, he wasnt thinking about getting Versteeg.
The two are completely separated. But this does leave the question: Before this season and realizing our PK woes, would you trade frolik straight up for versteeg?

 

[SLarmer28*]

With the PK being an absolute clown show, I got to thinking about Frolik.

Stanbo let him go because his cap hit (2.3) was too much for a 4th liner/PK specialist. He traded him to the Jets for two picks.

Stan traded two prospects for Versteeg, at a cap hit of 2.2 million. Versteeg has been a great 2nd/3rd liner, but has gotten much (any?) PK time.

Is Versteeg that much of an improvement offensively to justify loosing such a solid PKer?

Kris Versteeg replaces Viktor Stalberg, who was a complete waste during the NHL Playoffs, and not Michael Frolik.

 

[RomersWorld*]

Versteeg is more of a Bolland/Stalberg replacement.

Ben Smith is more of a Frolik replacement.

Versteeg>Frolik (@2.2 mil)

He is simply a better player. Whether or not he fits the Hawks better than Frolik does is irrelevant at this point since Frolik was gone months before acquiring Versteeg.

 

[Sarava]

I don't think Versteeg as he is now can be looked at as the final product. He may not be fully back from his surgery. My guess is he will be pking eventually, as he did in his first stint with the Hawks.

 

[CertainAffinity*]

I don't think the Frolik and Versteeg decisions had anything to do with each other.

And quite frankly, while I loved how Frolik completely remade himself into an amazing 4th line and PK specialist, one guy shouldn't be (and isn't) the reason the PK went from 1st to last. There's a systemic problem, because everybody on the PK is playing passive, giving way too much time and space to the opposing team. You don't need to be Frolik to pressure the points, or help your teammate outman guys on the boards, or get in shooting lanes, or generally just work your ass off. But nobody is doing that right now. When everybody on the PK starts doing those things, it will be good again, without Frolik.

I willing to give Versteeg more time before making the judgement. He's just coming off an injury that has caused him to lose a step.

I would like to see Q play Versteeg more on the PK and can't really figure out why he hasn't, but to be fair, the PK has been getting better since Handzus was put on it, so my guess is that will be status quo until it starts getting worse again...

More than anything though, I'm thinking they might need to look at fixing Saad onto the third line to play with Versteeg. Both guys seem to be getting bounced around the second and third lines lately, which can't be helping them find a rhythm... but every time Versteeg and Saad are playing together, good things happen.

The only way I can see that happening though, is if the lines shake out as:

Toews/Kane/Bickell
Hossa/Pirri(or Zus)/Sharp
Saad/Shaw/Versteeg

Without Bickell in the lineup, there's really nobody in the bottom 6 capable of moving up to play with the top 6 in order to allow for Versteeg and Saad to play together. At least not that I can think of at this hour...

 

[wladyslaw]

I don't think Versteeg as he is now can be looked at as the final product. He may not be fully back from his surgery. My guess is he will be pking eventually, as he did in his first stint with the Hawks.

Agree- perhaps Q is giving 23's knee more time to heal... there is a lot of stopping, twisting, turning on PK- maybe Q is just easing his knee back into game.

23 looks more agile/quicker than 3 weeks ago- just hope his knee holds up. Nice asset to have a guy who can play all lines-roles. His stick and IQ are better than I remember. If he stays healthy- Hawks got a STEAL here.

 

[Hawkaholic]

I really don't think our PK problems stem from the fact that Frolik isn't here. It's a part of it, but even if he was here, it would still be ugly. Just look at our G's SV% on the PK. Your best PKer is your goalie, and that hasn't been the case.

I'll take Versteeg over Frolik all day, every day.

 

[Illinihockey]

I really don't think our PK problems stem from the fact that Frolik isn't here. It's a part of it, but even if he was here, it would still be ugly. Just look at our G's SV% on the PK. Your best PKer is your goalie, and that hasn't been the case.

I'll take Versteeg over Frolik all day, every day.

Took the words right out of my mouth

 

[BronYrAur]

Frolik was more valuable to this team than Dave Bolland yet brought far less of a return in trade. Go figure.

Frolik is a very good role player and Winnipeg got a steal. We would be much better off with Frolik still on the team at the expense of letting Bickell walk.

Now, Versteeg has more offensive ability I think so trading for him was a very good move. But we could have had both Versteeg and Fro potentially.

 

[Kurtosis]

This team wouldn't be better off with Frolik over Bickell. Full stop.

 

[No23]

It took some time for Frolik to really carve his role with the Blackhawks, he didn't become PK demi-god from day one.

That's the reason why the Hawks probably believe that hey can get another Frolik from within, they trust one of the guys on the team or in Rockford to take that role in the future.

On the other hand I guess they didn't trust anyone to replace what Bickell did the last playoffs.

 

[BobbyJet]

I really don't think our PK problems stem from the fact that Frolik isn't here. It's a part of it, but even if he was here, it would still be ugly. Just look at our G's SV% on the PK. Your best PKer is your goalie, and that hasn't been the case.

I'll take Versteeg over Frolik all day, every day.

Key word being "think". We've been down this path before. Same goalie, same coaching, same dmen, same Kruger. Of course things change from year to year but such a drastic difference in the PK has to have a lot to do with Frolik's absence. Stats aside, just observe the missing calculated aggressiveness that Frolik brought - it's gone. They just sit back in a box and wait for mistakes by the ops. It's pretty obvious to most people, except the Krugerites.

KV will be better on his skates when his knee is 100 percent, and hence better suited to PK; that may not be until next season.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Hated the trade the second it went down. Think Frolik would have been great on the third line.

 

[ChiGuySez]

Froliks shooting/scoring was horribad with the Hawks. I dont think Ive seen anyone worse. Skating and everthing else was worthy of his first round draft selection but just couldnt score. One of Froliks rare goals in his last year here, he hacked at the puck one handed with his stick near the wall and went in somehow. For whatever reason, his scoring dropped off the map here and his salary was overbudget.

 

[member 151739]

Frolik would obviously help, but his absence alone isn't the cause for the major deterioration of the penalty kill. That said, I miss Frolik and his energy and defensive skills, and I also miss laughing at him screwing up prime scoring chances.

 

[bulletwwings]

Then he goes to WPG and finds his shot...figure that one out.

 

[member 151739]

Then he goes to WPG and finds his shot...figure that one out.

He's a shapeshifter, man.

 

[pvr]

... but every time Versteeg and Saad are playing together, good things happen.

The only way I can see that happening though, is if the lines shake out as:

Toews/Kane/Bickell
Hossa/Pirri(or Zus)/Sharp
Saad/Shaw/Versteeg

Without Bickell in the lineup, there's really nobody in the bottom 6 capable of moving up to play with the top 6 in order to allow for Versteeg and Saad to play together. At least not that I can think of at this hour...

Those lines would be very nice indeed, with Pirri on the second. That third line would give other teams fits. Handzus goes to the fourth (with Kruger), moving in/out with Smith, Morin, and Bollig). Not a bad line in the bunch.

 

[bulletwwings]

He's a shapeshifter, man.

agreed

 

[Hawkaholic]

Key word being "think". We've been down this path before. Same goalie, same coaching, same dmen, same Kruger. Of course things change from year to year but such a drastic difference in the PK has to have a lot to do with Frolik's absence. Stats aside, just observe the missing calculated aggressiveness that Frolik brought - it's gone. They just sit back in a box and wait for mistakes by the ops. It's pretty obvious to most people, except the Krugerites.

KV will be better on his skates when his knee is 100 percent, and hence better suited to PK; that may not be until next season.

Ya, and the year before last we had the same players, coaches (minus Kompon whos runs PP), same Dmen, same Kruger, and it was terrible that year with Frolik.

Maybe last year was an anomaly?

Like I said, Frolik is a small reason, but not the main reason. It has more to do with not blocking shots or getting in the shooting lanes, more than it has to do with Froliks aggressiveness.

 

[BronYrAur]

This team wouldn't be better off with Frolik over Bickell. Full stop.

Yes it would. PK is team's biggest weakness right now.

Not to mention the fact that Fro is simply a better player anyway.

 

[x Tame Impala]

I really don't think our PK problems stem from the fact that Frolik isn't here. It's a part of it, but even if he was here, it would still be ugly. Just look at our G's SV% on the PK. Your best PKer is your goalie, and that hasn't been the case.

I'll take Versteeg over Frolik all day, every day.

My thoughts exactly

 

[member 151739]

Yes it would. PK is team's biggest weakness right now.

Not to mention the fact that Fro is simply a better player anyway.

Yeah, that's just not true. And Frolik wouldn't magically turn our PK into a fortress on ice.

 

[ChiGuySez]

Ya, and the year before last we had the same players, coaches (minus Kompon whos runs PP), same Dmen, same Kruger, and it was terrible that year with Frolik.

Maybe last year was an anomaly?

Like I said, Frolik is a small reason, but not the main reason. It has more to do with not blocking shots or getting in the shooting lanes, more than it has to do with Froliks aggressiveness.

This is what Im thinking. Success last year doesnt necessarily mean the same results even with the same players. Also most games were 1 goal games last year unlike this year.