News Article: Friedman: In talking to some of the Sabres, they see the cycle of losing affecting the younger guys

[La Cosa Nostra]

It’s going to be a long offseason

I agree BGM we had a long off season...of great success . None of us foresaw the summer and season to date.

- Won the lotto. Arguably even a bigger lotto then 2015. The difference between McDavid and Eichel at their peaks will be 5-10 points. I would gladly take Eichel and Dahlin over McDavid and Bouchard or even McDavid/Svech/Tkachuk/Hughes.

- Drafted Dahlin and Samuelsson, securing 1/3rd of our long term blue line.

- Acquired Sheary. He has been in a funk (entire bottom 9 has been) but he has shown he can at least be a 15-20 goal scorer here. Regardless, acquiring him for a 4th/conditional 3rd was a steal. 2x cup winner who can skate. Would love to sign Sheary to a 4 x 3.5 type deal.

- Moved RoR. The return in a vacuum may not have been the best but it was necessary to shake up the locker room and to make this Jacks team. If we end up with a top 8 pick in 2020 from the trade I doubt anyone would still be upset.

- Signed Pilut. Has been a revelation in Rochester and now in Buffalo. He is the rich rich rich mans version of Antipin. Another amazing shrewd move.

- Signed Carter Hutton to a 2.75 x 3 deal. Hutton has been a top 10 goalie this year. We have a legit above average #1 the next 2 seasons after for 2.75 per. Arguably the best free agent signing of the year.

- Acquired Jeff Skinner. Acquired a superstar elite goal scorer for nothing pretty much. Pu was never going to make it as anything more then a 13th forward and even if Skinner was only a 25 goal scorer it would still have been a steal.

- Signed Sam to a cheap bridge. This will work out in Botts favor. You can bookmark it, when Sam signs his big extension and we factor in the bridge the AAV over the 10 years total will be 6 or under.

Botts is the executive of the year ainec. None of us foresaw this much success. With all the cap space coming off the next 2 years I am real excited to see Botts add to this team.

The perennial losing is now over. The Sabres are now a top 10 franchise again like we were the first 40 years of existence. And with Eichel-Skinner-Dahlin-Risto we are a perennial playoff team with those 4 in place.

 

[Gabrielor]

I agree BGM we had a long off season...of great success . None of us foresaw the summer and season to date.

- Won the lotto. Arguably even a bigger lotto then 2015. The difference between McDavid and Eichel at their peaks will be 5-10 points. I would gladly take Eichel and Dahlin over McDavid and Bouchard or even McDavid/Svech/Tkachuk/Hughes.

- Drafted Dahlin and Samuelsson, securing 1/3rd of our long term blue line.

- Acquired Sheary. He has been in a funk (entire bottom 9 has been) but he has shown he can at least be a 15-20 goal scorer here. Regardless, acquiring him for a 4th/conditional 3rd was a steal. 2x cup winner who can skate. Would love to sign Sheary to a 4 x 3.5 type deal.

- Moved RoR. The return in a vacuum may not have been the best but it was necessary to shake up the locker room and to make this Jacks team. If we end up with a top 8 pick in 2020 from the trade I doubt anyone would still be upset.

- Signed Pilut. Has been a revelation in Rochester and now in Buffalo. He is the rich rich rich mans version of Antipin. Another amazing shrewd move.

- Signed Carter Hutton to a 2.75 x 3 deal. Hutton has been a top 10 goalie this year. We have a legit above average #1 the next 2 seasons after for 2.75 per. Arguably the best free agent signing of the year.

- Acquired Jeff Skinner. Acquired a superstar elite goal scorer for nothing pretty much. Pu was never going to make it as anything more then a 13th forward and even if Skinner was only a 25 goal scorer it would still have been a steal.

- Signed Sam to a cheap bridge. This will work out in Botts favor. You can bookmark it, when Sam signs his big extension and we factor in the bridge the AAV over the 10 years total will be 6 or under.

Botts is the executive of the year ainec. None of us foresaw this much success. With all the cap space coming off the next 2 years I am real excited to see Botts add to this team.

The perennial losing is now over. The Sabres are now a top 10 franchise again like we were the first 40 years of existence. And with Eichel-Skinner-Dahlin-Risto we are a perennial playoff team with those 4 in place.

Pretty dumb way of looking at that. That bridge is going to hurt long term. His hit being low now doesn't matter, but it will matter in 2 years.

Edit: Also, UNDER 6???? No way.

3.65
3.65
7
7
7
7
7
7
7
7
63.3
6.33

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

He's getting more than 7 too.....

Also, I know it's not supposed to bleed out of its' box, but the OReilly trade is still very bad.

 

[Abraham de Lacy]

As an outsider looking in, what worries me is the lack of a high end 2nd C .. there is Eichel and then there is .. [crickets] .. What happens if he gets hurt. The same goes for Colorado btw.

The plan is that Mittlestadt will be the future 2nd C I guess. But he is not there yet. Blue line looks stacked though, and two good goalies too .. but the centres are lacking.

I wish the Sabres had the equivalent of a Malkin or the insane depth at C that Toronto has.

I think a high end 2nd C would revitalise the second line (and possibly even the third line) and turn the Sabres into a truly terrifying opponent.

Thoughts?

 

[Reddawg]

I think a high end 2nd C would revitalise the second line (and possibly even the third line) and turn the Sabres into a truly terrifying opponent.

Thoughts?

My thought is that the lack of a high-end 2nd C in 18-19 isn't that big of a deal. We're grooming Casey for that role, and if he falls short (which I don't believe he will), we also have four high picks in the next two years to work on getting someone else ready for the role by 20-21. Sometimes skill guys take time to develop, it happened with Connolly where he struggled with the Isles and they finally bailed on him only to see him explode with us (before the concussions...:sad: ). There's a reason they call it the 4th year explosion...it's happening this year with Jack, it's happening this year with Sam, and it happens with a lot of guys...they hit that magical fourth year as a pro and all of a sudden their game hits it's stride and their numbers go way up.

We're overperforming this year, and that's awesome. That's what quality teams do, they find ways to win when it doesn't make sense on paper. That means a few more key pieces turns us into a true contender. Do I think adding a high-end 2C right now is possible? Not really. Do I think adding a high-end 2C right now turns this team into a contender? I do not. It's not the only piece we're missing and I absolutely don't want to trade futures for rentals. We can develop a very good 2C in the system, hey, maybe Davidsson can come in next year and he and Casey can fight it out for 2C/3C along with Asplund. We'll also have a lot of money in free agency to address our positional needs over the summer. The days of Sobotka in the middle of the third line are not long for this world.

We have a lot of talent on the roster now, next year there will be more and the year after that there will be even more. The core of this team is under team control for at least the next 7 years. We're building a perennial contender here...that takes time and patience...not a lot of attempted hole filling on the fly with the spare parts available...just because they're upgrades on what you've got. Use the picks, spend the money wisely in FA...add the right pieces to the core we have. That's how we'll get it done and become a terrifying opponent.

 

[Abraham de Lacy]

My thought is .. [edit] ..

The core of this team is under team control for at least the next 7 years. We're building a perennial contender here...that takes time and patience...not a lot of attempted hole filling on the fly with the spare parts available...just because they're upgrades on what you've got. Use the picks, spend the money wisely in FA...add the right pieces to the core we have. That's how we'll get it done and become a terrifying opponent.

Thanks for a thoughtful reply. Much appreciated. As far as I can tell there are no great C prospects in Rochester but wingers and possibly defencemen.

Two years out this team needs Casey to be the one, and if the Sabres becomes a solid play-off team there will be no high end 1st or 2nd/3rd picks. So scouting and luck will play a part. And FA as you said.

Here is the thing; I came here for Rasmus Dahlin (we are countrymen) but I have grown fond of the spirit of the Sabres. They are fun to watch! There is always the sense that there is an extra gear in them, available on tap it seems, but that they are brittle. If Eichel goes it will collapse. I am kind of worried about that with my newfound love for an NHL team.

Again, thanks for the reply.

 

[sabremike]

As an outsider looking in, what worries me is the lack of a high end 2nd C .. there is Eichel and then there is .. [crickets] .. What happens if he gets hurt. The same goes for Colorado btw.

The plan is that Mittlestadt will be the future 2nd C I guess. But he is not there yet. Blue line looks stacked though, and two good goalies too .. but the centres are lacking.

I wish the Sabres had the equivalent of a Malkin or the insane depth at C that Toronto has.

I think a high end 2nd C would revitalise the second line (and possibly even the third line) and turn the Sabres into a truly terrifying opponent.

Thoughts?

Unfortunately this is why when you have a high end #2 center (particularly one under a very reasonable deal long term) it is a horrible idea to get rid of them because they don't grow on trees. Not having a credible 2nd line is absolutely going to kill us for the next several seasons because having one amazing line can drag you into the playoff but you will get knocked out in 5 games tops.
(Mods: I apologize for referencing you know what but there really is no choice when discussing this team's fatal weakness at center that is going to prevent us from being anything but cannon fodder in April)
.

 

[Reddawg]

Thanks for a thoughtful reply. Much appreciated. As far as I can tell there are no great C prospects in Rochester but wingers and possibly defencemen.

Two years out this team needs Casey to be the one, and if the Sabres becomes a solid play-off team there will be no high end 1st or 2nd/3rd picks. So scouting and luck will play a part. And FA as you said.

Here is the thing; I came here for Rasmus Dahlin (we are countrymen) but I have grown fond of the spirit of the Sabres. They are fun to watch! There is always the sense that there is an extra gear in them, available on tap it seems, but that they are brittle. If Eichel goes it will collapse. I am kind of worried about that with my newfound love for an NHL team.

Again, thanks for the reply.

No question we're living and dying with the first line and the goaltending right now. That will not result in playoff success this year, but getting there will be a nice bonus on top of achieving the goal of taking a big step forward this season. Lots of money freed up this summer, remains to be seen how Botts will choose to spend it. 2019 is a very big year for this team's future.

 

[dortt]

Unfortunately this is why when you have a high end #2 center (particularly one under a very reasonable deal long term) it is a horrible idea to get rid of them because they don't grow on trees. Not having a credible 2nd line is absolutely going to kill us for the next several seasons because having one amazing line can drag you into the playoff but you will get knocked out in 5 games tops.
(Mods: I apologize for referencing you know what but there really is no choice when discussing this team's fatal weakness at center that is going to prevent us from being anything but cannon fodder in April)
.

I have to disagree in the strongest of terms. We didn't even have one amazing line back in 1999, yet we nearly won the Cup. Our top center that year was a #3 center (Peca). Brown also was no more than a #3 and at that time, a low end #3.

How our goaltenders play in the playoffs will determine how far we go. Not the center weakness. Could center be better? Yes. However, it is far better than there is a good culture now that is allowing the youngsters to thrive, vs the constant sadness of the previous seasons

 

[SackTastic]

No question we're living and dying with the first line and the goaltending right now. That will not result in playoff success this year, but getting there will be a nice bonus on top of achieving the goal of taking a big step forward this season. Lots of money freed up this summer, remains to be seen how Botts will choose to spend it. 2019 is a very big year for this team's future.

Exactly this.

18-19 we expected them to be competitive and learn how to win. They're doing that. They aren't likely to succeed in the playoffs, but just GETTING there will be the step they need to take. Getting rolled in the first round is a learning experience they probably have to go through yet before they really can do some damage.

 

[sabremike]

I have to disagree in the strongest of terms. We didn't even have one amazing line back in 1999, yet we nearly won the Cup. Our top center that year was a #3 center (Peca). Brown also was no more than a #3 and at that time, a low end #3.

How our goaltenders play in the playoffs will determine how far we go. Not the center weakness. Could center be better? Yes. However, it is far better than there is a good culture now that is allowing the youngsters to thrive, vs the constant sadness of the previous seasons

Uh, that was kinda because we literally had the greatest goalie who ever lived.

 

[dortt]

Uh, that was kinda because we literally had the greatest goalie who ever lived.

Even still, a hot goalie will take the team much farther than a second line center. Been many cases in the playoffs where teams have ridden hot goalies. They usually do not win the Cup. But they can win a couple of series

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Hayes, Dzingel, Nelson, Duchene, Anders Lee, and Johansson are all UFA at the end of the year. Personally I'd try to snag Hayes or Dzingel.

Or why not both.

 

[brian_griffin]

People point to intangibles and declare they can measure their impact. That’s not how intangibles work.

Years ago, when I first joined this board, there was a famous thread about how one can measure intangibles. It was the hockey equivalent of the flat-earth view of the cosmos.

I wish people wouldn't try to make up their own policies.

We should make that a policy...

The forum software should mathematically calculate the hottest take in the thread, then post a bumping reply using a random users account with said take, in old threads after 6 months of inactivity.

...and automatically add the quotes of 3 or 4 contentious posters, just to season the pot...

My thought is that the lack of a high-end 2nd C in 18-19 isn't that big of a deal. We're grooming Casey for that role, and if he falls short (which I don't believe he will), we also have four high picks in the next two years to work on getting someone else ready for the role by 20-21. Sometimes skill guys take time to develop, it happened with Connolly where he struggled with the Isles and they finally bailed on him only to see him explode with us (before the concussions...:sad: ). There's a reason they call it the 4th year explosion...it's happening this year with Jack, it's happening this year with Sam, and it happens with a lot of guys...they hit that magical fourth year as a pro and all of a sudden their game hits it's stride and their numbers go way up.

We're overperforming this year, and that's awesome. That's what quality teams do, they find ways to win when it doesn't make sense on paper. That means a few more key pieces turns us into a true contender. Do I think adding a high-end 2C right now is possible? Not really. Do I think adding a high-end 2C right now turns this team into a contender? I do not. It's not the only piece we're missing and I absolutely don't want to trade futures for rentals. We can develop a very good 2C in the system, hey, maybe Davidsson can come in next year and he and Casey can fight it out for 2C/3C along with Asplund. We'll also have a lot of money in free agency to address our positional needs over the summer. The days of Sobotka in the middle of the third line are not long for this world.

We have a lot of talent on the roster now, next year there will be more and the year after that there will be even more. The core of this team is under team control for at least the next 7 years. We're building a perennial contender here...that takes time and patience...not a lot of attempted hole filling on the fly with the spare parts available...just because they're upgrades on what you've got. Use the picks, spend the money wisely in FA...add the right pieces to the core we have. That's how we'll get it done and become a terrifying opponent.

good post, but the Sabres / Botts need to have a plan A, plan B, and plan C for #2C and pull the trigger on all of them. It would be sinful to waste the other high-end talent on the roster.

I have to disagree in the strongest of terms. We didn't even have one amazing line back in 1999, yet we nearly won the Cup. Our top center that year was a #3 center (Peca). Brown also was no more than a #3 and at that time, a low end #3.

How our goaltenders play in the playoffs will determine how far we go. Not the center weakness. Could center be better? Yes. However, it is far better than there is a good culture now that is allowing the youngsters to thrive, vs the constant sadness of the previous seasons

Good post.

But a 0.930 year-in-year-out career save percentage goalie when the rest of the league was 0.90, who could win a game with 1-2 goals-for from his teammates helped in 1999. A lot.

My view of the factors impacting Sabres ability to either make the playoffs, and/or win a round:
1. Injuries to top line.
2. Physicality. (I would not take the Sabres in a 7-game series against a more physical team like, e.g., Tampa.)
3. Goaltending. (Must sustain current performance.)
4. #2C competency.
5. Power play - can it ever get going.
6. Coaching. Steve Smith seems to be an effective antidote for Housley's ineptitude.

#2 and #4 are related - teams have been trying to be physical and push Mittelstadt around. That crap needs to stop.