Free Agents and Trade Thread - Training camp edition

[Kiwi]

Unless they need a contract slot I would say they would do it. Qualify him and back to the minors for $70k. If he has a big year there is going to be more interest than right now, maybe even Seattle as part of some shifting bits to control who the club loses.

I doubt he has an NHL future, any type of value on the trade market and if he's more trouble than he's worth on the Marlies, a place we develop our young talent I want him gone

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Anybody want to take a shot at claiming Niclas Westerholm? 6'4" goalie still just 22 years old, and loaned to Liiga the last 3 seasons because Nashville didn't have a spot in Milwaukee for him.

Put him on unconditional waivers today which probably means he's staying in europe, but I would put a claim in.

Could pair him with Woll next year on the Marlies with Kaskisuo being a FA.

Niclas Westerholm at eliteprospects.com

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Anybody want to take a shot at claiming Niclas Westerholm? 6'4" goalie still just 22 years old, and loaned to Liiga the last 3 seasons because Nashville didn't have a spot in Milwaukee for him.

Put him on unconditional waivers today which probably means he's staying in europe, but I would put a claim in.

Could pair him with Woll next year on the Marlies with Kaskisuo being a FA.

Niclas Westerholm at eliteprospects.com

His Liiga numbers are far from inspiring, he has no North American pro experience, and there are going to be a bunch of UFA options who can actually be legit #3's for us.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

His Liiga numbers are far from inspiring, he has no North American pro experience, and there are going to be a bunch of UFA options who can actually be legit #3's for us.

I feel like he played pretty well considering how bad his team was this year. Looked solid in the few games I was able to catch.

I think we go the route you mentioned but I wouldn't mind taking a shot at a free ticket with some upside.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I feel like he played pretty well considering how bad his team was this year. Looked solid in the few games I was able to catch.

I think we go the route you mentioned but I wouldn't mind taking a shot at a free ticket with some upside.

It would be different if we lacked prospects, but as of right now, we have Woll and Scott. Both are younger and have more upside, and both are complete unknowns. If we suffer injuries, who are we bringing to the NHL? People already had concerns about our goalie depth with Kaskisuo as our #3, and replacing him with Westerlund is only going in the wrong direction.

Nashville terminated Westerlund because they felt they would rather have a contract spot. That is not really a good look for him, especially since Nashville could have fit him on their AHL roster next year with Grosenick as a pending UFA and Ingram as a proven option who probably could have been their #3 next year... Or they could have traded Westerlund for something if he was really anything noteworthy.

I think the Leafs will go with Andersen, Campbell, UFA (i.e. Brossoit), Woll, Scott, Gahagen next year. Zhukov, Redmond and Kaskisuo likely find jobs in Europe.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Pius Suter and Wyatt Kalynuk signed with Chicago, so that is two more of the top UFA prospects off of the market.

 

[TML1967]

Pius Suter and Wyatt Kalynuk signed with Chicago, so that is two more of the top UFA prospects off of the market.

Who are the top UFA's left?

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Who are the top UFA's left?

Ryan Shea and Ryan Martin for me, but neither are available for another month I don't think. Neither are likely going to choose to come to the Leafs though; we have too much Marlies defensive-depth as it is.

I guess Kalynuk was available early because he was able to opt-out as a Junior and does not follow the same rules as guys who are UFA's after becoming seniors.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Sean Day signed with the Lightning. So he is getting a second, but likely his last, shot.

 

[hockeywiz542]

Mirtle Mailbag: Fixing the Leafs cap crunch, the D question and NHL contraction – The Athletic

The top ranked question: With the cap being flat for the next few years are the Leafs going to be able to get any value for Kapanen/Johnsson or Kerfoot in trade or will it just be a salary dump?

I think they’ll get something, yes. But it’s going to be harder to move salary this offseason. No question.

The other thing to keep in mind here is these three players aren’t viewed equally around the league. It seems like every time I talk to other organizations they are curious about Kapanen and why he might be available. They see a lot of potential there, given his raw skill set, and a possible answer in their top six at a very affordable price tag.

You could get a good player or prospect for him.

Kerfoot and Johnsson? Both had injuries and just so-so seasons, so that limits the return.

Still, if I’m a New Jersey or Ottawa-like team, why wouldn’t you want one of those two as forward depth? They’re clearly top-nine players, and their salary cap hit is reasonable.

One of these three probably has to go to make the cap math work, but with Johnsson especially, it certainly feels like selling low. If that’s the biggest blow the Leafs are dealt from a pandemic that decimates league revenue, however, you can live with it.

Question 3: How screwed are the Leafs now that the cap is not going to heavily increase like in years past? It seems many of their Core Four contracts that have been criticized would have become good value in future years as the cap increased, but that’s now in jeopardy.

I took a run at answering that in depth here, if you missed the column.

How screwed? I think they’re relatively OK next season, as long as they can win with a relatively low-cost defence. (More on that below.) Things get dicier in 2021-22 and beyond, though, and they could lose key pieces like Frederik Andersen and Zach Hyman.

The thing you worry about is that the Leafs just kind of muddle along as like the 10th best team in the NHL, propped up by a potent offence from their four stars but never able to build enough of a strong cast around them to be one of the best teams in the league. That feels more likely now that the cap isn’t going anywhere near $90 million.

Dubas probably has two paths to pick here when we get to summer 2022: Move on from the Core Four plan and subtract one or two of those players. Or go all-in on the strategy of trying to find a lot more Mikheyevs and Robertsons and win that way.

The organization is really confident they can do that, given everything they’ve invested in the draft and development and free agent recruiting. The question is to what extent is that possible and is it enough to keep them ahead of the competition?

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Mirtle Mailbag: Fixing the Leafs cap crunch, the D question and NHL contraction – The Athletic

The top ranked question: With the cap being flat for the next few years are the Leafs going to be able to get any value for Kapanen/Johnsson or Kerfoot in trade or will it just be a salary dump?

I think they’ll get something, yes. But it’s going to be harder to move salary this offseason. No question.

The other thing to keep in mind here is these three players aren’t viewed equally around the league. It seems like every time I talk to other organizations they are curious about Kapanen and why he might be available. They see a lot of potential there, given his raw skill set, and a possible answer in their top six at a very affordable price tag.

You could get a good player or prospect for him.

Kerfoot and Johnsson? Both had injuries and just so-so seasons, so that limits the return.

Still, if I’m a New Jersey or Ottawa-like team, why wouldn’t you want one of those two as forward depth? They’re clearly top-nine players, and their salary cap hit is reasonable.

One of these three probably has to go to make the cap math work, but with Johnsson especially, it certainly feels like selling low. If that’s the biggest blow the Leafs are dealt from a pandemic that decimates league revenue, however, you can live with it.

Question 3: How screwed are the Leafs now that the cap is not going to heavily increase like in years past? It seems many of their Core Four contracts that have been criticized would have become good value in future years as the cap increased, but that’s now in jeopardy.

I took a run at answering that in depth here, if you missed the column.

How screwed? I think they’re relatively OK next season, as long as they can win with a relatively low-cost defence. (More on that below.) Things get dicier in 2021-22 and beyond, though, and they could lose key pieces like Frederik Andersen and Zach Hyman.

The thing you worry about is that the Leafs just kind of muddle along as like the 10th best team in the NHL, propped up by a potent offence from their four stars but never able to build enough of a strong cast around them to be one of the best teams in the league. That feels more likely now that the cap isn’t going anywhere near $90 million.

Dubas probably has two paths to pick here when we get to summer 2022: Move on from the Core Four plan and subtract one or two of those players. Or go all-in on the strategy of trying to find a lot more Mikheyevs and Robertsons and win that way.

The organization is really confident they can do that, given everything they’ve invested in the draft and development and free agent recruiting. The question is to what extent is that possible and is it enough to keep them ahead of the competition?

What did Mirtle have to say about Liljegren in the article?

 

[hockeywiz542]

What did Mirtle have to say about Liljegren in the article?

Question 9: It’s obviously too soon to write him off, but how concerned are you that Timothy Liljegren might not be an NHL D-man, or at least not one that can play a top-four role? He looked surprisingly lost and slow in his own zone, and certainly doesn’t possess the offensive instincts to be a major point producer.

I do not think he is a top four defenceman. Probably.

Now, he’s only 21. And he had a good year with the Marlies. But that audition with the Leafs was pretty ugly.

That said, maybe he’s a No. 5 or a 6, on a cheap contract, with a right shot, and that fills a hole they badly need. Maybe the development team can continue to pull more and more out of him, given his raw talents are certainly considerable.

What we’re really looking at with the Leafs blueline right now is an unfinished canvas. We don’t know what Dermott or Sandin or Liljegren are going to be. But they don’t need all of them to be studs. The nature of a top four is there are only four of them, and you’ve got Rielly and Muzzin and Holl. What they need is competent minutes and continued growth, especially while on ELCs. And trade chips when a logjam forms.

That’s what Liljegren is at this point: part of a murky puzzle that will play itself out far more next season than it has this year, with Barrie and Ceci getting so many of the minutes.

 

[BertCorbeau]

^ well those are some cringey takes

 

[Duke16]

Any other notable Euro FA's slated to come over still?

Suter (Chicago) and Nattinen (NLA) were two on my radar that went elsewhere.

 

[4thline]

Given the tight budgets we're likely to see around the league and the uncertainty of the AHL I was thinking that one way we could make use of financial resources was small deals (similar to the Vegas retention for a 5th) where we gather up some completely bury-able 1 way contracts (1m or less) that other owners would prefer to not pay for in the AHL. Get some late round picks and stock the Marlies with solid depth at the same time

Problem is that when I looked into it there's only a handful of said players under contract league wide, and when you think about it a team that's really in a tight spot might just bite the bullet and play them regardless of whether or not they should be an NHL regular

 

[Menzinger]

^ well those are some cringey takes

Yeah. I like Mirtle but hes better when writing on managerial level stuff rather than analyzing players

 

[4thline]

Yeah. I like Mirtle but hes better when writing on managerial level stuff rather than analyzing players

There are several posters who's pure opinions I value more than any media figure (other than someone like Jack Han). The real value of these guys is telling us what others are thinking through insider connections, their opinions are just that of another hockey fan.

 

[ryno23]

all the media guys keep talking about cap crunch due to a flat cap. No one ever says "yeah leafs are in tough, but they have their top 6 signed for multiple years" So Dubas needs to find bargains to round out the bottom of the lineup. The flat cap actually will help the Leafs out as lots of guys will get the squeeze and they can get some vets on cheaper deals with a chance to win or go to an Ottawa and get paid but the team sucks. I assume

Nylander - Matthews - Hyman
Marner - JT - Soupman
Kappy - Kerfoot- Robertson
XX - XX - XX

so that forward group you need to resign Soupman this upcoming year and you have Ceci, Barrie, coming off the books for about 7 mil. So you can sign Soupman, Dermott and Spezza for a combined 7 million.

So that leaves Hyman in 2 years and I think he would take a discount to stay home and play on Matthew's wing or JT's wing.

Reilly - XXX
Muzzin - Dermott
Sandin - Liilgren
Holl, Rosen, plus the AHL guys

You need a partner for Reilly and if you end up moving AJ for some cap relief you can sign a guy to play with Reilly. Maybe a Tanev comes cheap

Andersen
Campbell

Maybe you move on from Andy in 2 years.

 

[Legion34]

Demelo lived in London on his time off.

he has said he would be open to contracts with wpg and ottawa. If his hometown team came calling I’m sure he would be in. He doesn’t seem like he wants to cash out and probably wants security now.

If we are sold on keeping the big 4. Signing him to a 3.5ish deal might be the best way. Let him pair with rielly.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Demelo lived in London on his time off.

he has said he would be open to contracts with wpg and ottawa. If his hometown team came calling I’m sure he would be in. He doesn’t seem like he wants to cash out and probably wants security now.

If we are sold on keeping the big 4. Signing him to a 3.5ish deal might be the best way. Let him pair with rielly.

3.5 mill is overpaying Demelo in a normal market. In a market with a flat cap where UFA's are supposed to be getting discounts, that is really bad. He is more likely to turn into Nick Jensen than any kind of real solution for the Leafs (and FTR, Nick Jensen has already not looked good for the Capitals after only the first year of his new deal).

 

[showtime8]

^ well those are some cringey takes

I don't think they're cringey at all.

Mirtle is saying that Liljegren looked out of place when he was recalled this year. For all but maybe 1 game, I would say that is true.

What do you feel is incorrect about his takes?

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I don't think they're cringey at all.

Mirtle is saying that Liljegren looked out of place when he was recalled this year. For all but maybe 1 game, I would say that is true.

What do you feel is incorrect about his takes?

I think the cringy thing is that Mirtle seems to effectively write off Liljegren after one 11-game sample despite looking extremely advanced for his age. It's just like writing off Sandin after he did not look like an NHLer for long stretches of his 28-game sample.

However, that is only if they are referring to his overall potential, and not what kind of role he could fill next year. Liljegren is not going to be able to fill a top 4 role next year out of the gate... He will likely only be able to be a 5 or 6 at best to start, and then maybe mid-season can rise up to be a #4 if things go well. However if they think his overall potential is only a #5 or #6 after his brief NHL sample, then there are not too many teams with defensive prospects with top 4 potential.

 

[Leaffan1991]

A lot of people will dislike this but what about Nylander as our 3C and trading Kerfoot and Johnsson for either D or picks?
Saves us a bunch of money and we don't need to throw 2 plus on a 3C.

Robertson Matthews Hyman
Mikheyev Tavares Marner
Engvall Nylander Kapanen
Clifford Spezza Barabanov
Gauthier

Rielly- Tanev,Demelo,Brodie
Muzzin Holl
Sandin Dermott
Lehtonen Liljegren

Matthews line takes on the hard matchups. Two work horses on his line who are good defensively.
Tavares line purely Offense
Nylander line both Offense and Defense. Engvall and Kapanen are good defensively.
Fourth line should be played 8 minutes a night.

If it doesn't work Engvall can take the 3C or Spezza.

 

[showtime8]

I think the cringy thing is that Mirtle seems to effectively write off Liljegren after one 11-game sample despite looking extremely advanced for his age. It's just like writing off Sandin after he did not look like an NHLer for long stretches of his 28-game sample.

However, that is only if they are referring to his overall potential, and not what kind of role he could fill next year. Liljegren is not going to be able to fill a top 4 role next year out of the gate... He will likely only be able to be a 5 or 6 at best to start, and then maybe mid-season can rise up to be a #4 if things go well. However if they think his overall potential is only a #5 or #6 after his brief NHL sample, then there are not too many teams with defensive prospects with top 4 potential.

The way I read that was he didn't see Liljegren as a top 4 defenseman in general. I can't comment anything beyond that, but it seemed like he only saw him as a #5-6.

I don't think it is based on the sample size of 11 games, although that could have played a factor.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

The way I read that was he didn't see Liljegren as a top 4 defenseman in general. I can't comment anything beyond that, but it seemed like he only saw him as a #5-6.

I don't think it is based on the sample size of 11 games, although that could have played a factor.

Then he seriously needs to re-evaluate his ability to evaluate talent, or watch more of Liljegren, because if he did either, then he should know how wrong he is for saying that right now.