Speculation: Free Agent Frenzy Part VI: Someone Get Gorton A Vesey Button.

[GeorgeKaplan]

Sigh.

Richards was 7th in the nhl in scoring 2 seasons before he joined us and then 10th the year before.

But that's nowhere near as elite and awesome and omfg let's sign him now as panarins 10 (with Kane) and 20th in the super low scoring nhl last season.

Didn’t Richards get concussed in his last season in Dallas too? I feel like the concussions that players get around age 30 have a bigger impact on their current and future play than when guys get them closer to 20

 

[Inferno]

Yes he was 31.

Btw, Panarin outscored the next highest scoring forward on his team by a whopping 34 points. Richards had Loui Ericksson attached to his hip at all times.

That's for this last season...does that argument hold water when he had toews Keith Kane and hossa playing with him?

Did l.e. produce so much because he had Richards? Or did Richards produce because of l.e. history says it's the former but believe what you will..I'm don't with this portion of the argument.

 

[kovazub94]

Why is panarin elite but Richard isn't?

Richards last 2 seen before joining us was a 91 in 89 and a 77 in 70...

Both better than anything panarin has ever done in his career ever. And he played a significantly more important position. He was 32 when we got him..and that's when his game started to fall off a cliff.

Brad Richards was definitely elite.

Drury wasn't elite...but he was pretty close.

You get all these guys from the wrong segment of their careers

Agree about the risk but there’s a difference compared to both Richard’s and Drury’s situation. As noted Panarin has much softer miles with only 3 NHL seasons so far, non-power forward and being a wing. I’d tack on an extra year to assume he’d stay at elite level until 33. That means elite performance for 6 seasonswhile he’s 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 and 33, and even after that he still could give a top6 for another year or two. This timeline actually should fit with the current and developing core of Chytil, Andersson, Kravtsov, Howden, Buchnevich, Zibanejad and Kreider with the younger ones taking over main roles in later years.

The price tag is also important. I lol’ed at $11m. I’d pass on this but for a winger (not center) and someone who wants to be here it’s over by at least $2m-$3m.

 

[Inferno]

You guys act like panarin has been hiding in a roll of bubble wrap his entire life. He played professional checking league hockey. He didn't work as an accountant guys. The miles might be softer...sure..but they are still miles.

 

[offdacrossbar]

i disagree he will suck when we are good and he will be good when we suck. he will be very good for the next 3-5 years.

i expect this season to be tough, but after that, i expect we will be a very good young team and with a 27/28 yr old panarin, i would feel pretty confident.

 

[Leetch3]

I don't love the idea of signing a big UFA to accelerate the rebuild.

right now we aren't even talking about accelerating the rebuild, its signing a big UFA to skip the rebuild and go right back to business as usual.

the rebuild has steps or phases...if you've made it thru phase 1 and 2 and then look at signing a guy push forward the process thru phase 3 into phase 4, that is completely different than being at the start of phase 1 and thinking the signing will let you skip phase 2 & 3

 

[kovazub94]

You guys act like panarin has been hiding in a roll of bubble wrap his entire life. He played professional checking league hockey. He didn't work as an accountant guys. The miles might be softer...sure..but they are still miles.

KHL is a much less physical league and its season is 2/3 the length of NHL’s.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Loui Eriksson produced right at his normal rates without Richards in 2011-12.

KHL is a much less physical league and its season is 2/3 the length of NHL’s.

Yeah and Panarin hasn't been exposed to any crazy deep playoff runs either.

 

[kovazub94]

right now we aren't even talking about accelerating the rebuild, its signing a big UFA to skip the rebuild and go right back to business as usual.

the rebuild has steps or phases...if you've made it thru phase 1 and 2 and then look at signing a guy push forward the process thru phase 3 into phase 4, that is completely different than being at the start of phase 1 and thinking the signing will let you skip phase 2 & 3

Absolutely! We probably can look at the upcoming season as the first evaluation if the rebuild is on track. If the future core guys are progressing toward reaching their expectations or, especially, ceilings, then signings Panarin as a UFA after this season should be seriously considered.

 

[Riche16]

It's not like started playing hockey at 19...he just played elsewhere...the miles are still there...maybe they are softer miles but it's still there.


The elite guys tend to stay elite...I just...I think that's something we wish to tell ourselves.

Example...guys like Richards who depend on their smarts will age better (wrong)
Guys like redden can always make that first pass (wrong)
Rick Nash could score 40 in his sleep with this supporting cast (wrong)
Guys like Drury who go to the net will always get those dirty hoald (wrong)


There's very little evidence that how good a player is will directly affect their aging curve. Maybe they have more to fall from but if you're paying a guy 8 or 9 mil...then you're paying for the best of the best. Will he be a 9mil player in even 3 years ..I'd say it's unlikely.

U forgot MSL is a gym rat and will play until he’s 50

And Yandle WILL fix the PP

 

[Thirty One]

U forgot MSL is a gym rat and will play until he’s 50

And Yandle WILL fix the PP

The PP scored once every 8 minutes with Yandle at 5-on-4.

 

[Riche16]

Two years ago no one thought Panarin would be available via FA

In two years MAYBE we can start discussing who is available via FA and who best suits this team to help push us into contention.

Again. Timing is a thing.

Hank was too early for this team... we tried to catch up to “his window” and sold the future.

Now people are trying to get out of paying that dinner check while starting another tab at the bar.

 

[Levitate]

Hank was too early for this team... we tried to catch up to “his window” and sold the future.

Now people are trying to get out of paying that dinner check while starting another tab at the bar.

Dude has played for this team for almost a decade and a half. Saying he was "too early" is a wild statement, lol. He's seen multiple iterations of this team come and go...coaches, players, styles, chances...

The Rangers had a window in which they were contenders. They came close, but didn't quite make it. That doesn't mean that they were never contenders to begin with. I don't blame them for pursuing a shot at the cup with deadline deals for guys like MSL, Yandle, etc (the only one I really dislike is the E Staal trade).

Hank wasn't "too early", the Rangers just ultimately weren't able to win the cup within the last window they had. That sucks, and it's now time to build it back up.

As for Panarin, a lot depends on how well this rebuild goes and how good their drafting has been. I would definitely not trade for him, that would be a waste of assets that could be used to help strengthen the teams prospect pool for the future, but say if Andersson and Chytil break into the NHL this season and look like legitplayers who are improving rapidly...if a couple of their D prospects pan out to actually be legitimate contributors and help solidify the D, maybe this team is back in the thick of things in a couple of years rather than 3-4 years, and maybe signing an elite forward to lead them towards that isn't a bad idea. Up to management to evaluate the teams progress this year and make decisions like that.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Two years ago no one thought Panarin would be available via FA

In two years MAYBE we can start discussing who is available via FA and who best suits this team to help push us into contention.

Again. Timing is a thing.

Hank was too early for this team... we tried to catch up to “his window” and sold the future.

Now people are trying to get out of paying that dinner check while starting another tab at the bar.

I appreciate the analogy but our situation is different than when Hank first stepped into the league.

We have a MUCH BETTER talent base this time around and will have another draft filled with picks before Panarin even becomes a factor. Hank took a team that had less talent in the system and should have continued to build and kept them as a bubble team until they basically backed their way into becoming a contender.

We're going to have some kind of base (whether or not its enough is totally debatable, like I said the FO should really commit to being bad this year) that just didn't exist last time around. Lets say hypothetically this team ends up with a top 3 pick in the 2019 draft, do you still feel the same way?

 

[Inferno]

i disagree he will suck when we are good and he will be good when we suck. he will be very good for the next 3-5 years.

i expect this season to be tough, but after that, i expect we will be a very good young team and with a 27/28 yr old panarin, i would feel pretty confident.

So he will be good for 3 to 5 years. If we suck next year and even under the most aggressive timeline are average the year after and contending the year after that...that's...at most 2 years with him being "very good" with the team being very good as well.

That's with an incredibly gracious aging curve and an incredibly gracious rebuild time.

2 year window....sure...where do I sign up.

Sigh.

 

[Levitate]

Can you imagine the Rangers drafting Jack Hughes, then signing Panarin?

Then Kravstov comes over?

 

[DutchShamrock]

Zucc has led us in scoring for the last few years.

He’s no drink stirrer

The problem with this place is someone can use the fact the shiny new toy led his team in scoring as evidence they are elite. The same rationale is applied to the failed, rusty old toy, and this comment is used to refute. And you don't refute panarin, because everyone wants the new toy. You refute the cautionary tale.

 

[Inferno]

I appreciate the analogy but our situation is different than when Hank first stepped into the league.

We have a MUCH BETTER talent base this time around and will have another draft filled with picks before Panarin even becomes a factor. Hank took a team that had less talent in the system and should have continued to build and kept them as a bubble team until they basically backed their way into becoming a contender.

We're going to have some kind of base (whether or not its enough is totally debatable, like I said the FO should really commit to being bad this year) that just didn't exist last time around. Lets say hypothetically this team ends up with a top 3 pick in the 2019 draft, do you still feel the same way?

Yes I'd feel the same way.

If we were already a playoff team..on the up swing...with several kids producing as expected..THEN I'd be all over panarin. That's the right time. This just seems totally wrong timing wise.

The only way I'd be all over panarin is if he either signs a super short term deal at a reasonable price tag...or if the team is super amazing next season thanks to everyone taking giant leaps and Quinn solving all our problems...short of that I just don't see it making any sense timing wise.

Panarin makes a lot more sense for a team like Nashville or the bruins than he does for us.

 

[NYR Viper]

Yes I'd feel the same way.

If we were already a playoff team..on the up swing...with several kids producing as expected..THEN I'd be all over panarin. That's the right time. This just seems totally wrong timing wise.

The only way I'd be all over panarin is if he either signs a super short term deal at a reasonable price tag...or if the team is super amazing next season thanks to everyone taking giant leaps and Quinn solving all our problems...short of that I just don't see it making any sense timing wise.

Panarin makes a lot more sense for a team like Nashville or the bruins than he does for us.

So just thinking out loud. If the Rangers signed Panarin next year, they most likely wouldn't have major cap issues until players like Kravtsov, Andersson, Chytil and others were at or near UFA age. That would be about 6-7 years from now, or about when Panarin's deal ends. Say the Rangers waited 3 years to sign a big UFA, those years where the young players may get paid big time would overlap more.

Not saying it's a reason to do it or not to, just a thought

 

[Cag29]

In 2 years, book it

Panarin Chytil Krat
KZB
Spooner Andersson Nam
Vesey Howden Fast

Skjei Karlsson
Rykov Pionk
Hajek ADA

Hank/Shesty

What if Hughes , Turcotte or Kakko is in the team?