Kaprisov or Kunin, 2017 1st and 2018 2nd or 3rd.
It's nice to think about but will never happen. Hextall won't trade Simmonds.
Flyers' 2017-18 roster discussion, part 2
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Kaprisov or Kunin, 2017 1st and 2018 2nd or 3rd.
It's nice to think about but will never happen. Hextall won't trade Simmonds.
Tripod
I hate this team
Sam Bennett + 1st is something to consider too.
He has shown flashes of what he can become, and Simmonds would be loved by Burke and Treliving. They also have a big need for a RW, and with Monohan, Backlund and Jankowski next year, their C depth is still intact.
And while they are not a contender, they are also finding out what it takes to become one against a heavy team like Anaheim.
Deadhead is wrong when he says we can't trade Simmonds for a prospect. It just needs to a NHL ready one or one that has not broken out yet. They get the better player got 2 years while we get hopefully the better player after that. Ideally, we duplicate the Carter or Richards deals. Only this time, we already have the future D in place and a pipeline of goalies and forwards on the way.
He has shown flashes of what he can become, and Simmonds would be loved by Burke and Treliving. They also have a big need for a RW, and with Monohan, Backlund and Jankowski next year, their C depth is still intact.
And while they are not a contender, they are also finding out what it takes to become one against a heavy team like Anaheim.
Deadhead is wrong when he says we can't trade Simmonds for a prospect. It just needs to a NHL ready one or one that has not broken out yet. They get the better player got 2 years while we get hopefully the better player after that. Ideally, we duplicate the Carter or Richards deals. Only this time, we already have the future D in place and a pipeline of goalies and forwards on the way.
BrindamoursNose
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BrindamoursNose
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no way cgy does this, but this is a no brainer for the Flyers. For them...its fixing one thing to spite another.
In addition, big difference in Richards/Carter than Simmonds, both the former players had contracts with much longer than 2 years remaining.
I'd probably do it for Bennett straight up, if you beleive in him, which again they probably wouldnt do.
I dont see how we get a Bennett level nhl prospect, maybe an AHL guy and picks.
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BernieParent
In misery of redwings of suckage for a long time
I don't know if we're great minds thinking alike or fools seldom differing
, but this is exactly the deal I had in my head on my way home from work today. Maybe it would seem steep for Calgary, but that's the value I'd demand or else no deal. Hopefully, the Edmonton surge with power forwards would give Calgary the impetus to bring in their own muscle to reignite the Battle of Alberta.
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I like Bennett and all, but I wouldnt trade Simmonds for him straight up. Wouldnt even consider it. There has to be another asset involved because Bennett is far from proven and it remains to be seen how good he will be at this level. His rookie season was solid but he regressed in year two.
EdmFlyersfan
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why is CGY trading 5-6 years min for 2 min without a comparable C replacement?
There is zero doubt Simmonds is better today.
for Simmonds I could see us getting picks/ all prospects or something like Bobby Ryan (not because of philly, OTT wants to move) and a couple seconds or something.
Wayne was probably never more valuable as an asset last off-season.
BernieParent
In misery of redwings of suckage for a long time
Calgary have their 1/2 centres in Monahan and Backlund and 4 other C's on their roster. Both of their young stars, Gaudreau and Tkachuk, are LW. Simmonds would fit the lineup like a glove.
LegionOfDoom91
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The last thing the Flyers should be doing is acquiring Bobby Ryan. His contract is awful.
I don't know if he'd do it but I wouldn't mind Hextall trading one of Schenn or Simmonds this offseason & replacing them short term with Justin Williams. If he's worried about the short term affects that is.
I don't know if he'd do it but I wouldn't mind Hextall trading one of Schenn or Simmonds this offseason & replacing them short term with Justin Williams. If he's worried about the short term affects that is.
Tripod
I hate this team
Again, they have Monohan and Backlund at C....with Jankowski ready to move up next year to #3 C.
On RW they have Ferland, Frolik, Chaison and Brower.
In any thread mentioning Bennett, the say they only deal him for a top 6 RW or a Dman to play with Brodie.
Bobby Ryan....huh??? We don't touch him in ANY deal.....let alone one for Wayne.
JojoTheWhale
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Bennett isn't a centerpiece to a Simmonds deal for me. My sights would be set higher. A Calgary first definitely wouldn't change that.
The tricky part is finding a forward prospect that would motivate me to do it who is in a situation where the team would be looking to buy. I really can't think of one beyond Kaprizov and Puljujarvi and I'm not the biggest fan of the latter.
The tricky part is finding a forward prospect that would motivate me to do it who is in a situation where the team would be looking to buy. I really can't think of one beyond Kaprizov and Puljujarvi and I'm not the biggest fan of the latter.
backlund is a ufa after this year. Bennett is going to replace him.
Backlund is the one they would be dealing.
I agree they would love Simmonds, and he fits their needs...I just dont see us being able to work out a deal.
Ryan is overpaid, but not a bad player. My point was, that is the only kind of "top 6" NHL now asset I see us getting for Simmonds. We might get a "throw in" guy like Simmonds or Gudas who is more of a diamond in the rough, and breakouts after we get them, but it won't look good on paper initially.
Imo, thats not Sam Bennett.
I cant see JW being interested in us unless we payday him.
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wow, I can't agree with you on this one. Bennett has actually done something in the league. He's our 2nd line C for the next 5 years...and possibly a 1c when G ages more.
This off-season, I think max Simmonds gets 2 firsts from a condtender. CGY is a builder like us...
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LegionOfDoom91
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It doesn't matter how good Ryan is or not. He's not nearly worth $7.25M for the next five years taking him to his mid 30's. Ottawa is very likely going to expose him the ED this summer to get out of the contract hopefully.
I don't agree with that at all though with Simmonds. You can get a top flight prospect+ for him. You're seriously underestimating how much GM's would overrate this Simmonds on the trade market. They can't help themselves when it comes to gritty players in general nonetheless guys who can impact the scoresheet. Lucic on an expiring contract with a $6M caphit brought in Martin Jones, Colin Miller, & the 13th overall pick in a deep 2015 draft. Jones was then flipped in another trade for a 2016 first rounder & a depth prospect in Sean Kuraly shortly after.
I'm not even advocating for Bennett (or really anybody at the moment as I doubt Hextall would pull the trigger on a Simmonds trade) but Bennett is falling out of flavor there in Calgary. He's not as highly thought of as he once was years ago fwiw.
lucic has all the PO experience and goals which factors in to his valuation to a desparate contender.
Essentially 2 firsts and a Hagg ish level prospect. I don't disagree that's definitely possible for Simmonds.
IMO Bennett is a top 10 under 21 forward asset in the league. They will be patient with him.
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LegionOfDoom91
Registered User
I seriously don't think that matters. You're getting a 30 goal power forward who's making under $4M for the next two years. If you don't think that will be in high demand I don't know what to tell you.
https://www.fanragsports.com/news/dreger-guesses-majority-trade-calls-flyers-target-simmonds/
I thought about Minny but they have cap issues, at least maybe. Granlund, Nino, Hula, Schroeder, Christian all need contracts. They have less than 12 million to sign 4-5 RFA's with Dumba getting paid in 18. They can't expose a big money FWD contract in expansion; and while likely to lose 1 of Coyle, Niederreiter, Zucker, or Spurgeon (I assume they use there last forward protection slots on Granlund, and E-EK) fitting Simmonds is difficult in the short-mid term even losing Neiderreiter. Fletcher can figure it out though.
In an ideal world where the hockey Gods love Philly a package of Kunin, and Tuch or Kunin 2018 1st and a 2017 3rd would make me happy for the rest of my life. The first one is a nuts pipe dream to me but GM's have done crazy things for cups before so who knows.
Magua
Entirely Palatable Product
For the price of a high end 4th liner at under $2 million if we eat 50%, I'm sure the other team can figure out any cap issues.
We've already discussed a Minnesota trade plenty. A lot of us here like(d) the POS Kunin and were really high on him last year at the draft and had him right with Rubtsov as our favorite. He's a quality prospect, probably on the wing, and it's not hard to see him being a 20-25 goal, 40-50 point player with grit. But he just can't be the center piece of a Simmonds trade. We have so many Kunin level guys in the organization already. We'll likely draft another one in a couple months. I doubt he's ever an elite top line player, and that's the potential any Simmonds trade requires. It would have to be Kaprizov+ or no dice. That's the level prospect required. I know some team out there would offer it; I just don't think Hextall would accept.
We've already discussed a Minnesota trade plenty. A lot of us here like(d) the POS Kunin and were really high on him last year at the draft and had him right with Rubtsov as our favorite. He's a quality prospect, probably on the wing, and it's not hard to see him being a 20-25 goal, 40-50 point player with grit. But he just can't be the center piece of a Simmonds trade. We have so many Kunin level guys in the organization already. We'll likely draft another one in a couple months. I doubt he's ever an elite top line player, and that's the potential any Simmonds trade requires. It would have to be Kaprizov+ or no dice. That's the level prospect required. I know some team out there would offer it; I just don't think Hextall would accept.
Magua
Entirely Palatable Product
An idea like that is where it's at for me. We acquired Flip for nothing essentially, so that's a stop gap who can add 40 points of offense for a year. Justin Williams might need to get a slight raise to come here, but it's hard to see him getting more than 2 years if that's all he got at age 33, and he's 2 years older. He's still a solid player by every metric, and likely he can add another 40-45 points. It's pretty low risk. All this allows the team to NOT take a step back in the next year or two, not tie themselves up long-term, and add a prospect(s) who could be of immense worth for the next decade. And Lindblom will step right in and contribute too.
Simmonds' points are capable of being filled in by committee and then some. Simmonds is nowhere near irreplaceable on-ice. He's a 30 goal/50-60 point player who is more 2nd line 5v5 and whose flaws are also the team's flaws. It's just his "intangibles" that people think are irreplaceable, and I haven't seen these intangibles magically transform the team into anything but the mediocre rebuilding bubble team we are.
I want depth. You don't need a 100 point guy to win a cup but you do need 4 lines that can score. If Kaprizov is the kind of price Simmonds will demand than I want 2 40-50 pt wings with upside and a 1st. As that is better imo than a 70-80 pt guy who will likely also play wing. Only way you get beat their is if Kirill will be the ~100 point guy in the NHL and how likely is that? Even then you fill ~3 needs and you cap situation improves, i'll take it.
Plus, If Kaprizov is that kind of player and the Wild are confident he commits to NA in '19, I see no reason the wild would have interest in moving him as he has more value now and later than Simmonds. It's still in their window and he'll be expected to produce immediately. Worst case scenario, assuming he comes over, is you get similar production and 9 years younger. Nonsensical for Minnesota to move him for a player of similar or less value. Which is to say I think you over value Simmonds and Kaprizov both.
I wouldn't complain if Philly acquires Kaprizov+ for Simmer, necessarily. I just think Fletcher would need to lose his mind to do so, plus the package would be smaller given his potential. Even if i'm not sold on it, it's there and Fletcher knows.
Unless you're acquiring a true dynamo and Simmonds isn't, the team giving up youth almost always comes out on the losing end. LA is a great example. The Richards trade is meh and largely bad for them across the board. It was the Carter move, an emergent Taffoli, and nabbing Gaborik that won them their cups.
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Teams are reluctant to give up their top prospect these days even for someone like Simmonds. Maybe in a crazed bidding war some GM loses their mind but I doubt it.
I agree the Flyers have Kunin level guys already in the system and are likely to take another with this year's first. Add Minnesota's first and it could possibly be two in this draft. But I still think the deal would be worth it. IMO, the Flyers are either going to have to draft their elite first line forwards or trade a young defenseman for one. So add a one Kunin level guy, maybe even two, to say Ghost in 2-3 years for the next elite young forwards who's relationship sours with his current club (Eichel?), and that's an overpayment package no GM could say no to.
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