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Proposal: Flames / Lightning

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blankall

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Jul 4, 2007
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HoseEmDown said:
At 21 Cirelli had a 19 goal season, Couturier didn't hit that many till he was 25. At 22 Cirelli was a 40+ point player, Couturier didn't hit that number till he was 25. Cirelli and Couturier aren't the same player but at Cirelli's age he's better than what Couturier was. Will he get to Couturier levels of goals and points? Probably not but should top 25 goals and 60 points a few seasons with just as good defensive play.

Backlund had 1 more point than Cirelli in two more games. Cirelli had more ES goals and points than Backlund. He is a good two way player but not as good as Cirelli according to Selke voters.

I don't know why you keep bringing up Cirelli's size, he's 6' 193 on NHL.com. Bergeron is listed at 6'1 195, not sure how 1" and 2lbs makes that big a difference?
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OMG... Why didn't I think of that? So you're saying all players are guaranteed to develop the same. So when one player gets the same amount of points as another at a given age, they develop exactly alike?

Seriously. Lol. Stop bringing up Bergeron and Couturier. No one is giving you that value on the off chance that Cirelli somehow becomes a superstar.
 
PAZ

PAZ

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DFC said:
Honestly... if the Aves retain, and add a bit, it's probably the best offer we've seen for Cirelli so far, and the only one that makes me think, "Well, if he HAS to go..."

It's the one offer that actually replaces Cirelli, and we don't have a skill player with Kadri's nastiness. I think he would be a good fit in TB.
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I think the most Sakic would retain is $1.5 mil, but with retention none of Timmins, Byram or Newhook would be going back. Could see Kadri /w $1.5 mil retention + some combination of Helleson, Kaut, Bowers, 1st, 2nd, etc.

I don't know if the Avs would do it though. When you consider Cirelli's raise which would probably be $6.5-7.5 mil on the Avs and Kadri's retention... is he worth an extra $3-4 mil over Kadri the next 2 years plus the other assets when it's right in the middle our current window? Long term definitely, but Mack's next contract comes up in 3 years and we should making the most of that window. If the opportunity presented itself would be a difficult decision.
 
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blankall

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The logic in this thread:

Valimaki is not playing first line minutes now, therefore, he has no value.

Cirelli is BeRGeRooooooooooohn!
 
Flyer lurker

Flyer lurker

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Sila v Kucherove said:
At what ages and with what players as linemates?
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When did Couts become a 30 goal player? When he had Giroux on his line.

Why did Couturier have third line teammates in 15-16 and 16-17? Because Hakstol really was that much of a moron. All you need to know how bad Hakstol was. With Hak they were flirting with worst record in the league. When Flyers changed to another dud coach in Scott Gordon they went on a big run. Nobody has ever confused Scott Gordon with Jon Cooper.

Your hot take of the day having Giroux and Voracek on your line will generate more points than Rafll.

Remember that when evaluating what future Cirelli will become.
 

2020 Cup Champions

Formerly Sila v Kucherove
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Flyer lurker said:
When did Couts become a 30 goal player? When he had Giroux on his line.

Why did Couturier have third line teammates in 15-16 and 16-17? Because Hakstol really was that much of a moron. All you need to know how bad Hakstol was. With Hak they were flirting with worst record in the league. When Flyers changed to another dud coach in Scott Gordon they went on a big run. Nobody has ever confused Scott Gordon with Jon Cooper.

Your hot take of the day having Giroux and Voracek on your line will generate more points than Rafll.

Remember that when evaluating what future Cirelli will become.
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I found a website with linemate data for his first big year; I just wanted that poster to look at the fact that we have 5 more years of data on Couts and at least one of those years with Giroux and not the Flyers equivalent of Killorn. I think we agree (I can't completely parse the sentence about the hot take).
 
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blankall

blankall

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Still All In said:
You seem pretty upset about all of it.
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I actually am not upset, and have a pretty big grin reading this thread. It's quite amusing really.

Posters in here honestly seem convinced that people will pay out for Cirelli on the off chance he becomes as good as Bergeron or Couturier. It's also amazing how much time TB fans are spending writing paragraphs and coming up with stats - all to try and convince competing fans to accept imaginary offers, like it will somehow make any difference.
 

viper0220

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Oct 10, 2008
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BurnEmUp said:
Cirelli and Cernak just turned 23, they are young, and if the Flames want to win anything with this core they need to add to it, because the core as it is now is likely not good enough to win anything. Specifically they need another top 6 C and a right shot top 4 defenseman which is exactly what those two players are haha.

This is exactly the type of trade the Flames need to do if it's available.
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They maybe 23 but I don't think those two players put the Flames over the top.
 
Flyer lurker

Flyer lurker

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hfboard Cirelli patterns.

1) go for Cirelli and offer just more than 1 and 3 but not much.

2)Offer picks that cannot play for TBL in 2021. Brilliant strategy for TBL to lose their 4th best forward for their 2021 cup run for a player who won't play until 2023.

3) Offer a defenseman that TBL would lose in ED as core of the trade. Another brilliant move. TBL should trade Cirelli for a player they will lose in a year. Gm of the year wrapped up for BriseBois there.

4) Get mad at TBL fan for declining and whine Cirelli is overrated.

5) Say my team should just offer sheet Cirelli.

6) TBL fan agreeing then offer sheet him.
 
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Ledge And Dairy

Ledge And Dairy

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Flyer lurker said:
Cirelli was 11th in 18-19 and had a much better year in 19-20. You can't be that obtuse to see Cirelli won't be top 10 selke.

But yes 2 way centers can't have offensive minded players on their lines. Its a brilliant strategy that all teams will take up. Flyers I am sure are taking Giroux off the Couts line and replacing him with Scott Laughton. Pasta will be playing with Krejci. Gallagher 30 goals pace last 3 years sorry Danault got to split up. Its a brilliant strategy to take off your 30 goals/70 point players off the 2 ways centers. Glad you know your hockey so i can learn from you.
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He was 11th last year, but you are also suggesting that he passed the 10 ahead of him qnd that Aho and Zibanejad didnt pass him this year. There 9s no guarantee he is top 10 at all.
 
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Flyer lurker

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Ledge And Dairy said:
He was 11th lasr ywar, but you are also suggesting that he passed the 10 ahead of him qnd that Aho and Zibanejad didnt pass him this year. There 9s no guarantee he is top 10 at all.
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Am I suggesting Cirelli passed Backlund and Lindholm? YEP
 
Flyer lurker

Flyer lurker

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Ledge And Dairy said:
He could have but I wouldnt be so sure. Flames hade one of the best PK's in the league this year and a lot of that is due to Backlund and Lindholm. I am a Bolts fan and I don't think he is for sure a top 10 selke player.
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Calgary player stats usually went down individually this year. I would be really surprised if any got top 10 Selke.

Z is on a team that was bottom 2 expected goals allowed. Z fantastic year, If you want Z over Cirelli in general yes I agree. Selke votes Cirelli> Z

Aho? I'm curious who gets more votes there.
 
CraigsList

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Since this thread is getting a bit out of hand, what would the Lightning like from the Flames if they were trade for Cirelli? Assuming that we don't want to go the OS route with one another.
 
Flyer lurker

Flyer lurker

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Czarchuk said:
Since this thread is getting a bit out of hand, what would the Lightning like from the Flames if they were trade for Cirelli? Assuming that we don't want to go the OS route with one another.
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Honestly, I don't see the fit with the Flames.

Flames have legit young d-men but Lightning have same problem not being able to protect them in ED.

Trades for 1st's are dumb x10000000 for Lightning.

Pelletier is a good start but he isn't enough for Cirelli.
 
Ledge And Dairy

Ledge And Dairy

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Flyer lurker said:
Calgary player stats usually went down individually this year. I would be really surprised if any got top 10 Selke.

Z is on a team that was bottom 2 expected goals allowed. Z fantastic year, If you want Z over Cirelli in general yes I agree. Selke votes Cirelli> Z

Aho? I'm curious who gets more votes there.
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Flames individual stat issues were on offensive production, not their defensive play. regardless both Backlund and Lindholm still out produced Cirelli this year. I am not saying they will finish ahead of him in votes but that they still have a decent chance of doing so.
 
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