Proposal: Flames and Avs

[eviohh26]

Should be interesting what he goes for. I said Horvat was a good comparable but damn Horvat was playing a hell of a lot better than Lindholm at the trade. 31G in 49 Games. And on top of that the Islanders were desperate to add a goal scorer to their team.

One would think that Horvats Value at the time was quiet a bit higher than Lindholms.

 

[McJedi]

IMO, in a redraft he would be 18 to 25ish. There isn't much that has changed. Ritchie needs a much larger subset of games played before anyone can re-rank him.

Avs fans are behaving like Habs fans here!

I bet team Canada wishes they had a redo on leaving him off the team for WJC.

I don’t think GMs obsess over where a guy was picked in 2021 or whatever. They see a player and figure out if he’d fit into their future plans.

We wouldn't. I get it if you don't want to trade him. That's fine, but we wouldn't accept just Ritchie. The value isn't where we need it. I'd sooner take offers on the table from Winnipeg or Vancouver than just Ritchie. Brustewicz is almost as good and the 1st and 2nd more than makes up the difference.

I hope the Flames get all that from Vancouver. That would be a great trade for the Flames. Ripping Vancouver’s GMs face off. Two high picks and a prospect you covet. Pull the trigger.

Good luck. I could care less if the avs get Lindholm. If they gotta overpay in trade to land him, let him go elsewhere.

Very little noise about the Avs actually wanting this Lindholm guy. They have been scouting Henrique though.

 

[SeanMoneyHands]

Flames take that offer and run.

 

[Mobiandi]

Elias Lindholm
Chris Tanev

For

Byram
C. Ritchie
1st Round Pick

What are your thoughts?

Done

Did you want the Avs to throw in Makar and also trade the 2027 1st with the promise to tank for Landon DuPont as well?

No need, we’ll just wait for him to hit the market

 

[Bender]

Done


No need, we’ll just wait for him to hit the market

It worked great for the Canucks and Joe Sakic when they signed him for the minimum because he's from Burnaby.

(Yes I've been here that long)

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

Disappointing you are happy with what you have. Good luck with that.
Lucklily those that run the Avs prob don't feel as smug as you.

It’s not about being happy with what we have, it’s about putting things into perspective. Is the price for Lindholm really going to be a combination of a 1st, Byram and Ritchie? There have definitely been some reasonable fans, but there’s also this contingent that seems insistent on demanding a return for Lindholm that only reflects his best season and completely ignores his statistical regression the past two seasons.

To look at it from a different standpoint. It’s one thing to be the third most productive player on your team when Tkachuk and Gaudreau have superstar seasons. It’s another thing to be the 4th most productive on your team behind Kadri, Coleman and Weegar. One demands a superstar return. Another returns a 1st + B prospect

 

[wetcoast]

Byram isn't getting traded for rentals.

Probably not but he also has a real hard time staying healthy and I'm a huge fan of his but his worth has diminished IMO.

I think the Avs future second line center is Calum Ritchie, people are really sleeping on him.

 

[Dr Amazing204]

No

 

[PAZ]

Probably not but he also has a real hard time staying healthy and I'm a huge fan of his but his worth has diminished IMO.

I think the Avs future second line center is Calum Ritchie, people are really sleeping on him.

You're welcome to think that and it has, but he's still worth a ton.

Friedman reported that Gauthier was offered for Byram straight up and the Avs declined.

 

[bringbacktheskate604]

Take out Byram and I would still be hesitant to do that deal.

Why do people have such hard-ons for prospects and picks? First off sorry avs fans but Bo is the next Girard with a fragile brain kicker but I get without an extension that's tough to swallow just in case he turns it around.
That being said saying no to a 1st and a likely 3c or a low end 2c both pieces years away to plug your biggest hole and a really good RHD is laughable.

 

[bringbacktheskate604]

Simply not true at all...


Casey Mittelstadt is available apparently. Trevor Zegras might be available according to The Athletic. Both of those guys would be top targets for me.

Casey has not been made available and Zegras is being possibly traded by a re-building team, the guy is the most overrated player in the league and is a centre the same Georgiev (sp) is a #1, in name only

 

[bringbacktheskate604]

You're welcome to think that and it has, but he's still worth a ton.

Friedman reported that Gauthier was offered for Byram straight up and the Avs declined.

You should share that link, not saying your lying but that sounds like something I'd have to hear it from Friedman and how he phrased it since he tends to say a lot of things that he's very ambiguous about. I could see the Avs saying no because they have nothing after Makar and Toews so Bo is a #3 by default but certainly not warranted.
I watch a ton of Avs games and you guys have real defensive and goalie issues. Quite frankly Nate is saving you guys.

 

[Scintillating10]

Elias Lindholm
Chris Tanev

For

Byram
C. Ritchie
1st Round Pick

What are your thoughts?

Probably a go. Yup. Going to be huge to get those two.

 

[John Mandalorian]

You should share that link, not saying your lying but that sounds like something I'd have to hear it from Friedman and how he phrased it since he tends to say a lot of things that he's very ambiguous about. I could see the Avs saying no because they have nothing after Makar and Toews so Bo is a #3 by default but certainly not warranted.
I watch a ton of Avs games and you guys have real defensive and goalie issues. Quite frankly Nate is saving you guys.

He said that the Avs reply was that it would need to be more than Gauthier alone.

Elias Lindholm
Chris Tanev

For

Byram
C. Ritchie
1st Round Pick

What are your thoughts?

Byram and Lindholm are close enough to being considered a wash.

Tanev does not = Ritchie and a first.

 

[Cypher]

Why do people have such hard-ons for prospects and picks? First off sorry avs fans but Bo is the next Girard with a fragile brain kicker but I get without an extension that's tough to swallow just in case he turns it around.
That being said saying no to a 1st and a likely 3c or a low end 2c both pieces years away to plug your biggest hole and a really good RHD is laughable.

A young, cost controlled top4 dman is worth a lot more than a rental with 1 goal in his last 23 games.

I didn't even consider Tanev because you can argue Tanev wouldn't even crack the Avs top6. Bednar likes JJ and Malinski there. So not paying for something the Avs don't need.

So essentially its Richie (last years 1st) and a 1st in 2024 for Lindholm? Ya no thanks. You get a player, prospect, and a 1st, not what is essentially two 1st. If Avs are paying that much, they are going after somebody with some term.

 

[John Mandalorian]

A young, cost controlled top4 dman is worth a lot more than a rental with 1 goal in his last 23 games.

I didn't even consider Tanev because you can argue Tanev wouldn't even crack the Avs top6. Bednar likes JJ and Malinski there. So not paying for something the Avs don't need.

So essentially its Richie (last years 1st) and a 1st in 2024 for Lindholm? Ya no thanks. You get a player, prospect, and a 1st, not what is essentially two 1st. If Avs are paying that much, they are going after somebody with some term.

The Avs could potentially add Tanev hoping to bring him back and then trade Manson after his NMC goes from full to modified.

 

[wetcoast]

You're welcome to think that and it has, but he's still worth a ton.

Friedman reported that Gauthier was offered for Byram straight up and the Avs declined.

Gauthier ended up fetching Drysdale and a 2nd though and that's a pretty good haul.

I love Bryan but his injury problems would be problematic for any team wanting to trade for him.

Hopefully he stays healthy for a longer stretch this time.

 

[Double Dion]

I bet team Canada wishes they had a redo on leaving him off the team for WJC.

I don’t think GMs obsess over where a guy was picked in 2021 or whatever. They see a player and figure out if he’d fit into their future plans.

I hope the Flames get all that from Vancouver. That would be a great trade for the Flames. Ripping Vancouver’s GMs face off. Two high picks and a prospect you covet. Pull the trigger.

Good luck. I could care less if the avs get Lindholm. If they gotta overpay in trade to land him, let him go elsewhere.

Very little noise about the Avs actually wanting this Lindholm guy. They have been scouting Henrique though.

Overpay? Toronto paid a prospect, a 1st, 2nd and 3rd for ROR who was having a worse year than Lindholm. Henrique would definitely be cheaper. It would be interesting watching Henrique try to skate with one of McDavid or RNH. Oilers would roll you in that scenario. The Avs have a window. Getting all upset because someone wants fair value for a player is silly.

He said that the Avs reply was that it would need to be more than Gauthier alone.



Byram and Lindholm are close enough to being considered a wash.

Tanev does not = Ritchie and a first.

I think Byram is worth more than Lindholm. I think Ritchie is worth more than Tanev. Fair value for Lindholm is a 1st, 2nd and prospect. Fair value for Tanev is a 2nd and 3rd.

It’s not about being happy with what we have, it’s about putting things into perspective. Is the price for Lindholm really going to be a combination of a 1st, Byram and Ritchie? There have definitely been some reasonable fans, but there’s also this contingent that seems insistent on demanding a return for Lindholm that only reflects his best season and completely ignores his statistical regression the past two seasons.

To look at it from a different standpoint. It’s one thing to be the third most productive player on your team when Tkachuk and Gaudreau have superstar seasons. It’s another thing to be the 4th most productive on your team behind Kadri, Coleman and Weegar. One demands a superstar return. Another returns a 1st + B prospect

No, that's way too much. 1st and Ritchie with a small add. Or Lindholm and a 2nd and 3rd for Byram.

 

[Cypher]

The Avs could potentially add Tanev hoping to bring him back and then trade Manson after his NMC goes from full to modified.

Meh. Manson is 2 years younger and has the same cap hit this year. Doubt you'd be saving much when compared to Tanev's next contract.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Can flame fans give some clarity on why Lindholm's numbers have fell off a cliff. Especially goal scoring?

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Overpay? Toronto paid a prospect, a 1st, 2nd and 3rd for ROR who was having a worse year than Lindholm. Henrique would definitely be cheaper. It would be interesting watching Henrique try to skate with one of McDavid or RNH. Oilers would roll you in that scenario. The Avs have a window. Getting all upset because someone wants fair value for a player is silly.


I think Byram is worth more than Lindholm. I think Ritchie is worth more than Tanev. Fair value for Lindholm is a 1st, 2nd and prospect. Fair value for Tanev is a 2nd and 3rd.


No, that's way too much. 1st and Ritchie with a small add. Or Lindholm and a 2nd and 3rd for Byram.

Im not paying more than what vegas paid for mark stone, having a good season, who was also extended. Ritchie plus 2nd round prospect (Behrens) plus filler. TO also got one of the best 4th line grinders in Acciari, who was worth a 2nd/3rd by himself. Alot of retention too using a 3rd team.

Hell no to the second offer, byram is not going anywhere.

 

[Double Dion]

Im not paying more than what vegas paid for mark stone, having a good season, who was also extended. Ritchie plus 2nd round prospect (Behrens) plus filler. TO also got one of the best 4th line grinders in Acciari, who was worth a 2nd/3rd by himself. Alot of retention too using a 3rd team.

Hell no to the second offer, byram is not going anywhere.

The Mark Stone trade was 5 years ago. He plays a different position and he was injured (potentially career ending) when he went to Vegas. It's not really a comparable. We have 2 comparables from just last year in ROR and Horvat that are far more relevant. Behrens (if he would sign in Calgary, we've had bad luck with college guys in the past) would be an attractive piece. Ritchie would be an attractive piece. I'd need one more piece of value though. A 2nd round pick worth of value.

 

[CF84]

Can flame fans give some clarity on why Lindholm's numbers have fell off a cliff. Especially goal scoring?

He's doing the dirty work Tkachuk provided while also being defensively responsible so he's up against the boards far more than he had to be before. When he was on a line with Johnny and Tkachuk he was excellent defensively, but he could also count on Johnny to carry the play and Tkachuk to do some of the dirty work which really freed him up to get open. Sharangovich is now receiving the passes that were once Lindholm's to one-time and his production is suffering because of all the heavy lifting. I love Sharangovich, and Huberdeau is beginning to find his groove, but they would both be better suited as 2nd line players.

I don't think Lindholm is a game breaker, but he is the perfect complimetary player to elevate a really talented line as a center or a winger. The Flames have three okay 2nd lines right now and most contenders will have 2 full lines that are better than what Lindholm has to currently work with so I think he'll be far better on a team that doesn't rely on him to do most of the heavy lifting.