Proposal: Flames and Avs

[DJJones]

Simply not true at all...


Casey Mittelstadt is available apparently. Trevor Zegras might be available according to The Athletic. Both of those guys would be top targets for me.

Both those teams would want way more than Byrum and I'm not even a fan of Zegras

 

[GirardSpinorama]

It’d be more like 1st, 2nd and Ritchie for those two imo

2nd and Ritchie for Lindholm and a late first for Tanev.

Switch Hanifin for Tanev and I could see it value wise but I don’t think the Avs need Hanifin

We can throw in a 2nd round prospect or equivalent and we probably will need retention.

But sure, ritchie plus 2024 first plus foudy/behrens for those two and the Avs would be cup favorites.

 

[Super Hans]

I think it's pretty fair, then you get the equally ridiculous rubberbanding counters like "take out Byram and it's still questionable" and "that gets you Lindholm alone" and it gets you right back in the middle.

 

[Bond]

Agreed. I've heard Flames fans throw it around, they don't get it. Trading a cost-controlled young asset for rentals would be a terrible decision on the part of the Avs.

It is because of that one Athletic article that said the Flames would have interest in Byram in a Lindholm trade. I'd be very surprised if Lindholm gets more than a 1st and a prospect like Ritchie. I am expecting a 1st and a B prospect at the rate he is playing

 

[super6646]

It is because of that one Athletic article that said the Flames would have interest in Byram in a Lindholm trade. I'd be very surprised if Lindholm gets more than a 1st and a prospect like Ritchie. I am expecting a 1st and a B prospect at the rate he is playing

Just because it is written by a sports writer doesn't mean they are always accurate either.

 

[redandyellowcametobe]

Not bad actually, pretty good for everyone. Calgary gets younger and a nice young D, avs push for another cup run.

Umm no, it’s not good for the Avs and this package wouldnt happen for a UFA lol. Funny people think this is what it would take

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Ritchie has 41 points in his first 25 OHL games this season after recovering from shoulder surgery, scoring at the best PPG rate in the league. To me, he's showing that maybe he only dropped to 27OA because he played most of his draft year with a torn labrum, and his talent might be closer to a top 5 pick. No, he won't help them this year, and maybe not next year either, but he is exactly the kind of affordable, high skill player that they need to make more runs at the Cup. Having him on his ELC for 3 years could be a huge advantage and trading him for a single roll of the dice with Lindholm before he gets a stupid contract in UFA would be a huge mistake.

And the Avs don't have a 2nd until 2026.

And that’s fair but I think there are other teams that would easily offer a first and a good prospect (ie Winnipeg, Carolina, Vancouver etc.) personally I would prefer a C prospect like Ritchie as opposed to a winger and a late first, as I think it’s the one position the Flames are lacking youth

 

[Fig]

I think the basis of this deal only makes sense if the Flames are both retaining on our players AND taking on 1-2 cap dumps from the Avs to increase flexibility for this season and perhaps several years down the road. That's the only way I can see someone like Byram included if the Avs can't muster up other assets to move those cap dumps.

Just because it is written by a sports writer doesn't mean they are always accurate either.

Or is it accurate, but the interpretation isn't accurate.

Of course we'd be interested in Byram. We'd probably be interested in Byram as part of a prospects/futures only package if Avs were willing listen. But it also doesn't mean Avs are interested in continued listening to us requesting him as part of the basis of that trade.

 

[Perratrooper]

Lindholm is currently tied for 111th in scoring and tied for 48th in center scoring (based on what the NHL website considers to be a center).

Adam Henrique has one less point in one less game and Monahan has three more points in the same amount of games. Now I’m not saying I prefer either over Lindholm, but what I am saying is that there are comparable players having comparable seasons that’s teams aren’t asking for Byram+Ritchie for.

Montreal fans have said they’d consider Monahan+Allen for RyJo+first to put the value difference into perspective.

There’s probably a deal to be made, just not a this outrageous price.

 

[Bond]

Or is it accurate, but the interpretation isn't accurate.

Exactly. Somehow it went from the Flames would be interested to Byram in the rumour mill.

 

[DJJones]

Lindholm is currently tied for 111th in scoring and tied for 48th in center scoring (based on what the NHL website considers to be a center).

Adam Henrique has one less point in one less game and Monahan has three more points in the same amount of games. Now I’m not saying I prefer either over Lindholm, but what I am saying is that there are comparable players having comparable seasons that’s teams aren’t asking for Byram+Ritchie for.

Montreal fans have said they’d consider Monahan+Allen for RyJo+first to put the value difference into perspective.

There’s probably a deal to be made, just not a this outrageous price.

Yes, you can have Monahan for much cheaper than Lindholm. Everyone knows that.

If you think they are comparable players why would you even consider Lindholm?

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Both those teams would want way more than Byrum and I'm not even a fan of Zegras

I'm confused. Where did I say in my post that I wouldn't be willing to add to Byram?


"Way more" is just hilarious as well quite frankly. Byram still carries tremendous value as a cost controlled Top 4D with top pairing upside. And fwiw Buffalo fans have already said a Byram/Mittelstadt sway 1 for 1 is fair value with the issue for them being that they don't have the need for a LD because of Power and Dahlin.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Ritchie has 41 points in his first 25 OHL games this season after recovering from shoulder surgery, scoring at the best PPG rate in the league. To me, he's showing that maybe he only dropped to 27OA because he played most of his draft year with a torn labrum, and his talent might be closer to a top 5 pick. No, he won't help them this year, and maybe not next year either, but he is exactly the kind of affordable, high skill player that they need to make more runs at the Cup. Having him on his ELC for 3 years could be a huge advantage and trading him for a single roll of the dice with Lindholm before he gets a stupid contract in UFA would be a huge mistake.

And the Avs don't have a 2nd until 2026.

You know there is literally an option to sort by pts/g on the OHL website. Maybe do that before spouting off wrong information. Ritchie has the 5th best pts/g rate with 1.54, the last 2 years that rate would have finished 8th in the league. If you genuinely think his scoring rate is is closer to a top 5 pick them Toronto must have drafted a perennial superstar in Easton Cowen.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

Lindholm is currently tied for 111th in scoring and tied for 48th in center scoring (based on what the NHL website considers to be a center).

Adam Henrique has one less point in one less game and Monahan has three more points in the same amount of games. Now I’m not saying I prefer either over Lindholm, but what I am saying is that there are comparable players having comparable seasons that’s teams aren’t asking for Byram+Ritchie for.

Montreal fans have said they’d consider Monahan+Allen for RyJo+first to put the value difference into perspective.

There’s probably a deal to be made, just not a this outrageous price.

At ES, Lindholm is tied with Ross Colton with 21 points, good for 53rd among Cs. Henrique's 18 is tied for 79th, Monahan's 17 ES points is tied for 86th.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

You know there is literally an option to sort by pts/g on the OHL website. Maybe do that before spouting off wrong information. Ritchie has the 5th best pts/g rate with 1.54, the last 2 years that rate would have finished 8th in the league. If you genuinely think his scoring rate is is closer to a top 5 pick them Toronto must have drafted a perennial superstar in Easton Cowen.

Maybe if the OHL could hire someone to design a website that doesn't require me to scroll down 14 pages before I can find the ability to scroll to the right (which also makes their page navigation scroll), maybe I would have done that instead of trying to do the math to compare him to the top 5 scorers and missing a few guys. Still, he's top 5, and has shown significant improvement over last year.

And, I genuinely think playing most of his draft year with a torn labrum probably hurt his draft position, which is why valuing him like a 27th OA pick is problematic. Maybe he wouldn't have been a top 5 pick had he been healthy, but top 10 is certainly within the realm of possibilities.

 

[Perratrooper]

Yes, you can have Monahan for much cheaper than Lindholm. Everyone knows that.

If you think they are comparable players why would you even consider Lindholm?

The point I’m making is that the value difference between Monahan and Lindholm isnt Byram+Ritchie.

 

[Perratrooper]

At ES, Lindholm is tied with Ross Colton with 21 points, good for 53rd among Cs. Henrique's 18 is tied for 79th, Monahan's 17 ES points is tied for 86th.

So Lindholm gets top powerplay opportunities and can’t score is what I take from that.

Again, not saying Monahan or Henrique are as good as Lindholm, but the value difference isn’t Byram+Ritchie. No one is arguing Lindholm isn’t more desirable, my point is that the ask seems to be out of touch based on comparable other options.

 

[Fig]

Exactly. Somehow it went from the Flames would be interested to Byram in the rumour mill.

Yep. The leap from, Flames would be interests and maybe inquire about Byram to fans freaking out Byram is on the table.

Nah. That's silly. It's possible that in reality, Flames are interested in him AND Avs are not making him available.

 

[John Mandalorian]

It is because of that one Athletic article that said the Flames would have interest in Byram in a Lindholm trade. I'd be very surprised if Lindholm gets more than a 1st and a prospect like Ritchie. I am expecting a 1st and a B prospect at the rate he is playing

Might it have something to do with the story involving the Avs, Byram, and the Flyers? According to the story, the Avs didn’t shut down the idea but needed more than Gauthier one for one.

 

[belair]

This gets Lindholm only

It's Elias, not Hampus.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Maybe if the OHL could hire someone to design a website that doesn't require me to scroll down 14 pages before I can find the ability to scroll to the right (which also makes their page navigation scroll), maybe I would have done that instead of trying to do the math to compare him to the top 5 scorers and missing a few guys. Still, he's top 5, and has shown significant improvement over last year.

And, I genuinely think playing most of his draft year with a torn labrum probably hurt his draft position, which is why valuing him like a 27th OA pick is problematic. Maybe he wouldn't have been a top 5 pick had he been healthy, but top 10 is certainly within the realm of possibilities.

Are you computer illiterate? If you are on mobile you can drag left an right on the sceeen, if you are on PC you can click the scroll wheel then move the mouse to the left or right, if you use a track pad on a laptop you use a 2 finger drag to go left and right.

Nobody is saying he is a bad prospect but he was drafted right where he was expected to go and still would go in a redraft now, 20-30 range. He wasn't good enough to make World Juniors, and he's not doing anything in particular in juniors that says he should be above his peers. Of players who went even top 15 in the draft, 4 of them are NHL regulars, and everyone else that was eligible to play in the WJC was in that tournament. If we expand that to the top 20, only Colby Barlow did not go to World Juniors, but Oliver Bonk (#22), Gabe Perreault (#23), and Otto Stenberg (#25) did.

Hell, I would argue Andrew Cristal and Riley Heidt who were drafted 40th and 64th OA better prospects than Ritchie right now based on CHL production.

 

[Double Dion]

Are you computer illiterate? If you are on mobile you can drag left an right on the sceeen, if you are on PC you can click the scroll wheel then move the mouse to the left or right, if you use a track pad on a laptop you use a 2 finger drag to go left and right.

Nobody is saying he is a bad prospect but he was drafted right where he was expected to go and still would go in a redraft now, 20-30 range. He wasn't good enough to make World Juniors, and he's not doing anything in particular in juniors that says he should be above his peers. Of players who went even top 15 in the draft, 4 of them are NHL regulars, and everyone else that was eligible to play in the WJC was in that tournament. If we expand that to the top 20, only Colby Barlow did not go to World Juniors, but Oliver Bonk (#22), Gabe Perreault (#23), and Otto Stenberg (#25) did.

Hell, I would argue Andrew Cristal and Riley Heidt who were drafted 40th and 64th OA better prospects than Ritchie right now based on CHL production.

They are both better than the guy we drafted at 16th OA too unfortunately. Ritchie is a nice prospect, but he's not an elite prospect. Similar tier to a guy like Pelletier. A 1st and Ritchie is a fair offer, we might get a better one, but we might not too.

We have 2 comparable trades last season, the one for ROR and the one for Horvat. ROR was having a worse season than Lindholm but is probably the better player. Horvat was having a better season than Lindholm, but Lindholm is the better player.

Both guys went for a 1st++.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Are you computer illiterate? If you are on mobile you can drag left an right on the sceeen, if you are on PC you can click the scroll wheel then move the mouse to the left or right, if you use a track pad on a laptop you use a 2 finger drag to go left and right.

Nobody is saying he is a bad prospect but he was drafted right where he was expected to go and still would go in a redraft now, 20-30 range. He wasn't good enough to make World Juniors, and he's not doing anything in particular in juniors that says he should be above his peers. Of players who went even top 15 in the draft, 4 of them are NHL regulars, and everyone else that was eligible to play in the WJC was in that tournament. If we expand that to the top 20, only Colby Barlow did not go to World Juniors, but Oliver Bonk (#22), Gabe Perreault (#23), and Otto Stenberg (#25) did.

Hell, I would argue Andrew Cristal and Riley Heidt who were drafted 40th and 64th OA better prospects than Ritchie right now based on CHL production.

He started the season injured, no way was he gonna make wj missing all of the camp.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Are you computer illiterate? If you are on mobile you can drag left an right on the sceeen, if you are on PC you can click the scroll wheel then move the mouse to the left or right, if you use a track pad on a laptop you use a 2 finger drag to go left and right.

Nobody is saying he is a bad prospect but he was drafted right where he was expected to go and still would go in a redraft now, 20-30 range. He wasn't good enough to make World Juniors, and he's not doing anything in particular in juniors that says he should be above his peers. Of players who went even top 15 in the draft, 4 of them are NHL regulars, and everyone else that was eligible to play in the WJC was in that tournament. If we expand that to the top 20, only Colby Barlow did not go to World Juniors, but Oliver Bonk (#22), Gabe Perreault (#23), and Otto Stenberg (#25) did.

Hell, I would argue Andrew Cristal and Riley Heidt who were drafted 40th and 64th OA better prospects than Ritchie right now based on CHL production.

It’s not only the production. A lot of what he does translates. He has some slick mitts.

 

[Double Dion]

It’s not only the production. A lot of what he does translates. He has some slick mitts.

He's got some swing and miss to his game. I'd say he's more elusive than a guy with soft hands. He can make defensemen look bad, but he's not great in tight. I see him as a middle six winger in the NHL. The fact that he's from Calgary is a bonus for me with all the flights out of town we've seen.