Finnish club to join KHL, future of ET

[icing]

1) no money, 2) no will, 3) politics etc etc

1) No (don't really understand what you meant by this..Swe+Fin = more money)
2) Partly
3) Yes

 

[icing]

You have the conservative way of thinking here. A nordic league would mean more revenue? Yeah, but also double the amount of teams sharing it.
With the KHL it would work like this: Say four swedish teams join and four finnish ones. All the young hockeyfans in both countries would soon figure out that it's in the KHL the best players in europe are playing, not in the SHL or SM-Liiga. It's there the real swedish and finnish champions are crowned. Many of them would naturally start rooting for the fewer KHL teams instead of the second class teams in the domestic leagues. The KHL teams fanbases grows on the expense of the teams in the two minor leagues, making the clubs richer and richer, all whilst farm teams like Örebro HK gets less and less. This is how our KHL teams will get a chance to compete with the rest of the KHL, signing better and better players the richer the clubs become.

Yes it would increase revenue. Sponsors reach two markets instead of one. TV broadcast to two markets instead of one. Double amount of teams sharing is not an issue if the revenue is more than today. The league wont share just the Swedish side of the money, nor the Finish side. They will share the total amount of the revenue.

I might have some of a negative view when it comes to joining the KHL (that doesnt make it conservative). I'm open to a Nordic League. I'm not stuck in the "old swedish way". You on the other hand seems to have no grasp of the sport- or fan culture that do exist here in Sweden despite the flag next to "country". Supporting a KHL team will not come naturally to anyone but a very few.

 

[Jonimaus]

I have no ideal about Malmo and its joining KHL, if ever... but if I were you, I would not laugh You know what Rotenberg said yesterday: "we are going to buy arena all over the Europe, the same "mechanism" as in Hartwall/Jokerit case", "we aquired Hartwall/Jokerit to join KHL" I am sure, you can make own conclusion. Be calm, I dont believe swedish club to join KHL anytime soon.

I'm laughing about that if KHL wants to absorb a close to broke club in a city that really doesn't care all that much about hockey, they can be my guest. Malmö actually has a decent avg attendance number, but it comes from having a large arena in terms of swedish standards and the fact that during the big rivalry games they sell out. Apart from that, not so much.

 

[vorky]

1) No (don't really understand what you meant by this..Swe+Fin = more money)
2) Partly
3) Yes

1) look at budget of SHL/SM-Liiga clubs and compare to KHL

 

[Eidyia]

To be honest, I feel pretty sad not too this again in SM-liiga after the next season: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBWwsI304go

 

[icing]

1) look at budget of SHL/SM-Liiga clubs and compare to KHL

Why would I compare to KHL? That was not my intention. I wrote about increasing revenue in Sweden and Finland.

 

[Jussi]

I'm laughing about that if KHL wants to absorb a close to broke club in a city that really doesn't care all that much about hockey, they can be my guest. Malmö actually has a decent avg attendance number, but it comes from having a large arena in terms of swedish standards and the fact that during the big rivalry games they sell out. Apart from that, not so much.

Rotenbeg was actually talking about only the arena business on behalf of his Arena Events company. They plan to purchase arenas in Russia an elsewhere in Europe. Due to their ties to SKA, they can't e.g. purchase a majority share in Jokerit because it would create a conflict of interest, which lends to believe they won't/can't start a KHL team in every arena they purchase. Their goal is to double the result of the Arena Events company and springing up teams all over Europe is not going to do that. Hartwall areena e.g. has not made a profit during it's existence and the it's owner Helsinki Halli Oy (which Jokerit hockey club was merged with in 2011), has 21 million euros in debt.

 

[Jussi]

I just realized who Roman Rotenberg reminds me of:

I'll refer to him as Kumar from now on.

 

[Eidyia]

^His younger brother (I think...), Boris, has played football for HJK juniors, Jokerit FC(!) , HJK, Khimki, loads of loan teams and lately with Olympiakos Nicosia. I remember when there was claims for him to play in our national team so he wouldn't play for Russia.

He obviously never played for either, but as you can see in Boris's youth teams, the Rotenbergs have spend lots of time in Finland: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boris_Rotenberg

So I wouldn't call this a Russian takeover.

 

[Finnpin]

^^ Boris Sr is the dad...his brother is Arkady. Boris Sr. sons are Roman and Boris Jr....I guess this is how it goes? or did it? LOL

Roman told hartwall areena will get some facelift: better lighting, better sound systems etc. --> more better show for Jokerit KHL games. And when the deal with Hartwall is over --> the name probably gets changed.

I guess Roman was already living in Helsinki or will as he will be the boss running Hartwall Areena.

 

[vorky]

^^ Arkady is the dad? Roman and Boris are the sons... or?

Roman told hartwall areena will get some facelift: better lighting, better sound systems etc. --> more better show for Jokerit KHL games. And when the deal with Hartwall is over --> the name probably gets changed.

I guess Roman was already living in Helsinki or will as he will be the boss running Hartwall Areena.

When does the deal with Hartwall expire? The arena is called Hartwall since the beginning, right?

Roman is also a PR/Marketing manager of SKA, so he must be there as well. I would say, he will travel a lot Dont have where he has/will have residence...



EDIT

BROTHERS
Boris Romanovich Rotenberg (1957)
Arkady Romanovich Rotenberg (1951)

SONS of Boris
Roman Borisovich Rotenberg (1981, SKA manager)
Boris Borisovich Rotenberg (1986, footballer)

SONS of Arkady
Igor Arkadievich Rotenberg (outside sport)

 

[Finnpin]

Roman is also a PR/Marketing manager of SKA

And you guys have been telling that SKA's marketing is top class in European/World level?

That means good stuff for Jokerit games.

 

[BalticWarrior]

And you guys have beenn telling that SKA's marketing is top class in European/World level?

That means good stuff for Jokerit games.

Pretty much,yes.

 

[Finnpin]

When does the deal with Hartwall expire? The arena is called Hartwall since the beginning, right?

Took some time but I found it. 2007 they signed 10 year deal so 2017 it expires. Though money can always change things faster. Yes it's been Hartwall from the beginning (1997).

 

[BalticWarrior]

So it looks like support or lack thereof regarding Jokerit joining KHL is not as one sided as for example Jussi tries to make it seem. Interesting.

 

[Finnpin]

So it looks like support or lack thereof regarding Jokerit joining KHL is not as one sided as for example Jussi tries to make it seem. Interesting.

Looks like he turned from lover to a hater and is dissing almost everything about Jokerit now

Of course lots of fans are mad/shocked at this but things can change in couple years. Some leave, some stay and some new ones will join.

 

[vorky]

And you guys have been telling that SKA's marketing is top class in European/World level?

That means good stuff for Jokerit games.

I claim SKA management is top in europe hockey, on par with NHL, why not? Btw, I dont want to glorify SKA.. not the best club in world.

Attendance is very important indicator of markerting. Look at this

SKA had attendance at 54% of arena´s capacity in 08/09, Rotenberg came to club in summer 2011 if I know, 12/13 attendance was 97%. Remember, there is Zenit in the city. Zenit is far more popular than SKA.

Look at SKA´s marketing, when Ilya played there.. world class martketing.

Revenue from souvenires is bigger now than before, SKA has partnership with Zenit, you can buy SKA´s souvenires at Zenit´s shops in all Russia as well. SKA opened the new shop in center of StPete (watch their youtube).

SKA has pre-game show. Someone dislike it (StarWars topic this season), someone likes.

Televisions in StPete were not interesting in broadcasting SKA matches because "nobody cares about hockey and SKA, we have only football and Zenit". Rotenberg came, rating of SKA is great at 100TV (sometimes better than Zenit´s).

One thing is important and hard-core fans will dislike it. SKA had problems with hard-core fans, they was against club, boycotts. I dont know the reason, but it had someting to do with Riha as coach (came from rival - Spartak) and these fans behave like "football fans" (fights, yelling on opponent team /f-- you etc/ etc). SKA destroyed these fans, banned their entrance to arena and create new fanclub - SKA Sector. You know, you cannot yell racial etc slogans at arena. Some fans of Slovan did it, KHL warned Slovan and fans did repeat the behaviour again. There are big fines for clubs in KHL for such behaviour of fans. The same in UEFA Leagues, no rasism etc.

Thx for Hartwall

 

[BalticWarrior]

Looks like he turned from lover to a hater and is dissing almost everything about Jokerit now

Of course lots of fans are mad/shocked at this but things can change in couple years. Some leave, some stay and some new ones will join.

But nevertheless,i have always liked Finland and finnish people,so if Dinamo Riga sucks in 2014/15 season,jokerit will probably be my go-to team

 

[QnebO]

Yes it would increase revenue. Sponsors reach two markets instead of one. TV broadcast to two markets instead of one. Double amount of teams sharing is not an issue if the revenue is more than today. The league wont share just the Swedish side of the money, nor the Finish side. They will share the total amount of the revenue.

I might have some of a negative view when it comes to joining the KHL (that doesnt make it conservative). I'm open to a Nordic League. I'm not stuck in the "old swedish way". You on the other hand seems to have no grasp of the sport- or fan culture that do exist here in Sweden despite the flag next to "country". Supporting a KHL team will not come naturally to anyone but a very few.

I would love some kind of Nordic league, where Elitserien and SM-Liiga would combine, maybe Sweden would have couple of more teams than Finland but not huge difference. Requirement for teams would be international airport and modern enough arena. Would love it with hybrid rinks with safety-glasses and totally or almost commercial free jerseys (one standard placed and sized commercial on back under the number maybe) and professional full time refs, and league managing it's own rules, not being under IIHF in any manner (im not sure if both leagues even are at this day, not totally at least). It would raise the level of the both leagues, getting more top organisations playing in the same league, and Finland - Sweden thing would relatively easily start to work I think.

Sweden would still have Allsvenskan and Finland would still have Mestis. Couple of teams from both top leagues would drop to them.

No problem with some team playing in the KHL too, thought. More top hockey is always better for me. Let's just take part of it and help developing it.. Top hockey on prime time.

 

[vorky]

I would like to ask if there is website about companies registered in Finland. I want to know legal backround of Arena Events

 

[QnebO]

I would like to ask if there is website about companies registered in Finland. I want to know legal backround of Arena Events

http://www.ytj.fi/english/

You can call them ask for help if you're really intrested

 

[Finnpin]

I would love some kind of Nordic league.

Was my dream long time or then totally Western European league with full regular season and playoffs...not some tournament Champion League's or Trophy's. But those are not going to happen so KHL here we go.

IFK's Everi was now talking about some "European League"...just blah blah words... it's going to be just some tournament type of thing and IFK stays in SM-liiga still.

 

[QnebO]

Was my dream long time or then totally Western European league with full regular season and playoffs...not some tournament Champion League's or Trophy's. But those are not going to happen so KHL here we go.

IFK's Everi was now talking about some "European League"...just blah blah words... it's going to be just some tournament type of thing and IFK stays in SM-liiga still.

Yeah. ET tournaments ect have 1 problem.. No one cares about them. If they want to do it, they must do it totally right away. National leagues should be gone and one European league instead. KHL seems to be the only one who can get that kind of big league thing done at this point.

 

[vorky]

Yeah. ET tournaments ect have 1 problem.. No one cares about them. If they want to do it, they must do it totally right away. National leagues should be gone and one European league instead. KHL seems to be the only one who can get that kind of big league thing done at this point.

I have followed KHL´s expansion and euro league/IIHF+ET/ projects for years. Today I have an feeling that Swedes (federation+clubs) are against any european league, they have own SHL and does not want to change it. So, I give 0,001% that we will see euro league in near future, yes we can have ET or its upgrade. Maybe Finn/German others (not Czechs) clubs would support idea of pan-euro league instead of domestic leagues, but dont have majority... plus, having euro league without Swedes? No reality, the same like having UEFA Champions League without clubs from England. I claim that euro league must be based on money, you have money, you can join. Nowadays only Russians have money in hockey. Why to create euro league without Russians? Thefore Kummola said about 8 KHL teams. btw, rest of Europe will have how many teams? 10-12? or you want to have 40 clubs in regular stage (not qualification)?? IMO new project (this ET/IIHF) can not have more than 20-24 clubs in regular stage. We should create strong "Champions League", not weak one. We can not copy football/basketball model (number of clubs) because hockey is unbalanced in Europe (not counting KHL) - strong SHL, SM, NLA + 2nd stage DEL, CZ + rest. You can not have in CL 8 clubs from SHL and 4 from SM or 1 from Slovakia (btw KHL team), because of money.

CL as maximum

KHL - 8 teams (4 RUS, 4 non-RUS)
SHL, SM, NLA - 4 teams
DEL, CZ - 3 teams
rest - 1 or 2 teams in Q

 

[Peter25]

So it looks like support or lack thereof regarding Jokerit joining KHL is not as one sided as for example Jussi tries to make it seem. Interesting.

In Jatkoaika (the biggest Finnish hockey messageboard) the initial reaction was mostly negative, but more and more fans have written that after some time to think they have changed their minds and are even looking forward watching Jokerit play in the KHL.

There are also some fans of other teams who say that they plan to watch a few Jokerit games in the KHL.