HF Habs: Expansion Draft 2021

[Number 57]

So given that...we can assume that UFAs can't be protected then?

I just posted a link with all the rules The Curious Role Of UFAs In The Expansion Draft - SinBin.vegas

''UFAs are treated like any other player on a roster meaning they can be protected as part of the nine or 11 protected players or exposed by their current''

 

[lamp9post]

From what I know, you can protect a pending UFA if you want to. If you protect them, they can't be taken in the expansion draft. Then you can either trade their rights (like Edmundson to us for example), try to sign them yourself, or let them walk (like Radulov)

The issue with drafting pending UFA's is that you can't talk to them prior to cause they are still under contract until July 1st. Expansion draft is usually about a week or so before and now they have got rid of the interview period before July 1st. Taking a pending UFA is risky to expansion teams.

Not true. Expansion teams have an exclusive window to negotiate with upcoming UFA's, so Seattle can't be prevented from approaching upcoming UFA's regardless of whether or not they are on the protected list. Which essentially makes it pointless to protect them, though I'm not sure if the rules expressly prohibit it.

The only reason I can see for an expansion team to select a UFA is if they want to acquire negotiating rights of a player beyond their exclusive window and up to July 1st (or whenever the FA period begins this year). The only reason for a team to protect a UFA would be to prevent this and thereby retain an extra week or so of negotiating rights between the expansion draft and the start of free agency. In other words, highly unlikely.

 

[Habs Halifax]

So given that...we can assume that UFAs can't be protected then?

I think they still can be protect but not 100% sure. Protection list were final June 18th and right before the exclusive UFA window Vegas had. I believe that if you protected any UFA, Vegas was not allowed talking to them in that 72 hour window. However, usually, by that point, a team knows if the guy is going to sign or not so why would they protect a pending UFA if they know he will walk?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Not true. Expansion teams have an exclusive window to negotiate with upcoming UFA's, so Seattle can't be prevented from approaching upcoming UFA's regardless of whether or not they are on the protected list. Which essentially makes it pointless to protect them, though I'm not sure if the rules expressly prohibit it.

The only reason I can see for an expansion team to select a UFA is if they want to acquire negotiating rights of a player beyond their exclusive window and up to July 1st (or whenever the FA period begins this year). The only reason for a team to protect a UFA would be to prevent this and thereby retain an extra week or so of negotiating rights between the expansion draft and the start of free agency. In other words, highly unlikely.

Yes but protection lists were before that 72 hour window.

* Teams finalized their protection lists before Jun 18th, 2017
* Vegas had a 72 hour window from Jun 18th - 20th to talk to pending UFA that were not protected
* Expansion draft was Jun 21st
* Interview period was Jun 23rd to Jun 30th
* Free agency was July 1st

Did any team protect a pending UFA? Just because they didn't, it don't mean they couldn't

 

[Number 57]

Not true. Expansion teams have an exclusive window to negotiate with upcoming UFA's, so Seattle can't be prevented from approaching upcoming UFA's regardless of whether or not they are on the protected list. Which essentially makes it pointless to protect them, though I'm not sure if the rules expressly prohibit it.

The only reason I can see for an expansion team to select a UFA is if they want to acquire negotiating rights of a player beyond their exclusive window and up to July 1st (or whenever the FA period begins this year). The only reason for a team to protect a UFA would be to prevent this and thereby retain an extra week or so of negotiating rights between the expansion draft and the start of free agency. In other words, highly unlikely.

I just can't see this being true at all. If Bergevin had protected Radulov even though he was UFA, there's no way Vegas could have signed him. He only becomes UFA on July 1st. There is a negociation window for unprotected UFAs, sure, but not players who are protected by their clubs

 

[417]

I just posted a link with all the rules The Curious Role Of UFAs In The Expansion Draft - SinBin.vegas

''UFAs are treated like any other player on a roster meaning they can be protected as part of the nine or 11 protected players or exposed by their current''

THANK YOU!!! lol

 

[Habs Halifax]

I just can't see this being true at all. If Bergevin had protected Radulov even though he was UFA, there's no way Vegas could have signed him. He only becomes UFA on July 1st. There is a negociation window for unprotected UFAs, sure, but not players who are protected by their clubs

That's how I see it too. You can protect a UFA if you want too and if you do, the expansion team can't talk to them until July 1st or unless you trade their rights to them before hand.

 

[lamp9post]

I just can't see this being true at all. If Bergevin had protected Radulov even though he was UFA, there's no way Vegas could have signed him. He only becomes UFA on July 1st. There is a negociation window for unprotected UFAs, sure, but not players who are protected by their clubs

I agree that it seems counterintuitive. That was my understanding based on this article, which doesn't distinguish UFA's in terms of whether or not they were on a protected list. Perhaps the article wasn't precise enough or maybe I read it incorrectly.

Expansion Draft Primer: What's Exclusive Free Agency?


The team is expected to have an exclusive negotiating window with free agents during the expansion draft - that could potentially be 48 hrs. This would mean that before other teams can begin scooping up existing NHL players, Vegas would have the opportunity to get a head start.
During this two-day stretch, the only team that would be allowed to sign active NHL players is the Golden Knights.
The only catch is that if Vegas signed a player who most recently played for Team X, the Golden Knights would no longer be able to select a player from Team X in the Expansion Draft.

 

[Number 57]

I agree that it seems counterintuitive. That was my understanding based on this article, which doesn't distinguish UFA's in terms of whether or not they were on a protected list. Perhaps the article wasn't precise enough or maybe I read it incorrectly.

Expansion Draft Primer: What's Exclusive Free Agency?


The team is expected to have an exclusive negotiating window with free agents during the expansion draft - that could potentially be 48 hrs. This would mean that before other teams can begin scooping up existing NHL players, Vegas would have the opportunity to get a head start.
During this two-day stretch, the only team that would be allowed to sign active NHL players is the Golden Knights.
The only catch is that if Vegas signed a player who most recently played for Team X, the Golden Knights would no longer be able to select a player from Team X in the Expansion Draft.

The bolded just mean Vegas will be able to negociate with pending UFAs before July 1st (during the 3-day window)

It doesn't mean that they can steal away protected players (UFAs or not)

Anyway, if you think about it, supposed Radulov was protected, and was on the verge of signing with Montreal, there would be no point in Vegas taking him. He would just walk free on July 1st and sign with MTL

 

[Scriptor]

In order to circumvent handshake deals with their own looming UFAs for teams looking to protect more players at the expansion draft, Seattle should be able to claim a looming UFA and they should be awarded a 2nd round pick if that player's previous team ends up re-signing them. That would be the penalty for trying to circumvent the expansion draft rules.

To avoid this, the team would need to protect their looming UFA, even if he hasn't signed quite yet.

 

[lamp9post]

The bolded just mean Vegas will be able to negociate with pending UFAs before July 1st (during the 3-day window)

It doesn't mean that they can steal away protected players (UFAs or not)

Anyway, if you think about it, supposed Radulov was protected, and was on the verge of signing with Montreal, there would be no point in Vegas taking him. He would just walk free on July 1st and sign with MTL

I agree that that seems reasonable. The article I read seemed to imply that the Vegas would have a negotiating window with all upcoming UFA's.

 

[Treb]

Jake Allen IS My guess.how Many other teams have better goalie to expose? Veteran goalie with good contract

Arizona: Kuemper or Hill
Dallas: Khudobin
Florida: Montembeault (unless Bob waives)
Minnesota: Talbot or Kahkonen
Montreal: Allen
Vancouver: Demko or Holtby

There are also a bunch of goalies that will be UFA, so they don't need to draft 2 goalies for their NHL roster.

 

[Burke the Legend]

In order to circumvent handshake deals with their own looming UFAs for teams looking to protect more players at the expansion draft, Seattle should be able to claim a looming UFA and they should be awarded a 2nd round pick if that player's previous team ends up re-signing them. That would be the penalty for trying to circumvent the expansion draft rules.

To avoid this, the team would need to protect their looming UFA, even if he hasn't signed quite yet.

Why would Seattle waste an expansion pick on a pending UFA??

 

[SlafCaufield]

Love joel so far

Will we be able to keep him from expansion??

 

[De Montreal]

You free up just as much money if they take a guy like Chiarot/Edmundson. And it's not like we don't have depth on D, losing either guy next year shouldn't hurt us that much unless Romanov really struggles.

it's true, even is we lose Allen we still save a bit of money (with Primeau as a replacement at 850k), but it would be better to lose Chiarot, Edmundson or Byron

 

[Habs Halifax]

Love joel so far

Will we be able to keep him from expansion??

I think if Edmundson plays this way all season, we will protect Weber, Petry, Edmundson. Edmundson over Chiarot cause he's got term to his contract. It's possible that if we get into cap trouble, we trade Chiarot and promote Romanov. I'm a fan of Chiarot and what he provides for us but salary cap issues and I prefer to retain Tatar and Danault if we can get them on the right term and AAV. Lots of questions we don't have answers for

Romanov / Weber
Edmundson / Petry
Kulak / Fleury or Brook
Mete

 

[SlafCaufield]

I think if Edmundson plays this way all season, we will protect Weber, Petry, Edmundson. Edmundson over Chiarot cause he's got term to his contract. It's possible that if we get into cap trouble, we trade Chiarot and promote Romanov. I'm a fan of Chiarot and what he provides for us but salary cap issues and I prefer to retain Tatar and Danault if we can get them on the right term and AAV. Lots of questions we don't have answers for

Romanov / Weber
Edmundson / Petry
Kulak / Fleury or Brook
Mete

for me I like Joel but I think Chiarot is better and id rather try to get Cherry an extension and risk Edmunson

 

[Vachon23]

for me I like Joel but I think Chiarot is better and id rather try to get Cherry an extension and risk Edmunson

same ! I like Joel but I would protect Chiarot before him

 

[Habs Halifax]

for me I like Joel but I think Chiarot is better and id rather try to get Cherry an extension and risk Edmunson

I think Romanov fits well with Weber and Edmundson fits well with Petry. Chiarot fits well with Weber at the moment but we can't keep Romanov down forever. Edmundson and Petry have been awesome together! If that continues, Edmundson is a keeper with me... even if I like Chairot a lot too. Cap issues at play

Edmundson and Petry are +/- leaders in the NHL right now. That is unchartered territory for Petry! I would not ignore that

 

[Habs Halifax]

same ! I like Joel but I would protect Chiarot before him

I think both Edmundson and Chiarot bring good things to the table for us. I like them both. However, Edmundson and Petry have been unreal together so far and I would not touch that if they continue to play like that all season. Then you look at Romanov sliding into the top 4D next year? I think he fits better with Weber vs Petry.

If Edmundson plays like that all year, I'm protecting him over Chiarot. And if we run into trouble signing Tatar and Danault, I'm looking at what we can get for Chiarot in a trade. Hate to trade him but our forward group is not the same without Tatar and Danault

 

[JT AM da real deal]

You guys are gonna lose 1 of Ben or Joel which kinda sucks but it is da reality of expansion draft .. hard to pick one over da other ... both very very good defenders

 

[Habs Halifax]

You guys are gonna lose 1 of Ben or Joel which kinda sucks but it is da reality of expansion draft .. hard to pick one over da other ... both very very good defenders

It's not set exactly on who we loose in the expansion draft. I think Allen has the highest probability but we have a season to complete and it's up to Seattle on who they take.

 

[dkd]

The whole idea of an "expansion draft" is so broken.

 

[Beendair Donedat]

I wouldn’t worry too much about the expansion draft. Bergevin will be in contact with their GM and has more than enough picks/prospects to swing a deal to keep a guy if he wants him badly enough.

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

I think if Edmundson plays this way all season, we will protect Weber, Petry, Edmundson. Edmundson over Chiarot cause he's got term to his contract. It's possible that if we get into cap trouble, we trade Chiarot and promote Romanov. I'm a fan of Chiarot and what he provides for us but salary cap issues and I prefer to retain Tatar and Danault if we can get them on the right term and AAV. Lots of questions we don't have answers for

Romanov / Weber
Edmundson / Petry
Kulak / Fleury or Brook
Mete

I think we will protect Weber, Petry, and Fleury. Edmundson doesn't have a long-term future with the habs (max 3 years after this season). Even if we protect Edmundson, Seattle could pick Chariot, which would basically be the same result.

We have a lot of LD prospects (Norlinder, Guhle, Harris, etc.) that will be able to replace Edmundson in a couple of years.
With the loss of Juulsen, Brook and Fleury are our only RD prospects, so it's even more important to keep them.

(Edmundson picked by Seattle)
Romanov - Weber
Chariot - Petry
Kulak/Mete - Fleury

Then in 2 years one of Norlinder, Guhle or Harris replaces Chariot.