Evander Kane

[Hodge]

Teams that have won since DW's first full season:

Tampa, Carolina, Anaheim, Detroit, Pittsburgh, Chicago, Boston, LA, Washington, St Louis. 10 teams in 17 seasons. Using the "no rings" argument fails to recognize how few teams, players, executive staff actually win. It's fair to criticize his bad deals the last 5 years, but to dismiss his ability to win a cup when so few teams have won is picking spoiled, low-hanging fruit.

For the record, I've been pretty disappointed with the moves he has made since the Kane trade. That said, I also think he has handcuffed himself with and to the team, meaning that he can't make any drastic moves and that anyone replacing him won't be able to do better. That also means that constantly complaining about DW and his moves while offering no substantial solutions has grown incredibly tiresome to sift through on this site.

How many other teams had two Hall of Fame forwards for their entire primes and still failed to win a championship during DW's tenure with the Sharks?

 

[Bizz]

Boughner sucks

If I was DW i'd be cutting Boughner's already short leash over all of this too. The fact that a coach allowed all of this to happen on his watch is pretty sad.

 

[Bizz]

How many other teams had two Hall of Fame forwards for their entire primes and still failed to win a championship during DW's tenure with the Sharks?

The Kings didn't win one with Prime Gretzky and Robitaille.

 

[tiburon12]

How many other teams had two Hall of Fame forwards for their entire primes and still failed to win a championship during DW's tenure with the Sharks?

Totally forgot 2 players and a GM are the only ingredients to winning in the cap era. Thanks for reminding me. But the Canucks come to mind.

Also, Marleau is only getting into the hall because of the Games Played record. Let's not pretend he was ever on the same caliber as other #2 forwards on cup winning teams. (Zetterberg, Perry, Malkin, Toews, Point).

 

[Makoshark]

So is there a way Kane's contract can be outright cancelled ala Mike Richards?

 

[OffSydes]

Jumbo picked up Kane at the airport.
Jumbo leaves and now everyone hates Kane.
Did Jumbo keep him in check?

 

[TheBeard]

How many other teams had two Hall of Fame forwards for their entire primes and still failed to win a championship during DW's tenure with the Sharks?

They had two HOF at the same position, neither of which were defense or goaltending.

 

[Patty Ice]

How many other teams had two Hall of Fame forwards for their entire primes and still failed to win a championship during DW's tenure with the Sharks?

Marleau was never a dominant player as this post would suggest.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

So is there a way Kane's contract can be outright cancelled ala Mike Richards?

Yes there is but it's likely a league decision and not a team one.

 

[STL Shark]

Totally forgot 2 players and a GM are the only ingredients to winning in the cap era. Thanks for reminding me. But the Canucks come to mind.

Also, Marleau is only getting into the hall because of the Games Played record. Let's not pretend he was ever on the same caliber as other #2 forwards on cup winning teams. (Zetterberg, Perry, Malkin, Toews, Point).

Also thinking of Edmonton who has cycled through 3 different Hart Trophy winners in the past decade and won like 1 playoff series. Have two of the top 5 players in the entire league and still aren’t anywhere close to being a contender.

Washington finally got theirs, but their getting 2 games further in the season doesn’t really differentiate them much in terms of the job that the GM did in assembling the team. I.e. in a macro sense DW has put great teams out there for most of two decades. At some point it falls on the players to get it over the hump. Some teams were flawed, but almost every team not named Tampa Bay that wins a Cup has flaws and the players band together and get it done.

Outside of Yzerman, not many guys out there that I’m pointing to and saying that guy is a clear upgrade over DW. Change for the sake of change in that sort of position rarely works out.

 

[TheBeard]

Remember when Babcock left Detroit and everyone thought he was the missing link in Toronto? Yeah, it’s not so easy finding consistency.

 

[polmaniac932]

While I’m not sure I want Kane on the team, you have zero basis for this. You going use stats from 8 years ago to prove last season was a fluke? He’s been a top 6 forward at worst with the Sharks and a team MVP at best.

ZERO basis? Are you suggesting it’s hard to find a scoring forward declining in his 30s?

Plus, you can use stats from 1-2 years ago to prove his point.

 

[tiburon12]

Also thinking of Edmonton who has cycled through 3 different Hart Trophy winners in the past decade and won like 1 playoff series. Have two of the top 5 players in the entire league and still aren’t anywhere close to being a contender.

Washington finally got theirs, but their getting 2 games further in the season doesn’t really differentiate them much in terms of the job that the GM did in assembling the team. I.e. in a macro sense DW has put great teams out there for most of two decades. At some point it falls on the players to get it over the hump. Some teams were flawed, but almost every team not named Tampa Bay that wins a Cup has flaws and the players band together and get it done.

Outside of Yzerman, not many guys out there that I’m pointing to and saying that guy is a clear upgrade over DW. Change for the sake of change in that sort of position rarely works out.

Right, and after the TDL, really not much the GM can do.

If there were a better GM available who could somehow get the Sharks out this jam, i'd say go for it. But there isn't.

 

[sharski]

Jumbo picked up Kane at the airport.
Jumbo leaves and now everyone hates Kane.
Did Jumbo keep him in check?

not unusual for a group of people to have one glue person who can form a connection with everyone in the group, tends to organize the meetups, be a mediator, etc.

but if they’re not around, the dynamics change and it becomes apparent that everyone there is cool with each other, but they’re not THAT cool

who knows what goes on in the locker room, but it would not surprise me if Jumbo and Pavs were those glue guys, but Couture/Burns/Hertl/EK65/etc are not

 

[TheBeard]

ZERO basis? Are you suggesting it’s hard to find a scoring forward declining in his 30s?

Plus, you can use stats from 1-2 years ago to prove his point.

I mean he’s basically been a near 30 goal scorer every year since 16-17, so unless I’m missing the point…

 

[Mafoofoo]

All of this coming out just confirms my thinking that Pavelski and Thornton together had a much bigger influence on lockerroom attitude/conduct/mindset than previously thought.

 

[Alwalys]

I mean he’s basically been a near 30 goal scorer every year since 16-17, so unless I’m missing the point…

Dude is pretty irreplaceable considering what's out there.

 

[TheBeard]

Dude is pretty irreplaceable considering what's out there.

Plus he became a pretty good passer and he seemed to have his temper under control. This whole ordeal couldn’t have come at a worse time for him or the team.

 

[tiburon12]

Plus he became a pretty good passer and he seemed to have his temper under control. This whole ordeal couldn’t have come at a worse time for him or the team.

Plus he's an excellent penalty killer. It definitely came at a bad time and will ultimately put a lot of pressure on young guys to score.

My guess is that if Kane doesnt play, this team starts playing like the 19/20 Blue Jackets. Low scoring, defense-first games.

 

[Cas]

My guess is that if Kane doesnt play, this team starts playing like the 19/20 Blue Jackets. Low scoring, defense-first games.

With our coaching staff and defensive corps?

Oof.

 

[tiburon12]

With our coaching staff and defensive corps?

Oof.

hah i know.

 

[FunkyPhin]

While I wouldn't blame DW for all this drama, however, at this point, even if the investigation shows that Kane has not been gambling on his own games (which I likely think is the case) if Kane is still a Shark by the start of the season I'd jump on the fire DW train.

Clearly there is something sour in this locker room, and with as many players voicing their displeasure over Kane, I can't see how a responsible GM keeps the status quo.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

He's doing it because he can and there are no consequences. Doesn't matter what his reasoning.

Yes, now you see what I mean

 

[Jargon]

I think Kane could potentially fix this situation if, a. The gambling allegations are false and b. He goes on an apology tour and genuinely tries to do better. I’m doubtful but it’s possible.

I do 100% think Joe and Pavs kept him and the lock room in check. Kane hung out with Joe and I think there’s no world where Kane would be late to practice when Joe Thornton is on the team to tear him apart in front of everyone. With Joe and Pavs gone, who is left? Karlsson still feels new. Burns is kind of a goofball. Couture seems like a more introverted dude who wouldn’t want to confront Kane. Who is left? Hertl? Meier? I can’t picture it.

But also Kane needs to grow the hell up.

 

[LadyStanley]

Pashelka speculated in Merc today that the Sharks COULD buy Kane out this summer. (As Hill has elected arbitration, the team has a 48 hour window after that contract is settled or arbitration award announced, to buy a player out.)

However, with four years remaining under contract, there would be dead cap space for EIGHT years!!!


(Arbitration hearings scheduled between August 11 and 26, IIRC.)

And the timing may be such that the Sharks do not know the results of the NHL investigation by that time. (It could be that the NHL could ban Kane if the allegations are found to be true, and eliminate any residual impact from his contract. There also may be a way to terminate contract for cause if allegations true.)