Management Eugene Melnyk -Lawsuits, rants, and more...

[Sens of Anarchy]

I am sure the last few guys that were in there told him where to go too ...in a not so public manner.

Is this conjecture? or when you say you are sure does that mean you know it happened?

 

[harrisb]

Do you know how much it costs to have stables, hundreds of horses, breeding fees, facilities, many trainers, jockeys, vets, medical facilities, etc?

the Canadian triple crown as well as the other wins don’t begin to put a dent in those costs. Horse racing is a rich mans play toy, jockeys and trainers can make more than most owners.

given the unparalleled success, I can’t imagine such a wealthy man giving all that up.

again, I wonder why?

also begs the question, given the massive losses he has stated the sens incur, why would such a wise, rational and successful businessman sell a highly profitable horse racing stable and keep a money sucking hockey team?

Lets see what I can dig up:.

In 2001, Melnyk purchased the prestigious Mockingbird Farm in Ocala, Fla. After renaming it Winding Oaks Farm, he committed to restoring it back to its original glory. Melnyk’s horses have yielded victories in all three legs of the Canadian Triple Crown: the Queen’s Plate, the Prince of Wales Stakes and the Breeders’ Stakes. In the United States, Melnyk’s horses have celebrated wins in the Breeders’ Cup Sprint, the Travers Stakes, the Jim Dandy Stakes and the Dwyer Stakes. Internationally, his horses have twice won the Barbados Gold Cup and participated in the prestigious Dubai World Cup. In 2007, Melnyk became the first owner to win the Triple Tiara, the Canadian Triple Crown for fillies with Sealy Hill. He was presented with the 2004 Eclipse Award (Speightstown) and was named the national owner of the year by the United States Thoroughbred Owners and Breeders Association (TOBA) in 2005. A winner of 14 Sovereign Awards, Melnyk was recognized as Canadian owner of the year and breeder of the year in 2009 and in August of 2017 he received the tremendous honour of being inducted into the Canadian Horse Racing Hall of Fame.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

He sank the Lebreton project because he couldn't afford to play with the big boys.

Of course he's broke. If he wasn't he wouldn't have single handedly ruined his best chance in years at dramatically improving ticket sales at higher prices.

Yeah, let’s start this argument up again too.

EM knew the deal was shit. No support from city and less chance of income from additional buildings. As proven by PwC in their report.

PwC reckoned that even under its most optimistic economic scenario, there would be room for both 900 Albert and LeBreton only during the first two years of the LeBreton project. Between 2020 and 2024, PwC expected 900 Albert and LeBreton would each make available about 200 units annually for a total of 400 — against estimated demand of only 170.

Under PwC’s pessimistic economic scenario, not only would there be no takers for 900 Albert or LeBreton, there would be a surplus of 480 residential units annually for all the other downtown projects between 2020 and 2024.

Business decision. Get over it.

Anything else is pure speculation or fake news

 

[Wondercarrot]

Are you kidding me? Do you really think he wasn’t a billionaire two years ago?

Here we go again. Sorry, I am not bothering to look up the last three threads on this.

Yes, that’s exactly what I’m saying.
I can’t say I particularly care what threads you look up, but I appreciate that you somehow felt that it was your burden to bear.

 

[harrisb]

What did the Trinity study find? What the below shows is that after signing an agreement he welched when finding out his sparkling personality wouldn’t lead to a free rink.

I’m positive that Ruddy was in this to lose his shirt.

Yeah, let’s start this argument up again too.

EM knew the deal was shit. No support from city and less chance of income from additional buildings. As proven by PwC in their report.

PwC reckoned that even under its most optimistic economic scenario, there would be room for both 900 Albert and LeBreton only during the first two years of the LeBreton project. Between 2020 and 2024, PwC expected 900 Albert and LeBreton would each make available about 200 units annually for a total of 400 — against estimated demand of only 170.

Under PwC’s pessimistic economic scenario, not only would there be no takers for 900 Albert or LeBreton, there would be a surplus of 480 residential units annually for all the other downtown projects between 2020 and 2024.

Business decision. Get over it.

Anything else is pure speculation or fake news

 

[harrisb]

I looked it up, Melnyk’s net worth as reported by Forbes did not substantially change before or after his divorce. As an estimate let’s say he was worth 1.2B and needed to give her 400m as they were together before his riches. That means he somehow turned his 800m remaining, most of which was tied up in a hockey team in to a 400m profit after tax in a single year. I say this cause his net worth is still 1.2B post divorce. This man makes Warren Buffet look like an amateur, those are INSANE returns

Does anyone find it ironic that the mod who talks about proven facts uses mainly speculation to back up their position?

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

I looked it up, Melnyk’s net worth as reported by Forbes did not substantially change before or after his divorce. As an estimate let’s say he was worth 1.2B and needed to give her 400m as they were together before his riches. That means he somehow turned his 800m remaining, most of which was tied up in a hockey team in to a 400m profit after tax in a single year. I say this cause his net worth is still 1.2B post divorce. This man makes Warren Buffet look like an amateur, those are INSANE returns

Does anyone find it ironic that the mod who talks about proven facts uses manly speculation to back up their position?

What year did he get divorced in?

 

[harrisb]

What year did he get divorced in?

2010

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

2010

That’s perfect.

A definitive and factual response.

I think he had $1.2b in 2017

That’s my basis.

You are right. Know one knows for sure, but my point is, I can’t see him lose so much so quickly.

He hasn’t spent money on the team, according to most.

Do you have a link to the failed investments in pharma? What company was it?

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Ottawa Senators owner Melnyk in divorce proceeding

He threatened the Citizen and employees with a lawsuit if info the Citizen had was published.

He had the records sealed.

OTTAWA — A court in Barbados has sealed Ottawa Senators owner Eugene Melnyk's divorce file and banned publication of any of its details without the court's permission. Melnyk is in the midst of a divorce proceeding with Lori Melnyk. They have been married for 16 years.Dec 1, 2010

 

[Do Make Say Think]

EM knew the deal was shit. No support from city and less chance of income from additional buildings.

Maybe you should write a novel about how bad and ungrateful people in Ottawa are. We didn't want to publicly fund an arena? Yeah, what a shit deal.

The guy tried to bully his way to a free arena and was laughed out of the room. Not being able to afford to play in the big leagues is a business decision; the problem is that he signed on to it and changed his mind once he realized he couldn't con his partners.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Maybe you should write a novel about how bad and ungrateful people in Ottawa are. We didn't want to publicly fund an arena? Yeah, what a shit deal.

The guy tried to bully his way to a free arena and was laughed out of the room. Not being able to afford to play in the big leagues is a business decision; the problem is that he signed on to it and changed his mind once he realized he couldn't con his partners.

I doubt that is anything near the truth. That is purely your opinion.

Anyway, I have seen how this ends.

Keep fuelling the fire.

 

[harrisb]

That’s perfect.

A definitive and factual response.

I think he had $1.2b in 2017

That’s my basis.

You are right. Know one knows for sure, but my point is, I can’t see him lose so much so quickly.

He hasn’t spent money on the team, according to most.

Do you have a link to the failed investments in pharma? What company was it?

PurGenesis (sp?) was the failed pharma, Trimel is a train wreck too.

his net worth barely waivers when looking at Forbes which brings in to question their ability to collect solid information beyond Melnyk himself. We’ve all stated many times what has led to his demise, divorce would be a major one, failed pharma, failed racing business (he sold the horses at auction not as a lot), money sucking hockey team (his statements). The man has literally run out of things to sell beyond the team. His legal fees alone would be insane.

He’s still a very rich man but I highly doubt a billionaire and in no way does he have the assets or liquidity to properly run an NHL team

 

[JungleBeat]

Melnyk couldn’t keep up with the big players in Lebreton. He’s broke.

 

[harrisb]

Melnyk couldn’t keep up with the big players in Lebreton. He’s broke.

And Ruddy although loaded isn’t in the stratosphere of most NHL owners

 

[Countdown0]

If Melnyk really is worth a billion+ then that would just suggest that he's an even worse owner than if he had lost so much money that he couldn't run the team properly.

Like, if he could no longer afford to compete financially with other teams before he starting shitting on the fans in Ottawa and threatening to move, forcing Dorion to trade out our best players, then we know that he just doesn't have the finances to ice a winner.

On the other hand, if he is worth over a billion, then he most likely would be perfectly capable to paying players with contracts that can compete with what other teams will offer, and instead he's just choosing to run the team at the cap floor.

Five years of unparalleled success? Teams who achieve like that struggle to stay UNDER the cap, because all of the players on the team, core players or not, want a raise when their contract expires because they probably had multiple good years thanks to being on such a strong team.

So I'm curious... was Melnyk a billionaire when he refused to pay Alfie what he was worth to this team, causing the most important player in the history of the franchise to play his final season with another team? If not, then he probably should have sold the team and moved on back then. If he was a billionaire back then, he's a moron for apparently not realizing just how important Alfie was to this team, even then in the final days of his professional hockey career.

Frankly, whether he simply can't afford to ice a competitive team, or he's simply too stupid or incompetent to manage the team and its players properly is a moot point. If either one is the case, he's not fit to own an NHL team, and it seems very likely that at LEAST one of those options is true.

 

[supsens]

If Melnyk really is worth a billion+ then that would just suggest that he's an even worse owner than if he had lost so much money that he couldn't run the team properly.

Like, if he could no longer afford to compete financially with other teams before he starting shitting on the fans in Ottawa and threatening to move, forcing Dorion to trade out our best players, then we know that he just doesn't have the finances to ice a winner.

On the other hand, if he is worth over a billion, then he most likely would be perfectly capable to paying players with contracts that can compete with what other teams will offer, and instead he's just choosing to run the team at the cap floor.

Five years of unparalleled success? Teams who achieve like that struggle to stay UNDER the cap, because all of the players on the team, core players or not, want a raise when their contract expires because they probably had multiple good years thanks to being on such a strong team.

So I'm curious... was Melnyk a billionaire when he refused to pay Alfie what he was worth to this team, causing the most important player in the history of the franchise to play his final season with another team? If not, then he probably should have sold the team and moved on back then. If he was a billionaire back then, he's a moron for apparently not realizing just how important Alfie was to this team, even then in the final days of his professional hockey career.

Frankly, whether he simply can't afford to ice a competitive team, or he's simply too stupid or incompetent to manage the team and its players properly is a moot point. If either one is the case, he's not fit to own an NHL team, and it seems very likely that at LEAST one of those options is true.

I doubt it’s up up any owner to have to afford competitive team. Smaller market less perks less payroll, that’s the way most pro sports work. Enough of the someone owes us millions to provide entertainment. I have no idea where this mindset comes from.

 

[supsens]

If Melnyk really is worth a billion+ then that would just suggest that he's an even worse owner than if he had lost so much money that he couldn't run the team properly.

Like, if he could no longer afford to compete financially with other teams before he starting shitting on the fans in Ottawa and threatening to move, forcing Dorion to trade out our best players, then we know that he just doesn't have the finances to ice a winner.

On the other hand, if he is worth over a billion, then he most likely would be perfectly capable to paying players with contracts that can compete with what other teams will offer, and instead he's just choosing to run the team at the cap floor.

Five years of unparalleled success? Teams who achieve like that struggle to stay UNDER the cap, because all of the players on the team, core players or not, want a raise when their contract expires because they probably had multiple good years thanks to being on such a strong team.

So I'm curious... was Melnyk a billionaire when he refused to pay Alfie what he was worth to this team, causing the most important player in the history of the franchise to play his final season with another team? If not, then he probably should have sold the team and moved on back then. If he was a billionaire back then, he's a moron for apparently not realizing just how important Alfie was to this team, even then in the final days of his professional hockey career.

Frankly, whether he simply can't afford to ice a competitive team, or he's simply too stupid or incompetent to manage the team and its players properly is a moot point. If either one is the case, he's not fit to own an NHL team, and it seems very likely that at LEAST one of those options is true.

He probably isn’t doing the best of the best on money buuut, do you care to explain why you think he would spend all of his money on a team? It’s not really up to him to lose millions a year.
The idea that someone is going to lose millions a year just because they have it seems like a good way to go flat broke

 

[JD1]

We were so lucky to get someone in like Jim Little with the balls to tell him the truth and he got shit canned for it. Things are as hopeless on the business side of the Senators as they've ever been.

One day he'll be gone and his legacy will be nothing but a fading memory of being the most hated figure in Ottawa.

Even if Ottawa ever miraculously won a Chip, it would be portrayed as being in spite of him standing in the way at every opportunity.

Look at what you are saying man. Just stop and think about it for a second

Yes things are hopeless on the business side
Yes we were lucky to get someone with Little's credentials and the balls to tell it like it is

But no, we weren't lucky to get Little. He was just another sorry little instance of misfortune that was bestowed upon us

 

[BatherSeason]

EM knew the deal was shit.

Source?

Seems like he shit all over the deal and his partners, but if he knew the deal was "shit" as you imply, why did he make the deal to begin with?

 

[Tuna99]

Yeah, let’s start this argument up again too.

EM knew the deal was shit. No support from city and less chance of income from additional buildings. As proven by PwC in their report.

PwC reckoned that even under its most optimistic economic scenario, there would be room for both 900 Albert and LeBreton only during the first two years of the LeBreton project. Between 2020 and 2024, PwC expected 900 Albert and LeBreton would each make available about 200 units annually for a total of 400 — against estimated demand of only 170.

Under PwC’s pessimistic economic scenario, not only would there be no takers for 900 Albert or LeBreton, there would be a surplus of 480 residential units annually for all the other downtown projects between 2020 and 2024.

Business decision. Get over it.

Anything else is pure speculation or fake news

Speculation and fake news?! there are other reports that sayOttawa can easily absorb all the condos and more. This report was like the Blog they accused Little with, very little substance but used as an excuse to back out of a deal.

When you’re rich you can get a report to say anything, like the climate isn’t changing or gun ownership doesn’t increase gun violence. But the truth remains despite the reports, the Sens need a new arena and you need friends and partners to build a new arena. The Sens need fans and you need leadership and values for people to invest in you. You can make all the reports you want, but when a majority of a city has given up on you, the reports don’t matter because trust and honest engagement are what sells tickets and gets arenas built, not reports proving your point that someone else is going to be selling condos close by.

 

[JD1]

Source?

Seems like he shit all over the deal and his partners, but if he knew the deal was "shit" as you imply, why did he make the deal to begin with?

did he make the deal? or did Cyril Leeder make the deal on his behalf with Melnyk in sick bay?

 

[Tuna99]

Source?

Seems like he shit all over the deal and his partners, but if he knew the deal was "shit" as you imply, why did he make the deal to begin with?

The city offered him prime real estate to build a downtown arena for his team, they engaged him and made it easy not the other way around, and he couldn’t get a deal made with motivated people who want a downtown arena.

At some point it’s not everyone else, it’s you.

 

[BatherSeason]

did he make the deal? or did Cyril Leeder make the deal on his behalf with Melnyk in sick bay?

Do you actually believe that the egomaniac Eugene Melnyk let someone act on his behalf without him having any input or say into what transpired? Dorion can't make a trade or negotiate a contract without a flight to Barbados or without Melnyk being in town to approve, so I am sure that he just let Leeder run with the mega development deal without him providing any input at any time.

Why do some people continue to blame everyone around Melnyk instead of pointing the finger directly at him?

Little's fault, Leeder's fault, Anselmi's fault, vocal minority's fault, local media's fault, bad fans fault, the mayor's fault, Erik Karlsson's fault.....always someone else, but we can never directly blame Eugene Melnyk.

 

[Dingle]

I will probably have to beat myself to death with a stick after this, but I have to defend Melnyk a tad.

While I believe his behavior is erratic and at times outright weird, he is being overly demonized on here and facts are being somewhat distorted.

1) none of is know his wealth. it is not like he publishes his financials. Based upon his other ventures. he is very wealthy. Based upon how he runs the Sens..it is confusing. ..Confusing does not mean he is not wealthy. Not wanting to spend is much more complex. I belong to the camp that agrees with all the "trade out" they have made. They are sound hockey decisions...If they are being interpreted as financial..I disagree

2) the whole Lebreton..It smells like greed..plain and simple...Lebreton came on the heels of the Edmonton project...read up on it..The government paid for everything. When AJ Jackubec, a sports nut and native Edmontonian, criticized it...I went; wow, what the tax payers must have shelled out??? As Lebreton was second, all the mistakes of Edmonton were learned and governments here, said: NO... Eugene being a smart man, said..okay..change in plan...

all of this has nothing to do with if he has the money or not..it is the rich wanting to grow richer and wanting it paid for by others,,,As old as mankind (Make that peoplekind)

3) the issue with Little. Stop making the man seem like he walked on water. He is one of a few hundred, if not few thousand people in Ontario with charisma and experience in senior management. His antics are unacceptable. We support him, because he cursed a guy we hate.. the old "an enemy of my enemy is my friend"..NO..
what the Sens did afterwards with that release and going to his wife..is wrong and outright stupid..returning things to my opening
statement

Everyone of us has his theory on why things are as bad as they are and have been the last ~ 12 years. We do not listen to each other, we typically shout at each other. And brilliantly, we have found a singular galvanizing point..Eugene. Which is fine, but let's be careful of distortions.

If all goes well, and the pingpong balls fall just right and the kids in Belleville develop..the title of this thread will in 2022 become: Eugene the God.