Canes
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Probably because preseason play really doesn't matter much or preseason Canes MVP Julien Gauthier would have been in the top 6 after his preseason a few years ago.
Confirmed with Link: Ethan Bear Traded to Car For Warren Foegele
- Thread starter FreshSeabass
- Start date
Forsling had 122 career NHL games when he was sent down in 2019. Fleury had 87. That became 132 for Fleury vs 122 for Forsling in 2021 preseason camp when Forsling was sniped by Florida off waivers.
Forsling is only 1 month older than Fleury. I don't think this one falls under "veteran vs prospect".
Edit: In contrast, TVR had played 158 games for Chicago and 79 for Carolina (237 total) by 2018 vs Fleury's 67 games, TVR was 5 years older, and I believe Fleury was still waiver exempt.
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Roboturner913
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- Jul 3, 2012
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bleedgreen
Registered User
I’m not sure why you put all that in there. I’d say it’s more of Rod being Rod. TVR was a vet and he was going to give the vet the nod over Fleury. Fleury over Forsling is being a “vet” with the team vs being an unknown with the team. Just like when Dougie tore it up statistically for Calgary but needed in Rod’s eyes to be babysat on pp2 with Slavin all season to sit for the “Canes vet” Faulk who had never been to Dougie’s level but was the incumbent despite lesser play than Dougie all season.
Im saying our coach has a preference for guys he knows from doing time in our system. If they both had equal time in the system but one was more vet than the other hed presumably lean towards the vet. At least early in his coaching career. Sitting Forsling for Fleury despite the opinion of a poster that Forsling had played better in that camp has a precedent.
My point was that if anything, Forsling had more experience than Fleury. Fleury had just been sent down the previous season for a more experienced option in TVR.
The major change was that Fleury lost his waiver exemption and they weren’t willing to risk him. Forsling was part of the return in the de Haan deal but the primary return was the cap space.
I don’t think this was Rod going with an internal veteran; this was not being willing to lose Fleury on waivers compared to a lower D they just acquired. And I think not exposing Fleury to waivers was front office based as well as coach based.
The major change was that Fleury lost his waiver exemption and they weren’t willing to risk him. Forsling was part of the return in the de Haan deal but the primary return was the cap space.
I don’t think this was Rod going with an internal veteran; this was not being willing to lose Fleury on waivers compared to a lower D they just acquired. And I think not exposing Fleury to waivers was front office based as well as coach based.
He sounds like a keeper. Hope he’s happy in Raleigh.
1) From what I've heard, Bear seems to be a pretty good dude. Absolutely love to see it.
2) He has some serious flow. We're going to need that since Brock left.
CandyCanes
Caniac turned Jerkiac
- Jan 8, 2015
- 7,202
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Love it. Got a feeling he’s going to quickly become a fan favorite in Raleigh. This is the type of stuff that makes me proud to be a Canes fan, when players go out of their way to do acts of kindness.
LakeLivin
Armchair Quarterback
superdeluxe
NAFO
You guys will love this guy, he was an absolute favorite to many up here in Seattle during his Junior days! He has a huge and supportive family. They used to drive 20+ hours from their home in Canada to come watch games in Seattle..there would be 10-15 of them at most of his games.
bleedgreen
Registered User
Tripp is going to geek out over Bear and his family. We need some positive focal points this year, I’m guessing Bear is going to get a lot of attention.
spockBokk
Registered User
- Sep 8, 2013
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Some nice things said about Bear here:
Lowetide: Will the Ethan Bear trade be the latest shortsighted move that haunts the Oilers?
Lowetide: Will the Ethan Bear trade be the latest shortsighted move that haunts the Oilers?
sabremike
Friend To All Giraffes And Lindy Ruff
My question is if he goes out camping in the woods does he, you know....?
Cardiac Jerks
Asinine & immoral
What choice does anyone have in that scenario? It’s that or hold it in the whole time.
- Feb 23, 2014
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It is a constant grievance with dog owners in my whereabouts that some people don't have to go any further that running at the local sawdust track to feel excused enough to excuse themselves in the bush, and then when the said owners take their dogs for a walk at the track they (the dogs) will very literally go soil themselves in the human leavings.
GIN ANTONIC
Registered User
So I just read through like 11 pages on the Oilers forum about Ethan Bear's body fat % and what he eats for lunch. God, I hate my 'fellow' Canadian hockey fans.
Anyway, this has probably already been discussed here but from what I can gather on Bear he's a high IQ defender with good instincts, makes the smart play/pass and has some offensive ability as well.
Cannot seem to get a good read on whether or not he can actually defend or not but the cons on him are he's below average speed and not physical. Because he's a bit undersized he can get roughed up in the D zone somewhat.
I think D pairings are still a guess at this point but I don't see a fit with him and Slavin... maybe him and Skjei though. I think to start the year I'd be most comfortable with this.
Slavin - Pesce
Skjei - Bear
Cole - TDA
But who knows really.
Anyway, this has probably already been discussed here but from what I can gather on Bear he's a high IQ defender with good instincts, makes the smart play/pass and has some offensive ability as well.
Cannot seem to get a good read on whether or not he can actually defend or not but the cons on him are he's below average speed and not physical. Because he's a bit undersized he can get roughed up in the D zone somewhat.
I think D pairings are still a guess at this point but I don't see a fit with him and Slavin... maybe him and Skjei though. I think to start the year I'd be most comfortable with this.
Slavin - Pesce
Skjei - Bear
Cole - TDA
But who knows really.
Boom Boom Apathy
I am the Professor. Deal with it!
- Sep 6, 2006
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I’ve had many interactions with @ChaoticOrange over the years, sometimes agreeing, sometimes disagreeing (particularly on trade values) but I always thought he had a fair assessment of Oilers players. Would be good to hear his assessment of Bear here.
Svechhammer
THIS is hockey?
- Jun 8, 2017
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I really don't want Slavin and Pesce to be a pair. They never really clicked in the past, and I worry that makes the 2nd line such a downgrade from what we had that its a net negative.
At the same time, no idea who else could play with Slavin, as I sure as heck don't want it to be TDA.
bleedgreen
Registered User
Did you just say Slavin and Pesce didn’t click in the past? They were the best pair I’ve ever seen us have?
Boom Boom Apathy
I am the Professor. Deal with it!
- Sep 6, 2006
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Yeah, they were viewed by many as the premier shutdown pairing in the league when they were together. Other coaches frequently commented on them.
spockBokk
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I don’t think you mess with Skjei-Pesce, for continuity’s sake. However, I believe Skjei has some familiarity playing with TDA so that could be a thing. I imagine TDA ends up with Slavin eventually, but could easily see he and Bear changing partners with Cole and Slavin multiple times in season, if not in games, based on situations.
I think it's more likely that Bear winds up somewhere between his rookie season and last year. He clearly has the talent and the drive to be a solid defenseman in this league and playing with a really solid core of D-men like you guys have will do wonders for him. Gut says this trade winds up looking lopsided in favor of Carolina in a few years, but I'm excited for Foegele as well, as he's exactly what our middle six needed. I think Bears back to back playoff performances sealed his fate. While he had some heavy struggles, most of the team did so it's hard to say it's all on him.
And yes, our board can be an absolute effin cesspool even at the best of times. Outside of a handful of really good posters I'd say it's the last place you should go for any real unbiased insight into Oilers players. Too much crap to wade through to find anything of value.
Boom Boom Apathy
I am the Professor. Deal with it!
- Sep 6, 2006
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You guys should like Foegele. He's big, fast and works hard. Regardless of the fact that his hands aren't always there, he's been one of the best ES goal scorers in Carolina the past few years. Depending who he plays with, 20 goals is not out of the question.
ChaoticOrange
Registered User
You're too kind. I try to be reasonable.
Bear looked like an emerging 2/3 defenceman for the Oilers in 19/20. Made smart, heads up plays. The master of the ten foot pass. Very good at getting himself out of trouble, excellent hockey IQ. Didn't get much for offensive opportunities, but has it in him - won WHL defenceman of the year with Seattle.
This last year he was used more as a 4/5, which many of us disagreed with. He got a puck in the head sitting on the bench which resulted in a concussion and him missing ten or so games, and when he came back he had a bit of trouble getting up to speed - five games or so. Unfortunately, that was enough (combined with his relatively small size, non-physical game, and to be frank, not being white put him behind the 8-ball from the beginning for a vocal, stupid minority) for many fans and some media members to turn on him. His underlying numbers were excellent, he continued to do a huge number of little things well, but it was never enough for some and because Barrie is the secondary assist master of the NHL and Larsson was having a good year, he frequently got relegated to the third pairing and lost the coaching staff's trust in the playoffs.
The truth of the matter is nobody for sure knows what Bear is right now, but given his first two full seasons in the NHL, it's probably fairest to say that he's somewhere between a #3 defenceman to a #5 defenceman. On your team he could play on any pairing and do really well. We're excited to see what Foegele can bring, but many - myself included - were not happy to see that deal go down and think that we got the worst of it.
GIN ANTONIC
Registered User
Thanks for the in depth reply and a good amount of context as well. Bear's strong attributes are really enticing but I think from what I'm understanding his physical shortcomings of size and speed are going to limit his ability somewhat. I think if he had more tools then I could see him being a good pair with Slavin but he just doesn't sound like a player that can probably handle 20+ minutes a night against tough competition. I do think if he can settle in with Skjei and form a Pinky and the Brain type understanding it could be a strong pairing.
So I'll post it again. Until proven otherwise this seems like the best realistic compromise on the D pairings.
Slavin - Pesce
Skjei - Bear
Cole - TDA
Let TDA feast on weak competition in limited but not necessarily miniscule minutes. He's excellent at pushing offense at 5 on 5 and have him work the powerplay. Have Cole be his babysitter and keep things the way they were on the PK.
