Erik Karlsson

[FLYguy3911]

MacDonald-Doughty pairing. Oh the possibilities.

 

[jghockey]

I’d trade all that for Doughty not EK65 he’s a dangerous player don’t get me wrong, I just don’t trust that ankle if his and maybe IMm watching a different Karlsson but hos defense isn’t Norris caliber like Doughty

The Kings just signed Doughty to an eight year extension. They're not trading him any time soon.

 

[Chinatown88]

MacDonald-Doughty pairing. Oh the possibilities.

I can only imagine how much Doughty would have to do to carry Farmer.

 

[FLYguy3911]

I can only imagine how much Doughty would have to do to carry Farmer.

But just so much reliability.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

New game how would Hak screw up d pairings to make the worst product possible with our current roster and Doughty.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

New game how would Hak screw up d pairings to make the worst product possible with our current roster and Doughty.

Hagg - Amac
Ginning - Folin
Doughty - TJ Brennan

 

[Magua]

Hagg - Amac
Ginning - Folin
Doughty - TJ Brennan

 

[TheKingPin]

Jesus Christ, people are acting as if Karlsson has one foot in a grave. When was the last time generational dman fell off the cliff by the age of 36, which is when his contract would end?

By signing EK you push ghosts role down on the PP, ES and OT. It’s not simply gaining a 60+ pt dman. It may be losing one as well. The money that EK I’m sure wants will not be worth his pts anyway. It could be worth everything, but I doubt it. As far as generational, he is not. I personally would prefer Hedman over him. If we didn’t have Ghost I’d be all for it. Having ghost plus the money and potential assists it would take to have him means I’m out.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

By signing EK you push ghosts role down on the PP, ES and OT. It’s not simply gaining a 60+ pt dman. It may be losing one as well. The money that EK I’m sure wants will not be worth his pts anyway. It could be worth everything, but I doubt it. As far as generational, he is not. I personally would prefer Hedman over him. If we didn’t have Ghost I’d be all for it. Having ghost plus the money and potential assists it would take to have him means I’m out.

This response and the responses about cap space are mind boggling. You don't want to bring in a better player because then Ghost won't get as much time? That is nuts. Plain and simple. Ghost may not be a 60 point player if Carl's Jr. is here, but he will still have an impact. I'd love to have the luxury of playing Ghost less and possibly in easier minutes or more favorable match ups.

As for the cap space concerns...it is going to be spent one way or another. What is the point of having cap space if you don't want to use it? I know that everyone here is afraid that we'll have to trade Scottie Upshall again, but the overreactions to cap concerns are overblown (and were back then as well). Everyone wants to have cap space so that we can sign our young guys when they become superstars, but waiting around for that to happen is a fool's errand. At some point, there will be a large contract that everyone complains about for a UFA...why not get arguably the league's best defenseman?

This is all of course predicated on Carl's Jr. actually wanting to come here or being available via trade. And of course, this is not an "OMG WE HAVE TO GET HIM OR WE ARE DOOMED" scenario, but if he's available I'm definitely interested.

 

[deadhead]

Ghost is a better PP scorer than Karlsson, hands down, it's not even close. So you get little value there.
Karlsson is a top scoring defenseman, and among the top in the league, but he's not Pronger, not sure he's Mark Howe.
And that ankle isn't a minor concern -- that was a really serious injury which will likely shorten his career.

I'm wary of big name free agents because you're paying top dollar for a player whose career trajectory can only go in one direction, in effect you're betting that the player will continue to play at the same level for another six years or so (and good enough to limp through the last two years as overpaid depth).

Since most players peak between 22-29, you're paying peak year money for declining production.
By 2020-21, the second year of his new deal, at age 30, he could be the 3rd best defenseman (and maybe the 4th) on this team, behind Provorov (24), Ghost (27) and maybe Myers (24).

As far as spending cap money, Flyers are in the position of having a flood of young talent they can lock up to long-term RFA extensions and build a deep team throughout the decade of the 2020s. I'd rather have 2 young rising talents in their 20s locked up to affordable long-term deals than a declining Karlsson in his 30s from 2020-2021 through 2026-27.

 

[baudib1]

Nashville has proven that bunching high-scoring defensemen together doesn't cut down on their production. Stop living in the dark ages.

 

[Rebels57]

This response and the responses about cap space are mind boggling. You don't want to bring in a better player because then Ghost won't get as much time? That is nuts. Plain and simple. Ghost may not be a 60 point player if Carl's Jr. is here, but he will still have an impact. I'd love to have the luxury of playing Ghost less and possibly in easier minutes or more favorable match ups.

As for the cap space concerns...it is going to be spent one way or another. What is the point of having cap space if you don't want to use it? I know that everyone here is afraid that we'll have to trade Scottie Upshall again, but the overreactions to cap concerns are overblown (and were back then as well). Everyone wants to have cap space so that we can sign our young guys when they become superstars, but waiting around for that to happen is a fool's errand. At some point, there will be a large contract that everyone complains about for a UFA...why not get arguably the league's best defenseman?

This is all of course predicated on Carl's Jr. actually wanting to come here or being available via trade. And of course, this is not an "OMG WE HAVE TO GET HIM OR WE ARE DOOMED" scenario, but if he's available I'm definitely interested.

 

[bear3330]

In my opinion, the decision go after EK is heavily weighed by your opinion of our future D. If you think that one of our guys is EK potential (2 time Norris winner and game changing ability) then, by all means, don't go after him.

Personally, I have a hard time seeing any of our guys hitting that ceiling. It's possible but not likely.

As for the cap hit, if you think one of our guys has EK potential then we're probably going to be spending the money either way.

If we landed him then we'd easily have a top-3 D corps in the league.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

View attachment 136885

It already has. I've already ordered a jersey. Soon enough we'll all be wearing our Carl's Jr. jerseys and winning Cups. Scottie Upshall be damned!

 

[deadhead]

In my opinion, the decision go after EK is heavily weighed by your opinion of our future D. If you think that one of our guys is EK potential (2 time Norris winner and game changing ability) then, by all means, don't go after him.

Personally, I have a hard time seeing any of our guys hitting that ceiling. It's possible but not likely.

As for the cap hit, if you think one of our guys has EK potential then we're probably going to be spending the money either way.

If we landed him then we'd easily have a top-3 D corps in the league.

Provorov won't score quite like EK, but he'll be a better all around defenseman in a couple years.
Ghost isn't that far behind, but I don't think he'll ever get to EK's level 5x5, but he's better on the PP.

Myers has the potential to be better than EK, he has a unique combination of size and skill, 6'5 230 who can skate and shoot, these guys come along about once a decade. Now will he stay healthy and reach his ceiling? Only time will tell.

 

[Magua]

Provorov won't score quite like EK, but he'll be a better all around defenseman in a couple years.

Myers has the potential to be better than EK

I’d say Mark Friedman has the potential to be better than EK too.

 

[TheKingPin]

This response and the responses about cap space are mind boggling. You don't want to bring in a better player because then Ghost won't get as much time? That is nuts. Plain and simple. Ghost may not be a 60 point player if Carl's Jr. is here, but he will still have an impact. I'd love to have the luxury of playing Ghost less and possibly in easier minutes or more favorable match ups.

As for the cap space concerns...it is going to be spent one way or another. What is the point of having cap space if you don't want to use it? I know that everyone here is afraid that we'll have to trade Scottie Upshall again, but the overreactions to cap concerns are overblown (and were back then as well). Everyone wants to have cap space so that we can sign our young guys when they become superstars, but waiting around for that to happen is a fool's errand. At some point, there will be a large contract that everyone complains about for a UFA...why not get arguably the league's best defenseman?

This is all of course predicated on Carl's Jr. actually wanting to come here or being available via trade. And of course, this is not an "OMG WE HAVE TO GET HIM OR WE ARE DOOMED" scenario, but if he's available I'm definitely interested.

In my OP I said it was a tough choice. Which it is. Anytime you are thinking about spending what could be close to the top contract in the league you should probably think on it. Ghost will no longer get top pair minutes. Will be PP2, Provy dropped completely is possible as well. OT may be lead by EK. Ghosts points are cheaper than EK. If we didn’t have Ghost I’d be all for it and it’s an easy call. Now, I’d prob still do it but I’d be more hoping a few things workout rather than being all in if we didn’t have Ghost.

Just bc you have money doesn’t mean you spend it. I’m sure there are exactly 0% of wealthy people out that would go with that. Look at teams like the hawks. You have to dismantle your team to keep it afloat. They won cups so it’s worth it, but you don’t HAVE to have things go that way. Trade or let go players that are priced out and keep your picks to restock and let play with your stars. Like the pens. We will have enough talent to win a cup imo. Someone won’t workout as expected and there will be holes that you ID after a year or two of coming short. Then you trade or sign a guy like so many teams have done in Kessel, Hossa, Carter, Richards. Guys like Tavares and EK never become available, so you do it bc they are that good and you figure out the rest later, but it’s not so simple in my opinion.

Nashville of course has a great D but they split the top two pairs up and shelter the bottom pair. This would allow more pts for everyone. So far, that’s not good enough to win though. Even without EK we will have a very good bottom pair. A lot cheaper too.

If i ignore the money then that D looks amazing.

 

[deadhead]

Hah, hah.

Myers has a chance to be special, not sure what the odds are he'll actually get there, but undersized mobile D-men like EK have limitations that can't be overcome, especially in the playoffs. Whereas someone like Myers, if he puts it all together, can dominate both ends of the ice. There's just something special about a monster D-man who can lay the lumber, make a forward cough up the puck, then take the puck end to end and finish.

Speedboats are cute, but modern battleships are more impressive.

 

[FlyTimmo]

Hah, hah.

Myers has a chance to be special, not sure what the odds are he'll actually get there, but undersized mobile D-men like EK have limitations that can't be overcome, especially in the playoffs. Whereas someone like Myers, if he puts it all together, can dominate both ends of the ice. There's just something special about a monster D-man who can lay the lumber, make a forward cough up the puck, then take the puck end to end and finish.

Speedboats are cute, but modern battleships are more impressive.

This is honestly pretty ridiculous.

In what world do you live in where you think Karlsson has playoff limitations. Karlsson's only playoff limitation is his team kicking and screaming behind him. He carried one of the weakest conference final teams in recent memory to game 7 2OT against the eventual champs. He plays huge minutes, and moves the puck like no other defenseman in the league. He is the definition of special.

Even if Myers reaches his potential, I'd be surprised if he was even half as good as Karlsson is/was.

 

[baudib1]

It's hilarious that people who post every day on a hockey board need to learn how good Erik Karlsson is.

Conservatively, he's a top 10 talent all time at the position. Realistically, more like top 3.

 

[FlyTimmo]

It's hilarious that people who post every day on a hockey board need to learn how good Erik Karlsson is.

Conservatively, he's a top 10 talent all time at the position. Realistically, more like top 3.

Eh... top-3 is a bit much.

 

[Tripod]

No to trade. Yes to sign. You could set up the 2 PP's on opposite walls.

Keep the top unit as is...have Patrick as the net guy on the top unit replacing Simmonds.

Then for the 2nd unit, have:

Frost as the passer on the wall
TK as the shooter in the slot
Myers as shooter on the opposite wall(like Jake's spot in reverse)
EK as the point man
JVR as the net guy

 

[deadhead]

Anderson carried that team to game 7. Karlsson had a good series, but that wasn't a team devoid of talent, Hoffman, Turris, Stone, Brassard, but Anderson's .922 S% kept them in every game. Two years before, Anderson and Hammond single handly carried that team into the playoffs.

Last year, Anderson finally showed his age with a .898% and Ottawa totally tanked.

Goalies and playoffs:
2018: Holtby .922, MAF .927, Hellebuyck .924, Vasilevskiy .918
2017: MAF/Murray .929, Rinne .930, Gibson .924, Anderson .922
2016: Murray .923, Jones .923, Elliott .921, Bishop/Vasilevskiy .933
2015: Crawford .924, Bishop .921, Lundqvist .928, Andersen .913
2014: Quick .911, Lundqvist .927, Price .919, Crawford .912
2013: Crawford .932, Rask .940, Quick .934, Vokoun .933

You can get to the Conference Finals with an average goal tender, but the odds are stacked against you.

I think EK is very good, but not generational.

Last five years EK, Hedman and Burns are neck to neck, and Klingberg and Hamilton just behind. And Doughty may be the best all around defenseman.
Krug, Burns and Keith are just behind him as playoff performers.
That is, EK certainly deserves consideration as the best D-man in the league, but the gap between him and the others in the top 5 isn't large.

I don't know how good Myers will end up, but the number of guys that size with legitimate skills is very, very small.
Burns, Weber and ???

 

[deadhead]

Let's see Orr, Bourque, Lindstrom, Harvey, Robinson, Coffey, Chelios, nope, definitely not top 3.

 

[BernieParent]

Those don't look like panthers.