Player Discussion Eric Staal Part II

[Gardner McKay]

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[DelZottoHitTheNetJK]

Really, really not a fan of this trade.

Not because of what we gave up. Not because I don't like E. Staal. But because it doesn't fill a need. However, if we play him at C and on the PK (can he even PK?) and he wins some draws and helps the PK it's not as bad. If they stick him on the wing and don't use him on the PK then this management is insane in giving up that package for him.


Would have rather gotten Vrbata (albeit not for the same package). This freaking lineup has TWO right handed shots in it. TWO. There's no balance to the forward group and it's especially obvious on the PP. Our powerplay doesn't suck because of a coaching issue.. it sucks because of a personnel issue. Teams know they can load up on the right side to negate the left handed one-timer. We have NO threats on the left side. Stepan is not a legitimate threat.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Really, really not a fan of this trade.

Not because of what we gave up. Not because I don't like E. Staal. But because it doesn't fill a need. However, if we play him at C and on the PK (can he even PK?) and he wins some draws and helps the PK it's not as bad. If they stick him on the wing and don't use him on the PK then this management is insane in giving up that package for him.


Would have rather gotten Vrbata (albeit not for the same package). This freaking lineup has TWO right handed shots in it. TWO. There's no balance to the forward group and it's especially obvious on the PP. Our powerplay doesn't suck because of a coaching issue.. it sucks because of a personnel issue. Teams know they can load up on the right side to negate the left handed one-timer. We have NO threats on the left side. Stepan is not a legitimate threat.

This tells me you haven't watched much of Vrbata. Not too good this year.

 

[Pizza]

Lol, @ some of the worry here. When did Eric Staal become a lousy hockey player?

I am not a fan of trading picks and prospects, but all things considered this trade was one the Rangers needed to make.

Very acceptable risk and downside for the Rangers....with a huge upside very possible.

If the Rangers can have Staal contributing to a team that continues the current upswing headed into the playoffs.....and they get a healthy Rick Nash back....even 2015 playoff Rick Nash....that's team other teams would want to avoid I'm thinking.

 

[Jackpot]

Staal is 31, a consummate professional, a hockey player with experience both at the NHL level and World level. He's been a contributing factor at all level's. If you want to base your feelings about Staal on his numbers while on a struggling Hurricanes team, I think you're doing yourself a great injustice.

 

[DelZottoHitTheNetJK]

This tells me you haven't watched much of Vrbata. Not too good this year.

Yes, because the guy we acquired has been lighting up the league this year


If we're going to acquire an under-performing player I would've rather gotten someone that at least fills a need. Once Nash returns Staal is a redundant piece on this team. How many left-handed power forwards with a mediocre shot do we need? At least with Vrbata there's a chance to re-sign him and mitigate the loss of the picks with future production. I don't see any possible way we can re-sign Staal without dismantling other pieces of this team.

To me, if you're bringing him in to put him on the wing the trade makes absolutely no sense. If you're bringing him in as a C, where does he slot in? Which one of Stepan/Brassard are you moving to put Staal in the top 6 as a C?


I have no problem acquiring rentals. In fact I think it's the right move given the window we're in right now. We've proven we can mitigate the loss of picks with UFA's out of the NCAA (Talbot, Hayes, etc) and get value outside of the draft. But the fit has to be right. It feels to me like they went out and got a big name just for the sake of making a splash. I don't see the fit

 

[SA16]

Oh no back to the redundant argument. Because having more 50+ point players is a bad thing.

 

[Pizza]

Another thing that I personally think gets over looked often here is that the Rangers have like eight players 26 or under and six @ 24 and under. That's quality players mind you.

Not worried about these guys.

 

[aufheben]

I won't lie, I think there is a solid chance Saarela will be in the NHL. Especially Carolina having Aho in the system (who is Saarela's buddy and WJC teammate), they're both going to be scary good for the Hurricanes. They also acquired Valentin Zykov, who as well, will be a very good contributor in a year or two. Who knows who they'll select with those pick, either.

In the short term, NYR wins the deal (if they win the cup). In the long term, Carolina takes the cake.

I don't necessarily agree with this. What if Staal puts up like 25 points in the playoffs or something?

 

[Beacon]

Really, really not a fan of this trade.

Not because of what we gave up. Not because I don't like E. Staal. But because it doesn't fill a need. .

Our playoff needs were size and depth. That was addressed. The other needs were regular season needs.

 

[Captain Monglobster]

Big center who you can trust out there late in the game in all situations. A winner. This is a young team and a big veteran with champion credentials is exactly what they lack. Would have liked Ladd but then say good bye to more than Saarela and two late 2nds.

 

[True Blue]

I am not a fan of trading picks and prospects, but all things considered this trade was one the Rangers needed to make.

Needed? Am of two thoughts about that.

Trending the wrong way is something that happens with athletes. Bouncing back is also something that happens. Let's hope it is the latter. I'd say there is a very good chance that happens.

I am certainly hoping for the same thing as you, but am not negative on the probabilities. Maybe because we have seen so many of these trades and then the exact opposite of what you are stating happened.

If the Rangers can have Staal contributing to a team that continues the current upswing headed into the playoffs.....and they get a healthy Rick Nash back....even 2015 playoff Rick Nash....that's team other teams would want to avoid I'm thinking.

A Staal who has turned the clock back, which takes the pressure off of Nash....that is the best scenario. Not sure how much other teams are fearing the Rangers right now. Unless of course, Henke is the best player on the ice.

 

[DelZottoHitTheNetJK]

Our playoff needs were size and depth. That was addressed. The other needs were regular season needs.

According to who, exactly?


-Powerplay
-PK
-Faceoffs
-Improving the quality of the bottom 6


There's no guarantee Staal fixes the PP. I don't think he's the piece that fixes it.. another left handed shooter that has an average shot. We have plenty of those already.

I have no idea whether or not Staal can PK. Can't comment on that.

Very reluctant to believe that AV will use Staal as a C and move one of Stepan/Brassard to the wing. So faceoffs are not addressed.

Staal actually worsens the quality of the bottom 6. Because acquiring him without giving up a roster player means that AV now kicks out Hrivik to create a spot for Staal, while keeping in Tanner Glass. I'd love to be wrong on this one but we all know it's happening. Hrivik is easily NHL ready and has been very impressive in his short stint. He reminds me of a younger version of Dominic Moore.. hangs on to the puck, can skate, and can make smart plays with the puck. But Glass is better


Either you're saying the above needs aren't "playoff" needs, or you don't feel they're needs at all for this team.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Yes, because the guy we acquired has been lighting up the league this year


If we're going to acquire an under-performing player I would've rather gotten someone that at least fills a need. Once Nash returns Staal is a redundant piece on this team. How many left-handed power forwards with a mediocre shot do we need? At least with Vrbata there's a chance to re-sign him and mitigate the loss of the picks with future production. I don't see any possible way we can re-sign Staal without dismantling other pieces of this team.

To me, if you're bringing him in to put him on the wing the trade makes absolutely no sense. If you're bringing him in as a C, where does he slot in? Which one of Stepan/Brassard are you moving to put Staal in the top 6 as a C?


I have no problem acquiring rentals. In fact I think it's the right move given the window we're in right now. We've proven we can mitigate the loss of picks with UFA's out of the NCAA (Talbot, Hayes, etc) and get value outside of the draft. But the fit has to be right. It feels to me like they went out and got a big name just for the sake of making a splash. I don't see the fit

Just going to leave this here. Staal has 33 points and is a -3. Vrbata has 24 and is a -32.

Vrbatas best days are behind him. Eric's aren't.

 

[RangerBoy]

 

[SA16]

According to who, exactly?


-Powerplay
-PK
-Faceoffs
-Improving the quality of the bottom 6


There's no guarantee Staal fixes the PP. I don't think he's the piece that fixes it.. another left handed shooter that has an average shot. We have plenty of those already.

I have no idea whether or not Staal can PK. Can't comment on that.

Very reluctant to believe that AV will use Staal as a C and move one of Stepan/Brassard to the wing. So faceoffs are not addressed.

Staal actually worsens the quality of the bottom 6. Because acquiring him without giving up a roster player means that AV now kicks out Hrivik to create a spot for Staal, while keeping in Tanner Glass. I'd love to be wrong on this one but we all know it's happening. Hrivik is easily NHL ready and has been very impressive in his short stint. He reminds me of a younger version of Dominic Moore.. hangs on to the puck, can skate, and can make smart plays with the puck. But Glass is better


Either you're saying the above needs aren't "playoff" needs, or you don't feel they're needs at all for this team.

Replacing Hrivik with Staal...makes the team worse. Oooooooooook.

 

[BlueshirtBlitz]

Just going to leave this here. Staal has 33 points and is a -3. Vrbata has 24 and is a -32.

Vrbatas best days are behind him. Eric's aren't.

Eric's best days are very much probably behind him. That doesn't mean he can't come in motivated, start scoring more and maintain good possession metrics.

If E. Staal and Nash can score closer to their career averages into the playoffs, the Rangers offense is top tier.

 

[Beacon]

According to who, exactly?


-Powerplay
-PK
-Faceoffs
-Improving the quality of the bottom 6


There's no guarantee Staal fixes the PP. I don't think he's the piece that fixes it.. another left handed shooter that has an average shot. We have plenty of those already.

I have no idea whether or not Staal can PK. Can't comment on that.

Very reluctant to believe that AV will use Staal as a C and move one of Stepan/Brassard to the wing. So faceoffs are not addressed.

Staal actually worsens the quality of the bottom 6. Because acquiring him without giving up a roster player means that AV now kicks out Hrivik to create a spot for Staal, while keeping in Tanner Glass. I'd love to be wrong on this one but we all know it's happening. Hrivik is easily NHL ready and has been very impressive in his short stint. He reminds me of a younger version of Dominic Moore.. hangs on to the puck, can skate, and can make smart plays with the puck. But Glass is better


Either you're saying the above needs aren't "playoff" needs, or you don't feel they're needs at all for this team.

He unquestionably makes depth better, whether he comes in for Glass or Hrivik, and in fact both will sit as Eric and Nash start to play.

He helps with faceoffs.

He adds scoring because presumably he will outscore Hrivik or Glass.

He will probably help with the power play too, particularly when injuries hit and we don't have to play Fast or Lindberg on the PP.

 

[Off Sides]

From my "they win the cup or bust" point of view

Staal plays well but no cup, they re-sign him? To how much for how long, and he probably declines during that deal.

and doesn't that make Stepan at 6.5M a too expensive to keep proposition? .. Since AV ultimately sees Eric as a center. Or they keep Stepan and let Staal walk once again losing out on futures for someone they did not keep?

Staal plays poorly and no cup, self explanatory

I guess the way I see it, the only way this works out ultimately is if they win the cup and I just am not a huge fan of trades that work out that way.

I understand it from their point of view, but from mine, it has the chances of producing only one really happy outcome.

 

[bmoak]

It doesn't matter how well Staal plays, since the Rangers aren't going anywhere with their defense core. Throw away yet more draft picks and prospects for a second round exit (if they even make it that far). Caps are just going to run roughshod over Old Man River, Marky Marc, and Pirate Cap'n Dan.

 

[Leetch66]

Well....everybody should be fairly happy now....other than the Trade Yandle Camp . Anyways....who knows what Gorton has up his sleeve for Summer moves . Maybe we find a way to move some bodies/contracts out and resign Yandle and Staal on a cheapie deal.

Maybe he finds a way to move one of the three dreaded deals we have or a Stepan . Lot of things can happen between now and next October.....right now I am just going to sit and enjoy the run to the playoffs . We added without losing a reg player and just relinquished minor stuff for a major piece....enjoy it everybody !

 

[Gardner McKay]

Eric's best days are very much probably behind him. That doesn't mean he can't come in motivated, start scoring more and maintain good possession metrics.

If E. Staal and Nash can score closer to their career averages into the playoffs, the Rangers offense is top tier.

See, that is the thing. Maybe his PPG seasons are behind him but I think a change of scenery will give him the motivation he has been lacking and will really ramp up the offensive production to show what he is still capable of.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

I don't like the trade, but there is absolutely no way this doesn't make the Rangers a good bit better for the next 20+ games. That much is a certainty.

 

[DelZottoHitTheNetJK]

Replacing Hrivik with Staal...makes the team worse. Oooooooooook.

It makes the bottom 6 worse. By giving Glass more minutes instead of Hrivik.

The bottom 6 has been the problem this year. The PK has been the problem this year. And we just made it worse.

 

[Chaels Arms]

Still wish this team did more to improve the PK and defense. The east is likely going through Washington this season and I don't think we have the tools to handle their offense barring another Henrik Lundqvist miracle. I'm pretty sure the front office doesn't even see our defense as a problem though so that's just a lost cause.