Blue Jays Discussion: Edwin, Donaldson, Saunders, Sanchez, Estrada to the ASG

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zeke

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Mar 14, 2005
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I think there's a huge tendency by scouting publications to over-hype Yankee prospects (if scouting projections came to fruition, Phil Hughes should have about 5 CY awards by now, Joba Chamberlain should be a perennial all-star and Jesus Montero should have made Buster Posey look like Josh Thole), but I haven't personally observed the same pattern with Bosox prospects.

The yanks prospects definitely used to get overhyped, but that pendulum has swung almost in the complete opposite direction now.

It's the red sox turn now.

Recent top-100 prospects: Blake Swihart, Rusney Castillo, Henry Owens, Eduardo Rodriguez, Brian Johnson, Garin Cecchini, Allen Webster, Trey Ball, Matt Barnes, Will Middlebrooks, Jose Iglesias, Anthony Ranaudo, Drake Britton, Ryan Westmoreland, Casey Kelly, Lars Anderson, Michael Bowden.

And most of those guys were top-50. And that's just from the last 5-6 years or so.

And the annoying thing is that virtually none of these guys actually had the performance to back up these kind of rankings, and most of them didn't even have impressive raw tools to justify an upside projection.
 

zeke

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Fair. I don't have a problem with his ranking though, or any of the Red Sox guys right now.

fair enough. I even Benintendi and Moncada are a bit high - especially given Moncada's lack of a defensive position now - and while his hitting is impressive it's far from unprecedented.

But Devers and Espinoza stick out to me as especially high - 18yr olds usually don't rank that high unless they are wowing.

I mean, when Bogaerts was ranked as a super elite prospect he was demolishing AAA as a 20yr old SS. THAT is impressive performance deserving of that kind of rank. None of the current guys are really all that close to that class of performance yet, imo.
 

Eyedea

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Devers had a cold start but he's had a 160 wRC+ since the start of June. Espinoza started off hot but had a rough stretch in there. Lot of list makers got excited after Espinoza's showing last year where his fastball velocity bounced up to 80 grade territory.

Moncada is absolutely the top prospect in baseball IMO. Only guy that rivals him right now is Bregman.
 

zeke

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Bogaerts is a good example, from back before the system hype got imo out of control.

He was a solid well above average performer (123wrc+) as an 18yr old in A ball. As an SS no less. This got him into the back half of most of the top 100 lists.

But it wasn't until he demolished A+ (144wrc+) and AA (159wrc+) at 19 that he rocketed up into top-20 territory.
 

Kurtz

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Jul 17, 2005
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The yanks prospects definitely used to get overhyped, but that pendulum has swung almost in the complete opposite direction now.

It's the red sox turn now.

Recent top-100 prospects: Blake Swihart, Rusney Castillo, Henry Owens, Eduardo Rodriguez, Brian Johnson, Garin Cecchini, Allen Webster, Trey Ball, Matt Barnes, Will Middlebrooks, Jose Iglesias, Anthony Ranaudo, Drake Britton, Ryan Westmoreland, Casey Kelly, Lars Anderson, Michael Bowden.

And most of those guys were top-50. And that's just from the last 5-6 years or so.

And the annoying thing is that virtually none of these guys actually had the performance to back up these kind of rankings, and most of them didn't even have impressive raw tools to justify an upside projection.

Damn, point taken. None of those guys (If memory serves) broke into the top 10, let alone the top 5 mlb prospects like Hughes, Montero and Chamberlain did, but still that's an extensive list of highly touted busts that likely would have given Bosox a nice little boost in their deals.
 

zeke

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And it's not even an anti-boston thing for me I swear. I've just noticed that their prospects are consistently getting rated than similarly performing prospects from other orgs.

It used to be the jays - back when JP was a sabermetrics darling, our guys used to get overrated too.

Even after JP was gone that lingered - the final straw for me came with our overrated class of drabek/wallace/et al. - guys who they promised had big upside but whose actual performance never justified the high ranks they got. That's when I gave up on trusting the rankings.
 

Eyedea

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Ed Rod and Swihart deserved their rankings, Owens was basically mimicking Sanchez for awhile there until Sanchez hit the majors. Guys like Webster and Barnes were fodder like Graveman/Boyd, Trey Ball was one of the dumbest picks I remember landing on top 100s but that was more so because of where he was drafted.
 

Diamond Joe Quimby

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Ed Rod and Swihart deserved their rankings, Owens was basically mimicking Sanchez for awhile there until Sanchez hit the majors. Guys like Webster and Barnes were fodder like Graveman/Boyd, Trey Ball was one of the dumbest picks I remember landing on top 100s but that was more so because of where he was drafted.

Except Owens never had a 65 grade fastball.
 

MJ65

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Jul 12, 2009
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Any thing new guys, any rumors

Can some one please update me - it was a long day for me
 

Canada4Gold

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Keith Law chat

http://meadowparty.com/blog/2016/07/14/klawchat-71416/

Bryan: Rowdy Tellez is tearing up AA of late as a 21 year old. Can he possibly become a league average 1b/DH in MLB? I believe I recall you saying he has a “long swing”–will that prevent him from reaching the big leagues?
Klaw: No. Can’t hit quality pitching.

Sounds like he's on pace to be as good as non-prospect Devon Travis then :laugh:

AA must not have any quality pitching I guess. Because Tellez is mashing it. With a crazy good BB/K ratio.
 

Bad News Benning

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Keith Law chat

http://meadowparty.com/blog/2016/07/14/klawchat-71416/



Sounds like he's on pace to be as good as non-prospect Devon Travis then :laugh:

AA must not have any quality pitching I guess. Because Tellez is mashing it. With a crazy good BB/K ratio.

The fact he'd take Benintendi over Moncada speak volumes. Moncada is the better prospect and has bigger upside. I wouldn't take Keith law very seriously when he says stuff about jays prospects.
 

hockeywiz542

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Remigio Pereira apologizes for altering O Canada.

In a video posted on his Facebook page on Friday, an emotional Remigio Pereira says he knows O Canada is revered, and he was not intending to disrespect the anthem, the people of Canada, or "the people who have fallen for this country to be free."

He says those who were offended by his "all lives matter" message should know that he's not a racist, noting that he grew up in a multicultural environment.

https://www.facebook.com/remigio.pereira/videos/10153818699303099/
 

hockeywiz542

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Any news on his little brother? I remember the Jays being interested in both at one point.

According to MLB.com, Yulieski Gurriel's younger brother, Lourdes Gurriel Jr. won't be 23 until October. As a result, he will not be subject to international signing pool guidelines if he signs after he turns 23, and therefore stands to have more leverage if he signs after his birthday, because teams would not have to use money from their international bonus pool to sign him.

http://m.astros.mlb.com/news/article/189772122/astros-sign-cuban-star-yulieski-gurriel/

Gurriel, who defected from Cuba after the Caribbean Series in February with his younger brother, Lourdes Gurriel Jr. -- a top outfield prospect -- has been training in Miami. He's projected to need 50 or 60 at-bats in the Minors. He could be in the big leagues sometime in early August.

Yulieski is considered one of the most celebrated players from Cuba. He was an Olympian in 2004, and he represented Cuba in all three World Baseball Classic tournaments. He was part of Cuban championship teams at the Pan American Games, Central American Games, World Baseball Championships, International Cup and Caribbean Series.

The veteran infielder, who can play second base and third base, projects to hit .285 with 15-18 home runs and 85 RBIs in the big leagues. He's been described as a more fluid and athletic Jeff Kent. Yulieski hit .500/.589/.874 with 15 home runs, 20 doubles and 51 RBIs in 49 games for the Industriales in 2015.

Lourdes, 22, who played six seasons in Cuba, won't be 23 until October. He will not be subject to international signing pool guidelines if he signs after he turns 23, and therefore stands to have more leverage if he signs after his birthday, because teams would not have to use money from their international bonus pool to sign him.

Their surname had previously been spelled Gourriel before the family changed the spelling less than two years ago, Yulieski told MLB.com earlier this year.

Lourdes, who plays shortstop and outfield, was hitting .321 with eight home runs, 32 RBIs and a .924 OPS in 43 games for the Havana Industriales when he defected. He has not yet been declared a free agent.
 
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