Cyclones Rock
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- Jun 12, 2008
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Speculation: Duration of the rebuild
- Thread starter tunnelvision
- Start date
Johansen2Foligno
CBJ Realest
- Jan 2, 2015
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Is this team reloading a musket? What happened to Jarmo's "we're not rebuilding, we're reloading?"
Michigan Magic
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EspenK
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- Sep 25, 2011
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Xoggz22
Registered User
Boy did I misread this team. Very depressing. I feel like the only reason they are even talking about a Winter Classic in Columbus is to save the team, ala Arizona. I just can't imagine the fan base will continue to remain as strong as it has for as long as it has and extend the courtesy. I never thought I would become apathetic. I was always mad when they lost and people gave me shit about supporting this team (including my wife). Now... I really don't care any more. Pathetic. I mean I just sold my tickets to watch Connor BeJesus on Wednesday. My Day 1 status is surely to end this year. Completely bummed over this team and what I've become.
Michigan Magic
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Xoggz22
Registered User
Club level no less. Didn't even look to get rich. I have two tickets in C-4 (Center Ice) that routinely go to others these days.
Not sure where the team goes from here, if the wheels do fall off/stay off this season.
There's a "window" through 2026 - Laine & Jenner go UFA that summer. By July 1, 2026 the following guys will hit unrestricted free agency or be re-signed -> Laine, Jenner, Kuraly, Olivier, Danforth, Roslovic, Provorov, Gudbranson, Peeke, Martin.
Now, this season is mostly lost already. So you're only talking a two year window ('24-'25 & '25-'26) before you have to make decisions on Jenner & Laine. By July 1, 2026, you'll already be four years through Gaudreau's 7-year deal.
This team mostly feels like a video game roster. Yes, on paper, there's talent. Gaudreau had that 115-point season and was a Hart Trophy finalist. Provorov is a former 1st round pick. Etc. But there doesn't seem to be a lot of cohesion. Is that due to a new system? Adding 5 new players not counting Texier? Hard to say.
With Werenski, Gaudreau, Severson all signed long term you also can't really blow it up, especially with Fantilli, Johnson, Mateychuk, Jiricek, etc. here or on the way.
There is a chance this kind of stalls out and maybe the team gets up to that 17-22th place in the league aka no man's land.
There's a "window" through 2026 - Laine & Jenner go UFA that summer. By July 1, 2026 the following guys will hit unrestricted free agency or be re-signed -> Laine, Jenner, Kuraly, Olivier, Danforth, Roslovic, Provorov, Gudbranson, Peeke, Martin.
Now, this season is mostly lost already. So you're only talking a two year window ('24-'25 & '25-'26) before you have to make decisions on Jenner & Laine. By July 1, 2026, you'll already be four years through Gaudreau's 7-year deal.
This team mostly feels like a video game roster. Yes, on paper, there's talent. Gaudreau had that 115-point season and was a Hart Trophy finalist. Provorov is a former 1st round pick. Etc. But there doesn't seem to be a lot of cohesion. Is that due to a new system? Adding 5 new players not counting Texier? Hard to say.
With Werenski, Gaudreau, Severson all signed long term you also can't really blow it up, especially with Fantilli, Johnson, Mateychuk, Jiricek, etc. here or on the way.
There is a chance this kind of stalls out and maybe the team gets up to that 17-22th place in the league aka no man's land.
Byrral
Registered User
I voted playoffs 2024 and contender 2026. They are technically still able to accomplish this although I doubt it will happen the way the roster is structured combined with their play right now.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
- Jun 13, 2009
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Despite the results and despite the glaring issues on the team, I still do not think the team is as bad as their record nor are THAT far away from the playoffs.
Firstly, they are far too young. Especially at key positions. Two centers you're leaning heavily on for offense are under 22 years old and one of them was forced into the NHL too early. Who knows how that'll work out.
KJ maybe had a bad summer of playing too much ball hockey and not enough gym time and he paid for it by going to Cleveland. I haven't watched him, but the stats seem pretty good and he seems to be improving. That's a good sign, I think he'll be back up.
A big "problem" is the glut on the roster. Useless glut too. It is very clear that neither Boqvist or Peeke have any long term future here but they toll away in the press box. Bean and Provorov probably don't have much of a future here either with kids like Mateychuk and Svozil on the way. For some reason Jarmo thought it was a good idea to keep Olivier despite having Gudbranson and getting Voronkov (who he knew was coming over).
And lastly they have 8.5ish million tied up in a winger who does nothing but turn the puck over and backcheck. I think Laine's heart is in the right place and he truly wants to be a difference maker. But he doesn't have the ability to. Having an elite shot is one thing, and he does have one, but when that's all you got, it isn't enough. Especially at that price tag. Chinakhov maybe doesn't have the slap shot or one timer Laine does but at least he doesn't break your back with turnovers.
TL;DR. Team isn't that far despite the results. Have to find a way to trim the fat off the roster and grow with the youth. Find a trade partner for Laine (Bjorkstrand please come home) and grow the kids at center.
Firstly, they are far too young. Especially at key positions. Two centers you're leaning heavily on for offense are under 22 years old and one of them was forced into the NHL too early. Who knows how that'll work out.
KJ maybe had a bad summer of playing too much ball hockey and not enough gym time and he paid for it by going to Cleveland. I haven't watched him, but the stats seem pretty good and he seems to be improving. That's a good sign, I think he'll be back up.
A big "problem" is the glut on the roster. Useless glut too. It is very clear that neither Boqvist or Peeke have any long term future here but they toll away in the press box. Bean and Provorov probably don't have much of a future here either with kids like Mateychuk and Svozil on the way. For some reason Jarmo thought it was a good idea to keep Olivier despite having Gudbranson and getting Voronkov (who he knew was coming over).
And lastly they have 8.5ish million tied up in a winger who does nothing but turn the puck over and backcheck. I think Laine's heart is in the right place and he truly wants to be a difference maker. But he doesn't have the ability to. Having an elite shot is one thing, and he does have one, but when that's all you got, it isn't enough. Especially at that price tag. Chinakhov maybe doesn't have the slap shot or one timer Laine does but at least he doesn't break your back with turnovers.
TL;DR. Team isn't that far despite the results. Have to find a way to trim the fat off the roster and grow with the youth. Find a trade partner for Laine (Bjorkstrand please come home) and grow the kids at center.
With how much youth this team has and how little the club benefits from adding more, I don't really think there is a "no man's land" for this team. They just need to win whatever games they can. If there's a no man's land it's finishing near the bottom.
- The fact that all but one of the losses have been by a single goal tells you that they're better than their record. But it's also a mistake prone type of roster so I'm not sure if they're actually close.
- I do not think the roster glut is a real problem. It's a waste of money for our owners and it hurts the asset values for Peeke and Boqvist but it's not in any way hurting our team's chances of winning right now. I think the depth has helped a lot actually. Several of our best contributors were marginal to start the year.
- I would be fine if Laine sat another couple weeks and rested his head a bit. He's not helping in this state. We can talk about whether he needs to go after he has had an opportunity to fully recover. He's been bad before, but he's also had months where he's been our best player.
- A Laine for Bjorkstrand trade would be hilarious (and of course welcomed by me). You'd have to fire Jarmo first of course!
If our PP was halfway competent half of those are probably wins.
Michigan Magic
Registered User
I'm afraid the rebuild won't be completed until long after the fans have had enough. The pot is already boiling.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
- Jun 13, 2009
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I mean if you're just going to look at things in black and white, sure. The rebuild is a failure and they should re-blow it up. But things aren't always in black and white. They should have won at least 4 or 5 of these games.
"coulda shoulda woulda" yeah I know. But its not like they're getting blown out. They are in almost all of these games.
A lot of the mistakes are committed by veterans who you would think would be able to clean it up as time goes on. Severson has done better. Werenski is still struggling but you hope will snap out of it. Laine is Laine. Provorov has backpeddled recently but he might not even be here long term. KJ is in Cleveland. Johnny might be ready to go now.
I know I'm spouting the company rhetoric but I really don't think they're far off from competing.
Cyclones Rock
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I don't know what the percentages are, but I'd guess that something in the neighborhood of 50% of hockey games are decided by a goal.
Also, how many times have CBJ opponents scored ENGs when they had the opportunity to do so? What is the xENG goals vs. actual in CBJ games......I kid as that stat can't exist. Or can it? LOL
Trying to claim a team is close because of an average small losing margin in games is grasping at false hope straws. Especially when they've lost 12 out their last 13.
Also, how many times have CBJ opponents scored ENGs when they had the opportunity to do so? What is the xENG goals vs. actual in CBJ games......I kid as that stat can't exist. Or can it? LOL
Trying to claim a team is close because of an average small losing margin in games is grasping at false hope straws. Especially when they've lost 12 out their last 13.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
- Jun 13, 2009
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They've had a lead in 7 straight games (statistically, teams that score first usually win). Have lost the lead in the dying seconds of a game at least twice. And have lost a multiple goal lead at least twice.
That's not grasping at false hope straws, that's just reality.
Cyclones Rock
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Games are 60 minutes long. An early lead in a game by a team which has won 4 games this season isn't really indicative of anything. It's likely an aberration that won't continue.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
- Jun 13, 2009
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Such is losing multiple leafs in the. dying seconds of a game and losing games while playing well. But I'm sure thats who they "really" are and that will also get thrown away.
koteka
Registered User
This defense, which was purposefully built this way, is not designed to hold leads. So saying we are close because the games are close and because we have had leads in many games ignores the fact that we have constructed a team that is built to blow leads in the third period and there is no hope on the horizon that things will improve.
CBJWerenski8
Formerly CBJWennberg10 (RIP Kivi)
- Jun 13, 2009
- 42,367
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That’s a fair rebuttal. It’s definitely a defense designed to get a multi goal lead which is obviously not happening. But the blown leads are not just a defenseman issue.
TaketheCannoli
RIP
I found his piece interesting. The only thing is I don't know the right way to rebuild besides collecting picks and prospects. Arace is talking about development. I'm sure many of us remember the Jackets were criticized for rushing Klesla, Brule, Brassard and many others before they were ready. Often times we heard how Detroit kept their prospects in the AHL until they were almost overripe and how the CBJ would be wise to learn from that.
Now Arace is criticizing because the Jackets are keeping Johnson in the AHL and sending Jiricek up and down.
I remember Arace was front and center criticizing the Jackets for rushing those guys back then.
What's the right way?
