Dubas vs. Dorion. Who is the better GM?

[Drytoast]

Dorion .

Dubas is such a lazy gm.He still hasn't dared make the trade that will turn his team into a contender.

What has dorion done?

You don't get a trophy as a good gm if all you do is pick top 5 year after year ya know?

 

[Golden_Jet]

What has dorion done?

You don't get a trophy as a good gm if all you do is pick top 5 year after year ya know?

You don’t get a trophy as a good GM losing all the time in the first round, as well, or for inheriting all your good players.

No need to rehash all of Dubas’s blunders again, everyone is aware of those by now.

 

[NyQuil]

 

[Drytoast]

You don’t get a trophy as a good GM losing all the time in the first round, as well, or for inheriting all your good players.

No need to rehash all of Dubas’s blunders again, everyone is aware of those by now.

No but you also don't lose to a gm who can't make it to the first round.

I guess after dorion gets 6-7 top five picks we might see him move the sens out of bottom feeder territory and then it's clear cut case of superiority!

Lord knows most of us here don't know how to select top 5 players! Pure gm prowess right there.
Lol

 

[Golden_Jet]

View attachment 612912

I miss Kate already from the show, she was great.

 

[Smif]

You don’t get a trophy as a good GM losing all the time in the first round, as well, or for inheriting all your good players.

No need to rehash all of Dubas’s blunders again, everyone is aware of those by now.

You should get a trophy for posting in 100%.of all Leafs related threads.

 

[A1LeafNation]

View attachment 612882

Dubas just flipped last years #1 and both Murray and Samsonov have looked great. Meanwhile Edmonton went all in on Campbell giving him 4 more million then he deserves. Dubas recognized that and took the unpopular path everyone on these boards shit on him for.

Meanwhile Dorion has been able to turn a bottom feeder team into a bottom feeder team.

Your right! Clearly Dorion has the edge here!

 

[McVespa99]

Wouldnt it be a more appropriate poll if you asked which GM is worse?

 

[NyQuil]

To be honest, I'm amazed anyone is defending either guy.

One guy was given the keys to a Porsche and can't get it out of 1st gear.

And the other guy keeps trading his car in for another one that also won't start.

 

[Drytoast]

To be honest, I'm amazed anyone is defending either guy.

One guy was given the keys to a Porsche and can't get it out of 1st gear.

And the other guy keeps trading his car in for another one that also won't start.

That's not the conversation. The thread isn't "which GM in the league is the best GM" This thread is specific in that it is having Dorion competing against Dubas. And my guess here is that this thread was created when someone thought Dorion did something clever so they wanted to take the Leafs down a peg. Created this poll so here we are.

The reality is that Dubas has, once again...found a diamonds in the rough twice now with Samsonov and Murray as a solid 1a/1b combo and went against popular opinion by not signing fan favorite Campbell to a longer term expensive contract and it seems to have been the correct move. Something Edmonton's GM wasn't clever enough to avoid...

He also got Gio who is a defensive STUD to sign league min for 2 seasons.

He signed Benn which seems to have worked out just fine even though he's currently got a shoulder injury his play was actually decent enough.

That's just this summer and part of the reason we are sitting in second place comfortably.

Now then. What brilliant moves have panned out for Dorion just this summer that would convince me and anyone else that he is the smarter GM? Some brilliant find or diamond in the rough that has propelled Ottawa out of the division cellar...oh...wait.

Nevermind. There isn't any.

Things don't look great for Dorion and there is a reason why Ottawa hasn't progressed which is EXACTLY why you want to back out of the conversation and just paint them both as bad.

 

[Drytoast]

Matt Murray is currently the best goaltender on the Ottawa Senators' payroll; Yes, it's true

The Ottawa Senators thought they had pulled one over on the Toronto Maple Leafs when they dealt an oft injured, underperforming Matt Murray to Toronto for future considerations. The Sens offered up a 2023 3rd round pick and a 2024 7th round pick in exchange for only having to retain 25% of...

www.mapleleafsinsider.com

MATT MURRAY IS CURRENTLY THE BEST GOALTENDER ON THE OTTAWA SENATORS' PAYROLL; YES, IT'S TRUE



196 forum goers with voting remorse in this poll.

 

[NyQuil]

That's not the conversation. The thread isn't "which GM in the league is the best GM" This thread is specific in that it is having Dorion competing against Dubas. And my guess here is that this thread was created when someone thought Dorion did something clever so they wanted to take the Leafs down a peg. Created this poll so here we are.

The reality is that Dubas has, once again...found a diamonds in the rough twice now with Samsonov and Murray as a solid 1a/1b combo and went against popular opinion by not signing fan favorite Campbell to a longer term expensive contract and it seems to have been the correct move. Something Edmonton's GM wasn't clever enough to avoid...

He also got Gio who is a defensive STUD to sign league min for 2 seasons.

He signed Benn which seems to have worked out just fine even though he's currently got a shoulder injury his play was actually decent enough.

That's just this summer and part of the reason we are sitting in second place comfortably.

Now then. What brilliant moves have panned out for Dorion just this summer that would convince me and anyone else that he is the smarter GM? Some brilliant find or diamond in the rough that has propelled Ottawa out of the division cellar...oh...wait.

Nevermind. There isn't any.

Things don't look great for Dorion and there is a reason why Ottawa hasn't progressed which is EXACTLY why you want to back out of the conversation and just paint them both as bad.

That’s a lot of defending a guy who honestly shouldn’t still have a job.

But yes, if Dorion is the bar it’s no wonder you think Dubas is good at his job.

I have no problem being honest about Dorion and his lack of success in terms of making the playoffs.

Backing out of the conversation? Who do you think I voted for?

Meanwhile, you guys are still drinking the same Kool-Aid it appears. It’s like Groundhog Day.

It's not Carey Price. It's deeper than that. We are on our what? 5th year now with the Matthews era and this core has yet to have won a game that mattered. That's beyond deeper than Price alone.

Maybe we should give the Habs some credit.

They have paid the right price. Healthy and rested he is THE game changer here. Bottom line

forums.hfboards.com

Now six years.

Keep defending your boy wonder.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Matt Murray is currently the best goaltender on the Ottawa Senators' payroll; Yes, it's true

The Ottawa Senators thought they had pulled one over on the Toronto Maple Leafs when they dealt an oft injured, underperforming Matt Murray to Toronto for future considerations. The Sens offered up a 2023 3rd round pick and a 2024 7th round pick in exchange for only having to retain 25% of...

www.mapleleafsinsider.com

MATT MURRAY IS CURRENTLY THE BEST GOALTENDER ON THE OTTAWA SENATORS' PAYROLL; YES, IT'S TRUE



196 forum goers with voting remorse in this poll.

All Kaprizov had to was raise the puck, more than a foot and he had an empty net.

 

[ole ole]

I'm just glad neither of these 2 losers are running my club.

 

[Drytoast]

All Kaprizov had to was raise the puck, more than a foot and he had an empty net.

Shoulda woulda coulda.

How's Campbell doing over there in Edmonton? Wanna start a poll about which GM is smarter? Dubas or Holland? Do you get points for finally turning the ship around by consistently drafting easy pick top 5 players until you have enough that the team starts competing?

Couldn't ANYONE do that?

So exactly by what metric is Dorion better by turning a bottom feeder team into a bottom feeder team? What smart moves has he pulled off? I can list you things about Dubas? Do you have anything you can share with the crowd here? Or again, is the long game to just draft top 5 until the ship gets flipped over?

Because if that's the plan, ANYONE can do that.

 

[Drytoast]

I love how everyone's suddenly gotten all quiet on the subject now. I'm asking a really simple question here.

What genius moves or signings has dorion done to make you think he's better then Dubas?

I just listed a few for Dubas.

 

[Xspyrit]

What has dorion done?

You don't get a trophy as a good gm if all you do is pick top 5 year after year ya know?

I want to like this post as I am one of the Dorion biggest critics out there but it's factually incorrect. It only happened twice in 5 years

2018 : 4th OA
2019 : 19th OA (as a result of Matt Duchene trades)
2020 : 5th OA (+ 3rd OA pick from the Karlsson trade)
2021 : 10th OA (then proceeds to draft a guy seen as a late first rounder)
2022 : 7th OA (but traded the pick for DeBrincat)

I could write pages about what Dorion has done wrong though.

No but you also don't lose to a gm who can't make it to the first round.

I guess after dorion gets 6-7 top five picks we might see him move the sens out of bottom feeder territory and then it's clear cut case of superiority!

Lord knows most of us here don't know how to select top 5 players! Pure gm prowess right there.
Lol

Again factually incorrect but Dorion was in an incredible situation when the rebuild started. The prospect pool was already good with Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, White, etc & he had great players in their prime for trade like Karlsson, Stone, Duchene, Pageau, etc

He decided to sink or swim with DJ Smith so there's that and he also always make a bunch of decisions to improve a part of the roster but end up making another part less than ideal. This season, the top-6 improved but the bottom-6 is absolutely awful (particularly with Norris injury which moves up Pinto)

Can't blame him for the Formenton situation but we had Formenton, Nick Paul and Connor Brown just a few months ago...

 

[Drytoast]

That’s a lot of defending a guy who honestly shouldn’t still have a job.

But yes, if Dorion is the bar it’s no wonder you think Dubas is good at his job.

I have no problem being honest about Dorion and his lack of success in terms of making the playoffs.

Backing out of the conversation? Who do you think I voted for?

Meanwhile, you guys are still drinking the same Kool-Aid it appears. It’s like Groundhog Day.

Maybe we should give the Habs some credit.

They have paid the right price. Healthy and rested he is THE game changer here. Bottom line

forums.hfboards.com

Now six years.

Keep defending your boy wonder.

It's not an "if". It's exactly the poll of this thread. It's in the title. Dorion vs Dubas.

I know I know...you are desperate to pivot out of that now because things haven't planned out in favor of poo pooing on toronto.

Lesson learned maybe about creating polls?

 

[NyQuil]

I live how everyone's suddenly gotten all quiet on the subject now. I'm asking a really simple question here.

What genius moves or signings has dorion done to make you think he's better then Dubas?

I just listed a few It's not an "if". It's exactly the poll of this thread. It's in the title. Dorion vs Dubas.

I know I know...you are desperate to pivot out of that now because things haven't planned out in favor of poo pooing on toronto.

Lesson learned maybe about creating polls?

You mean, the result that corresponds with my vote?

Yeah, I’m really broken up about it.

If I created this poll, which I didn’t, I’m sure there would be plenty of lessons to be learned.

Enjoy the win in a battle between two abject failures of the GM community.

Maybe we’ll revisit it again in April.

 

[Drytoast]

I want to like this post as I am one of the Dorion biggest critics out there but it's factually incorrect. It only happened twice in 5 years

2018 : 4th OA
2019 : 19th OA (as a result of Matt Duchene trades)
2020 : 5th OA (+ 3rd OA pick from the Karlsson trade)
2021 : 10th OA (the proceeds to draft a guy seen as a late first rounder)
2022 : 7th OA (but traded the pick for DeBrincat)

I could write pages about what Dorion has done wrong though.



Again factually incorrect but Dorion was in an incredible situation when the rebuild started. The prospect pool was already good with Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, White, etc & he had great players in their prime for trade like Karlsson, Stone, Duchene, Pageau, etc

He decided to sink or swim with DJ Smith so there's that and he also always make a bunch of decisions to improve a part of the roster but end up making another part less than ideal. This season, the top-6 improved but the bottom-6 is absolutely awful (particularly with Norris injury which moves up Pinto)

Can't blame him for the Formenton situation but we had Formenton, Nick Paul and Connor Brown just a few months ago...

I like the honesty here but my top 5 comment was half jest half truth. More a question of what's it gonna take for this gm to finally see improvement?

Because as you've pointed out...it's certainly not his prowess as a gm.

The reality here is that this poll was a cheap attempt to pile on and poo poo on Toronto using dorion and it backfired.

 

[Drytoast]

You mean, the result that corresponds with my vote?

Yeah, I’m really broken up about it.

If I created this poll, which I didn’t, I’m sure there would be plenty of lessons to be learned.

Enjoy the win in a battle between two abject failures of the GM community.

Maybe we’ll revisit it again in April.

You can count on zero hands how many polls I've created attempting to poo poo on other clubs.

Let's all learn a lesson here about counting chickens and eggs and all that.

Dubas has done alright. It's a tough division. But the moves he's made are sound

 

[NyQuil]

Dubas has done alright. It's a tough division. But the moves he's made are sound

Like it or not, he's in a situation where his moves will only be judged in April.

Let's all learn a lesson here about counting chickens and eggs and all that.

It's November.

Dorion has still won more playoff rounds than Dubas ever has.

 

[Golden_Jet]

It's not an "if". It's exactly the poll of this thread. It's in the title. Dorion vs Dubas.

I know I know...you are desperate to pivot out of that now because things haven't planned out in favor of poo pooing on toronto.

Lesson learned maybe about creating polls?

That’s quite the lesson, learnt eh on making polls, 25% more neutral fans chose Dorian. You sure showed NyQuil lol.

 

[Xspyrit]

I like the honesty here but my top 5 comment was half jest half truth. More a question of what's it gonna take for this gm to finally see improvement?

Because as you've pointed out...it's certainly not his prowess as a gm.

The reality here is that this poll was a cheap attempt to pile on and poo poo on Toronto using dorion and it backfired.

It's going to take the team to be sold. Then they will hire new management who will hire new coaching staff. Which will happen in the next few months

I don't think this poll was made the way you're talking about. OP doesn't seem to be a Sens fan, he seems more like a neutral fan who doesn't post on any team board.

Do you get points for finally turning the ship around by consistently drafting easy pick top 5 players until you have enough that the team starts competing?

Couldn't ANYONE do that?

So exactly by what metric is Dorion better by turning a bottom feeder team into a bottom feeder team? What smart moves has he pulled off? I can list you things about Dubas? Do you have anything you can share with the crowd here? Or again, is the long game to just draft top 5 until the ship gets flipped over?

Because if that's the plan, ANYONE can do that.

I am one of the 12 Sens fans who voted Dubas here but I don't know why you keep going on about this

The Leafs are mainly built this way...

2016 Auston Matthews 1st OA
2015 Mitch Marner 4th OA
2014 William Nylander 8th OA
2012 Morgan Rielly 5th OA

 

[Golden_Jet]

It's going to take the team to be sold. Then they will hire new management who will hire new coaching staff. Which will happen in the next few months

I don't think this poll was made the way you're talking about. OP doesn't seem to be a Sens fan, he seems more like a neutral fan who doesn't post on any team board.



I am one of the 12 Sens fans who voted Dubas here but I don't why you keep going on about this

The Leafs are mainly built this way...

2016 Auston Matthews 1st OA
2015 Mitch Marner 4th OA
2014 William Nylander 8th OA
2012 Morgan Rielly 5th OA

I’d add Marner for fourth, as well, so ya more early picks than the Sens, and Dubas was co-GM for one of those picks, even though Hunter was in charge of the draft.