Speculation: Does Shanahan have any say in how this team is being run?

[Gary Nylund]

So I’ll ask again. What has he done to show that he is capable of doing this job?

LMAO.

 

[Mess]

Shanahan has a lot of faith in his handpicked GM Dubas as he replaced Lou Lam with him.

So ultimately Shanny has a say in all things as he sits at the top of the management depth chart.

I'm surprised based on how tough and gritty Shanny was as a player that he fully endorses the Leafs current player personnel make-up, but he is showing loyalty and allowing to see how this plays out.

 

[Gabriel426]

Shanahan has a lot of faith in his handpicked GM Dubas as he replaced Lou Lam with him.

So ultimately Shanny has a say in all things as he sits at the top of the management depth chart.

I'm surprised based on how tough and gritty Shanny was as a player that he fully endorses the Leafs current player personnel make-up, but he is showing loyalty and allowing to see how this plays out.

Or he is just keeping his mouth shut to the public. Which is the smart thing to do

 

[ToneDog]

Shanny has bought into Dubas' vision hook line and sinker. I hope his head rolls along with Dubas' if Dubas takes our 18 wheeler off the cliff.

 

[rumman]

Lou had to go. But he really brought a sense of respect to the organization. I have a hard time believing Marner, Matthews, or Nylander ever would have gone so deep with their demands. Much more of a sense of the crest on the front than the name on the back when he was here. It was like immediately after he left the players started acting differently.

We don't need Lou, but maybe going to Dubas was too much of a polar opposite.

you make a very good point, maybe Hunter would have been a less radical choice?

 

[rumman]

Shanahan has a lot of faith in his handpicked GM Dubas as he replaced Lou Lam with him.

So ultimately Shanny has a say in all things as he sits at the top of the management depth chart.

I'm surprised based on how tough and gritty Shanny was as a player that he fully endorses the Leafs current player personnel make-up, but he is showing loyalty and allowing to see how this plays out.

if the team continues to struggle I wonder how long it is before he realizes he's made a mistake?

 

[rumman]

Shanny has bought into Dubas' vision hook line and sinker. I hope his head rolls along with Dubas' if Dubas takes our 18 wheeler off the cliff.

one would hope their fate's are cemented together.

 

[ToneDog]

one would hope their fate's are cemented together.

MLSEL should either fire Babs or Shanny and Dubas. Too bad Shanny signed an extension because MLSEL would look real bad if they chose the second option. What is mind boggling is that 31 GMs will tell you that you cannot with with skill alone, yet Shanny allowed Dubas to continue bringing in soft players.

 

[rumman]

MLSEL should either fire Babs or Shanny and Dubas. Too bad Shanny signed an extension because MLSEL would look real bad if they chose the second option. What is mind boggling is that 31 GMs will tell you that you cannot with with skill alone, yet Shanny allowed Dubas to continue bringing in soft players.

it boggles my mind how any GM can think there's no place for physical players on his team. JT being pasted by Weber and there being zero reaction from any Leaf teammate was very telling. Little to no comradely with this team make up.

 

[paulhiggins]

Aside from improving talent by being so bad for so long, I haven't liked the makeup of this team since the Pat Quinn days so if they have to start at the top and chop, that's okay with me. I don't think Shanny will be going yet though, until new GMs and coaches are tried.

 

[paulhiggins]

it boggles my mind how any GM can think there's no place for physical players on his team. JT being pasted by Weber and there being zero reaction from any Leaf teammate was very telling. Little to no comradely with this team make up.

That's what happens when a team is playing scared without character and too many hate the coach. Dubas has some good qualities but I would have preferred someone with NHL playing experience who would recogize what a team needs better than the average HF poster, not worse. Even a guy like Tie Domi had more balls than everyone on this team put together.

The coach needs to go ASAP but that would put the new GM (Dubas's replacement) as having to live with the new coach's contract, all over again. So they both go and hopefully quickly. In the 50 years of watching Leaf hockey I don't think I've ever wanted this to happen more than I do now.

 

[IPS]

MLSEL should either fire Babs or Shanny and Dubas. Too bad Shanny signed an extension because MLSEL would look real bad if they chose the second option. What is mind boggling is that 31 GMs will tell you that you cannot with with skill alone, yet Shanny allowed Dubas to continue bringing in soft players.

Yeah I really wonder what is with this blatant contrast in ideology between our GM and coach.

If it was up to Babs, I'm 100% sure he'd have pushed to keep Polak, Komarov, and Martin and push management to acquire more players in that mold. Now whether or not it'd lead to a more improved team is up for debate (and I'm sure you'd agree even with your preference for those types of players too) but there's no doubt that these two have completely different visions. I really don't get it.

 

[IPS]

Shanny has bought into Dubas' vision hook line and sinker. I hope his head rolls along with Dubas' if Dubas takes our 18 wheeler off the cliff.

Why though? Those Detroit teams that Shanahan played with back in the day was the polar opposite of this team he let Dubas build. In fact Shanny himself was a very hard nosed player. Why would he just sit there and let his GM build a team he doesn't feel is effective?

 

[Martin Skoula]

it boggles my mind how any GM can think there's no place for physical players on his team. JT being pasted by Weber and there being zero reaction from any Leaf teammate was very telling. Little to no comradely with this team make up.

That GM brought in our most physical defenseman and a #1C that makes his living in high-traffic areas.

Who are the physical players he traded away (not counting FAs walking)? Who are the physical players we could have gotten but chose not to? Kadri and Martin (who Babcock refused to play) really aren't a big deal in the bigger picture.

"Thinking there's no place for physical players on this team" is something you have invented and no part of the Leafs front office actually believes. Preferring skill over size does not mean avoiding physical players.

 

[rumman]

That's what happens when a team is playing scared without character and too many hate the coach. Dubas has some good qualities but I would have preferred someone with NHL playing experience who would recogize what a team needs better than the average HF poster, not worse.

The coach needs to go ASAP but that would put the new GM (Dubas's replacement) as having to live with the new coach's contract, all over again. So they both go and hopefully quickly. In the 50 years of watching Leaf hockey I don't think I've ever wanted this to happen more than I do now.

personally I think Dubas is trying to create a new type of NHL team where speed and skill above all else wins cups, he's wrong and will be a OHL GM sooner than later, most likely in the Soo.

This too shall pass........

 

[moon111]

The problem with Toronto is not only the constant pressure to perform, but to start looking like a professional organization.
Shanny, Babs, Dubas... they have made the organization look good with their hiring.
The issue now lies if they don't perform, how do you remove them while saving face.
The only way Babcock is removed during the season would be a complete and utter melt-down.
The next question, is the system Babcock has in place working? Would someone like Keefe bring in something new?
The offense is naturally there, they need someone who can 100% work/teach the defensive side of the game.

 

[kb]

MLSEL should either fire Babs or Shanny and Dubas. Too bad Shanny signed an extension because MLSEL would look real bad if they chose the second option. What is mind boggling is that 31 GMs will tell you that you cannot with with skill alone, yet Shanny allowed Dubas to continue bringing in soft players.

Here is who Dubas brought in.

Tavares
Muzzin
Barrie
Kerfoot
Mikheyev
Ceci
Shore
Gravel
Spezza
Petan

Other than the bottom 2, the players he brought in are basically the least of the team's problems.

 

[rumman]

That GM brought in our most physical defenseman and a #1C that makes his living in high-traffic areas.

Who are the physical players he traded away (not counting FAs walking)? Who are the physical players we could have gotten but chose not to? Kadri and Martin (who Babcock refused to play) really aren't a big deal in the bigger picture.

"Thinking there's no place for physical players on this team" is something you have invented and no part of the Leafs front office actually believes. Preferring skill over size does not mean avoiding physical players.

Dubas all but confirm this in a media scrum last season, all while displaying that arrogant smirk of his.

 

[Trapper]

What if Dubas did want to remove Babcock and Shanahan said no? Is that a possibility?

 

[HandshakeLineRespect]

I never once said Shanahan should be fired at “this point”. Clearly states if he doesn’t win the division or a playoff series this season.

If you’re going to call someone ignorant:

1) Read the post. Read it a 2nd time just to make sure.

2) State why you think that way.

So I’ll ask again. What has he done to show that he is capable of doing this job?

If you’re asking what shanny has done to show he is capable of doing this job you are truly clueless.

 

[Trapper]

Here is who Dubas brought in.

Tavares
Muzzin
Barrie
Kerfoot
Mikheyev
Ceci
Shore
Gravel
Spezza
Petan

Other than the bottom 2, the players he brought in are basically the least of the team's problems.

At the end of the day it will be the ones he is banking on that will make or break it.

If the high paid trio lacks the drive train required. Dubas will get to change the coach and then make a decision on the top. You can only change so many depth guys before you have to admit the problem. If it persists.

 

[rumman]

What if Dubas did want to remove Babcock and Shanahan said no? Is that a possibility?

I'm of the mind that this is exactly what has happened. In my opinion Dubas desperately wants Keefe to be his coach and would have made the move if it's his to make. Having said that, he's probably more than comfortable knowing that if this team fails Babcock is the one who'll take the blame.

The real problem for Dubas is what if a Babcock led team is successful, how can he possibly bring in Keefe when Babcock has proven he can get it done?

Keefe won't wait forever to be a NHL coach, I'd bet Dubas has assured him he's the heir apparent to be the next coach of the TML's.

 

[kb]

At the end of the day it will be the ones he is banking on that will make or break it.

If the high paid trio lacks the drive train required. Dubas will get to change the coach and then make a decision on the top. You can only change so many depth guys before you have to admit the problem. If it persists.

Agreed. I think that the coach needs to be the first change made. My opinion is that his coaching style doesn't work with younger players. Plus you can't have a coach that is throwing players and the GM under the bus. It causes lack of trust and lack of faith. Then it's all on the players afterwards.

 

[DavePoulin4PM]

If you’re asking what shanny has done to show he is capable of doing this job you are truly clueless.

Lol. Yeah.. you got nothing. That’s the great thing about pro sports. There is no grey area.. you either raise banners and make playoff runs or you don’t.

Shanahan has nothing to hang his hat on into year 5.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Dubas all but confirm this in a media scrum last season, all while displaying that arrogant smirk of his.

Why did he bring in 2 of our most physical players then?

You're seeing what you want to see and your best evidence to back it up is probably Martin or Lindholm being traded? 2 no-name 4th liners that weren't even scratching 10 minutes a game here if they were even playing.

If a Tkachuk or Kreider was available and affordable, do you really think we wouldn't be in the market? We have enough bottom-6 grinders and top-6 toughness is expensive to get unless you're willing to overpay a 28 year old UFA who's body is about to break down like Lucic.