Does Jimmy retire or go to the minors?

[kliq]

Him having the job this long when there are better options makes him overrated. Even flawed Mrazek is better and at least looks like an NHL goalie in 2020....

Being given playing time does make you overrated.

 

[MBH]

I can't ever remember Howard being "overrated". Guy has never been given his due, constantly being berated by fans. Just look around these boards, where are you seeing all this Howard "love"?

Howard was a solid to good goalie from 9-10 to 12-13.
He was weak to solid from 13-14 to 18-19.
He's making Hardy f***ing Astrom and Jiri Cyrha look decent right now.

 

[ricky0034]

4.26 GAA and .876 Save % and we are still DEFENDING this guy???!!! The team sucks sure. He sucks JUST AS MUCH if not more! Period.

go find one person that thinks Howards play this year has been okay

 

[MBH]

Being given playing time does make you overrated.

He's been overrated since his contract kicked in.
Look at the numbers.
People in these groups talked about him like he was good or even great.

I think part of the reason why he's overrated is because he has traditionally started so well. When you start well, your numbers are great for awhile.
So even when you suck later, your numbers never really reflect your suckage.

So he's sitting at .930 on Thanksgiving or something and everyone's like, wow, Jimmy's great. Then he sucks the rest of the way and ends up at .909.

For example, if Jimmy Howard did it the opposite way, and sucked for 6 weeks and was at .880 on Thanksgiving, people would hate him. Then he'd gradually improve and get to .909.

In one situation... people see that .930 stat for 8 weeks and he never gets below .909.
In the other... people see that .880 stat for 8 weeks and he never gets above .909.

In one situation, people talk about him as an all-star.
In the other, he's Jonathan Bernier.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Then you don't understand my point.

It was a defensive, low-scoring series because that's how it was coached.

I'd put Howard's second half of that series in my top 5 for why the Wings lost that series.

He wasn't the MAIN reason. But his second half of that series was a factor. He couldn't lock it down. Same thing happened earlier in his career.

The premise being discussed is that he collapsed a 3-1 lead. He did that.

Him not playing as well and it being a factor to the Wings losing doesn't address the premise, it skirts around it.

Do you agree with the premise that Howard himself surrendered a 3-1 lead and lost the series?

 

[ArGarBarGar]

4.26 GAA and .876 Save % and we are still DEFENDING this guy???!!! The team sucks sure. He sucks JUST AS MUCH if not more! Period.

Do you choose not to read other people's posts?

 

[MBH]

The premise being discussed is that he collapsed a 3-1 lead. He did that.

Him not playing as well and it being a factor to the Wings losing doesn't address the premise, it skirts around it.

Do you agree with the premise that Howard himself surrendered a 3-1 lead and lost the series?

Of course not.
But it doesn't reflect well on Howard either.
Howard finds a way to win another game and he might have a legacy worth caring about.

As I said, I hang that series around Babcock's neck.
Yeah, we were old. Yeah, Chicago had more dynamic talent.
Still. Datsyuk was healthy. Zetterberg was healthy. Properly utilized, they win that series.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Of course not.

Then what the hell are we even talking about? I'm not campaigning Howard as the greatest of great goalies who never did anything wrong and never had a bad game in that series.

 

[SirloinUB]

how is Howard "overrated"?

he never got any respect around here even when he was one of the best Goalies in the league,if anything historically he's been incredibly underrated(and is pretty appropriately rated nowadays)

Exactly, He had a solid career despite the fact the team in font of him was slowly getting worse.

He is well past his best before date but much of the chastising going on during a lost season is pretty pathetic.

 

[MBH]

Then what the hell are we even talking about? I'm not campaigning Howard as the greatest of great goalies who never did anything wrong and never had a bad game in that series.

I think Howard's playoff record is a ding against him.
But yeah, this spilt milk dried up a long time ago. Playoffs? What are those?

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

Being given playing time does make you overrated.

Keeping your job when you don't deserve it does. If country club Holland wasn't here Howard would have bounced around the NHL....

 

[kliq]

He's been overrated since his contract kicked in.
Look at the numbers.
People in these groups talked about him like he was good or even great.

I think part of the reason why he's overrated is because he has traditionally started so well. When you start well, your numbers are great for awhile.
So even when you suck later, your numbers never really reflect your suckage.

So he's sitting at .930 on Thanksgiving or something and everyone's like, wow, Jimmy's great. Then he sucks the rest of the way and ends up at .909.

For example, if Jimmy Howard did it the opposite way, and sucked for 6 weeks and was at .880 on Thanksgiving, people would hate him. Then he'd gradually improve and get to .909.

In one situation... people see that .930 stat for 8 weeks and he never gets below .909.
In the other... people see that .880 stat for 8 weeks and he never gets above .909.

In one situation, people talk about him as an all-star.
In the other, he's Jonathan Bernier.

I’m sorry, but I just don’t see it. I agree that jimmy starts great, typically gets hurt then does a 180, but I don’t see him get much love on boards like this. Maybe a couple people, but I see much more hate towards him then kindness.

 

[kliq]

Keeping your job when you don't deserve it does. If country club Holland wasn't here Howard would have bounced around the NHL....

So this is a holland issue for you. Makes sense.

 

[MBH]

Keeping your job when you don't deserve it does. If country club Holland wasn't here Howard would have bounced around the NHL....

What I'm sour about is that Howard was playing well and Mrazek was struggling.
We could have kept Mrazek and gotten MORE than a third for Howard.
Our goaltending situation would have been good enough to get through the next couple years with Mrazek/Bernier.

And we'd have had a good pick.

But again. Over and done.

 

[2xJack]

Howard is the wings most overrated goal of all time AIAEC. The guy made it to the second round a few times. His best season he collapsed a 3-1 lead to the Blackhawks in the second round. Waive him and let the Oilers claim him.

I do agree that it seems Howard is no longer capable of NHL caliber play and needs to go. However, the mantle of most overrated Red Wings goalie of all time is Osgood and there's nobody that will be dethroning him in that regard. Osgood was a very average NHL goalie with some all-time great teams playing in front of him. Take him in his prime and put him in front of this Wings team and he'd look like garbage too.

 

[Frk It]

What I'm sour about is that Howard was playing well and Mrazek was struggling.
We could have kept Mrazek and gotten MORE than a third for Howard.
Our goaltending situation would have been good enough to get through the next couple years with Mrazek/Bernier.

And we'd have had a good pick.

But again. Over and done.

I thought there were some articles from Detroit media that came out after the trade that said they tried to trade both, but ultimately dealt Mrazek because he had more interest/worth from other teams.

Am I remembering that wrong?

 

[MBH]

I’m sorry, but I just don’t see it. I agree that jimmy starts great, typically gets hurt then does a 180, but I don’t see him get much love on boards like this. Maybe a couple people, but I see much more hate towards him then kindness.

Maybe not here. Go to reddit and criticize him.
Before this year, you'd have been downvoted to hell.
Lots of fans love Jimmy Howard.

 

[MBH]

I thought there were some articles from Detroit media that came out after the trade that said they tried to trade both, but ultimately dealt Mrazek because he had more interest/worth from other teams.

Am I remembering that wrong?

I don't think Detroit wanted to trade Howard because Blashill/Holland still had hope for the playoffs. Part of the Holland delusional era.

The Wings looked at trading Howard in one off-season after he was terrible, but couldn't move him.

Unofficially, the rumor was Blash/Mrazek's relationship made it super unlikely Mrazek could stick in Detroit.

 

[2xJack]

I don't think Detroit wanted to trade Howard because Blashill/Holland still had hope for the playoffs. Part of the Holland delusional era.

The Wings looked at trading Howard in one off-season after he was terrible, but couldn't move him.

Unofficially, the rumor was Blash/Mrazek's relationship made it super unlikely Mrazek could stick in Detroit.

Mrazek was very inconsistent here, too, in addition to the personality issues. Even in Philly he was not good all the time. His play has improved the last couple of seasons.

 

[MBH]

Mrazek was very inconsistent here, too, in addition to the personality issues. Even in Philly he was not good all the time. His play has improved the last couple of seasons.

That's all we need at the moment.
Mrazek doesn't make this team win.
But he wouldn't go 2-16-2 with a GAA of 4.26 or whatever.

 

[2xJack]

That's all we need at the moment.
Mrazek doesn't make this team win.
But he wouldn't go 2-16-2 with a GAA of 4.26 or whatever.

I agree completely. I'm just saying that the Mrazek we moved on from is not the same Mrazek the Canes have now. It sure would be nice to have a 27 year old goalie in his prime right now.

 

[Winger98]

Howard was a solid to good goalie from 9-10 to 12-13.
He was weak to solid from 13-14 to 18-19.
He's making Hardy ****ing Astrom and Jiri Cyrha look decent right now.

Howard needed someone who could share the work load a bit more evenly. Having to play 60 games in 17/18 and then 55 games last season may have hastened his current fall.

 

[PelagicJoe]

As long as he isn't on the team, I don't care. He should have been traded 5 or 6 years ago.

 

[kliq]

Maybe not here. Go to reddit and criticize him.
Before this year, you'd have been downvoted to hell.
Lots of fans love Jimmy Howard.

Outside of maybe on thread when LGW.com was down, I've never been on Reddit for anything Wings related. Based on this site and the aforementioned site, I'd say he has always been a scapegoat for when this team lost, and has never been given his due.

Chicago series is a perfect example that you cited earlier, Howard definitely contributed to the loss, but he wasn't THE reason why we lost.

 

[kliq]

I don't think Detroit wanted to trade Howard because Blashill/Holland still had hope for the playoffs. Part of the Holland delusional era.

Once the streak was over, I never got the impression that this was the case. All indicators pointed towards ownership giving the greenlight for a real re-build at that point.

When Mrazek was traded, I remember Jimmy was being shopped around as well.