Does Dubinsky get bought out by July 1?

[Cyclones Rock]

Will he or won't he?

The buyout period begins June 15 and ends on June 30.

I think he should, but really don't have a strong feeling as to which way management will go. A lot depends on the Duchene situation and trades. If the team needs the cap room, he's obviously gone. If not, I think he stays another year.

If I were running the show, I'd demand that he waive his NMC and be willing to go to Cleveland-even if I wanted to keep him around another year to minimize the length of his buyout ramifications. If I decided that I wouldn't buy him out and he wouldn't go to Cleveland, he would get the Vinny Lecavalier Flyers treatment. Press Box every single game.

I think it's a coin flip and I voted "no".

EDIT: I should have included this info :

Brandon Dubinsky Buyout Details

Cost Calculations

BUYOUT DATE	BASE SALARY REMAINING	S.BONUS REMAINING	YEARS REMAINING	BUYOUT LENGTH	AGE	BUYOUT RATIO	TOTAL COST	TOTAL SAVINGS	ANNUAL COST
Jun 15, 2019	$11,700,000	$0	2	4	33	2/3	$7,800,000	$3,900,000	$1,950,000

[TBODY] [/TBODY]
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Cap Hit Calculations

SEASON	BASE SALARY	INITIAL CAP HIT	ACTUAL COST	SAVINGS	FINAL CAP HIT
2019-20	$5,850,000	$5,850,000	$1,950,000	$3,900,000	$1,950,000
2020-21	$5,850,000	$5,850,000	$1,950,000	$3,900,000	$1,950,000
2021-22	$0	$0	$1,950,000	-$1,950,000	$1,950,000
2022-23	$0	$0	$1,950,000	-$1,950,000	$1,950,000
TOTAL	$11,700,000	$11,700,000	$7,800,000	$3,900,000	$7,800,000

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Click to read more...

 

[Viqsi]

My guess is "no" because we don't have a pressing need to free the cap space up, and so buying him out would be more of a "keep him away from the roster" move. And while I am concerned about him being on the ice, I think he's fine on the roster otherwise.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Jackets already have Tyutin and Hartnell on the buyout books over the next two years (only one for Tyutin). Dubinsky proved himself semi useful in a utility role last year (faceoffs, defensive play, grinding) and although he is significantly overpaid for that role, but its not like we need the cap space right now. I think we can hold off on the buyout another year.

 

[thebus88]

These recent eyeroll negative Dubinsky comments in other threads, and THIS THREAD are a perfect example of just how short of a memory people really have. While Dubinsky's last couple regular seasons statistically (and yes his ACTUAL play) have been disappointing, its worth noting that the TEAMS SEASONS have not been disappointing in ANY way. He's been a "huge" part of these teams and the GROWTH of this organization, whether some people (with ZERO actual knowledge of the "inner team dynamic") want to believe it or not. His current cap hit, LIKE THE MAJORITY OF PLAYERS AT THE END OF THEIR LONG TERM UFA CONTRACTS, is a bit high. But, you're simply a hater if you think a UFA Dubinsky is worth 1 million right now or think he should or will be bought out. Or you don't know what you're talking about. Or both.

While I wish his offensive numbers were better, and I think some of this is on him, I really think people downplay what Dubinsky has been asked and tasked to do these past couple years, and who he has played with, and how this will affect his/their "offense". Not to mention people significantly downplay all of the aspects Dubinksy is good at, as if they do not impact the games or the team. Faceoffs, literally top 10 guy in the league...."ah, pointless". Regular on a top 5 PK and GO TO GUY, along with Jenner, "have you seen Wennberg's awareness out there". CLEAR leadership role and liked by the players, " OH STRIPPED of his A"...….not to mention he's literally played his BEST hockey these last couple years and been CLEARLY an ASSET when the games are the most important, during the final stretches into AND DURING the playoffs. While others are being healthy scratched.

The TRUTH is all there to SEE, if your eyes know what to look for.

 

[CBJFan827]

Bruh, the caps lock/bold/italics are too much there.

But also, no, Dubi doesn't get bought out this season, nor does he need to be.

 

[Long Live Lyle]

I don’t think so (and I’m actually leaning more and more to not only do I not think we will, but also that we shouldn’t).

Why I wouldn’t buy him out:

Even if we re-sign Duchene, we should be fine salary cap-wise next season. It’s not clear, however, what our situation will be in 2022-23 or 2021-22. Obviously, if we keep Dubinsky for this upcoming season, his contract will not impact 2022-23 (the first year of Jones’s new deal) in any way.

Additionally, if we keep him this upcoming year, we’d be in a better position next offseason to evaluate where we think we’ll be for the 2021-22 season, and be able to determine whether we should buy him out then or if doing so would cause too much harm for the 2021-22 season. If we do think that a Dubi buyout would be a problem for that season (2021-22) then we can just keep him in 2020-21 (or try to trade him). But if we buy him out now, the decision on 2021-22 is locked in and has already been made. If we determine we need the space in the 2020-21 season, you can still buy him out next offseason; you don’t need to now.

There’s also something to be said about “intangibles” (though I think they’re overrated, both generally as a concept and Dubi’s intangibles, in particular). Finally, he’s nice insurance to have if there are injuries, and is still useful when a faceoff win is needed.

Why I don’t think we will buy him out:

The aforementioned reasons, plus I think Torts/the organization hold him in higher esteem as a player than most of us on here do.

Why I think we maybe will/should buy him out:

He’s a negative on the ice. I honestly believe any of our 4th line options in the organization (Robinson, Stenlund, Hannikainen, etc.) are better players.

Further, even if you disagree with that opinion, Dubinsky being on the roster would likely prevent those younger guys from developing to their optimal potential. A guy like Robinson could still improve, but not if he’s stapled to the bench. Brandon Dubinsky is not improving; he’s only going to regress.

The counter to that argument is you could still keep him on the roster and just not play him/only put him in if there are injuries. This would be my ideal. However, I just don’t trust Torts to do it (consistently. He may occasionally healthy scratch him but when push comes to shove, he’ll throw him back in the lineup.) Also don’t know how ownership would feel about paying a guy $6M to sit in the press box.

Ultimately, though, I think keeping him one more year is probably the right play. Won’t lose sleep over whichever way the decision goes.

 

[Iron Balls McGinty]

Robinson should have been playing in Cleveland but poor management kept him staples to the bench up here unless they actually thought he would develop better riding the bench than playing under Madden which is a possibility.

 

[MoeBartoli]

Voted "no" as I don't think he will be bought out.....but I'll continue hoping.

 

[Fred Glover]

I voted no. The team isn’t better without him, so he will stay

 

[stevo61]

Personally think its pretty stupid to buy him out. Thought the Hartnell buyout was a year to soon aswell

 

[CBJx614]

Unless we make moves and bring in some more high dollar players, there's no reason to buy him out. The real question is how many games will he play next season?

 

[majormajor]

I voted no but hope yes.

Jackets already have Tyutin and Hartnell on the buyout books over the next two years (only one for Tyutin). Dubinsky proved himself semi useful in a utility role last year (faceoffs, defensive play, grinding) and although he is significantly overpaid for that role, but its not like we need the cap space right now. I think we can hold off on the buyout another year.

Exactly how buried do we have to be with Dubi out there for us to stop trucking out this old argument? 40 goals worse? 50? Is there any way he could ever lose his reputation?

 

[thebus88]

Unless we make moves and bring in some more high dollar players, there's no reason to buy him out. The real question is how many games will he play next season?

Here's a prediction I made in February that came true, Murray playing 19 less games than Wennberg...

---Another reminder that Ryan Murray is outscoring Alexander Wennberg, and very well will be at the end of the year.​

thebus88, Feb 3, 2019---

Since the poll shows and the mindset seem to be that most people (non dependant on what they "want" or think "should" happen) dont think Dubi will bought out before next year, maybe the question/poll should be altered to more of a "toss up" subject related to your question on how many games he plays.

Who plays more games in a CBJ jersey next year, Dubinsky or Wennberg?

 

[thebus88]

I voted no but hope yes.



Exactly how buried do we have to be with Dubi out there for us to stop trucking out this old argument? 40 goals worse? 50? Is there any way he could ever lose his reputation?

YOUR "NUMBERS" DO NOT MEAN WHAT YOU CLAIM THEY MEAN

He's our 2nd best defensive center (at worst) after Jenner. He's literally a top 10 guy league wide in faceoffs, and plays a huge impact on a top 5 PK league wide. Why does Wennberg get so much credit for being "so good" defensively and on the PK, yet you continue to downplay Dubinsky. Dubinsky and Jenner take the tougher matchups/top units OVER WENNBERG EVERY TIME. That WILL affect your dumb "statistics", but will show nowhere.

YOUR "NUMBERS" DO NOT MEAN WHAT YOU CLAIM THEY MEAN​

tell me what they say about his playoffs this year, though.

 

[majormajor]

While I wish his offensive numbers were better, and I think some of this is on him, I really think people downplay what Dubinsky has been asked and tasked to do these past couple years, and who he has played with, and how this will affect his/their "offense". Not to mention people significantly downplay all of the aspects Dubinksy is good at, as if they do not impact the games or the team. Faceoffs, literally top 10 guy in the league...."ah, pointless". Regular on a top 5 PK and GO TO GUY, along with Jenner, "have you seen Wennberg's awareness out there". CLEAR leadership role and liked by the players, " OH STRIPPED of his A"...….not to mention he's literally played his BEST hockey these last couple years and been CLEARLY an ASSET when the games are the most important, during the final stretches into AND DURING the playoffs. While others are being healthy scratched.

The TRUTH is all there to SEE, if your eyes know what to look for.

- You talk about usage without ever comparing Dubi to players in similar usage. You might be surprised, not all of them are getting scored on every third shift.

- The value in winning faceoffs is in starting with the possession of the puck. It's clearly one part of that. You should also be interested in someone's overall ability to maintain possession.

- Wennberg had much better results on the PK. You can't give Dubinsky credit for it. We had the best PK because the other team hardly ever scored when Cam and Wenny were on the ice.

- Dubi was back down to five minutes a night after the great Riley Nash was injured (I say "great" facetiously but he was actually carrying Dubi). A year ago in the playoffs Dubi didn't get any full shifts, it was faceoff and off.

 

[majormajor]

YOUR "NUMBERS" DO NOT MEAN WHAT YOU CLAIM THEY MEAN

He's our 2nd best defensive center (at worst) after Jenner. He's literally a top 10 guy league wide in faceoffs, and plays a huge impact on a top 5 PK league wide. Why does Wennberg get so much credit for being "so good" defensively and on the PK, yet you continue to downplay Dubinsky. Dubinsky and Jenner take the tougher matchups/to units OVER WENNBERG EVERY TIME. That WILL affect your dumb "statistics", but will show nowhere.

YOUR "NUMBERS" DO NOT MEAN WHAT YOU CLAIM THEY MEAN​

tell me what they say about his playoffs this year, though.

What does it mean when the other team scores at a McDavid rate when Dubi is out there? You tell me.

And why do I remember Cam and Wenny frequently being out there against the other clubs top PP unit?

You should also look this stuff up yourself, it's not that hard. I am on vacation and I don't feel like doing your research for you.

 

[thebus88]

- You talk about usage without ever comparing Dubi to players in similar usage. You might be surprised, not all of them are getting scored on every third shift.

Ok, why don't you show me some comparable players in similar situations? I'm simply always here to defend Dubi from bold claims, not make them. And please, show me where he gets scored on "every 3rd shift", and explain how the mathematicians came up with it.

- The value in winning faceoffs is in starting with the possession of the puck. It's clearly one part of that. You should also be interested in someone's overall ability to maintain possession.

I am, "interested in someone's overall ability to maintain possession of the puck", thanks. Every hockey team will have its Dubinsky's AND its Wennberg's. The point is that on this team, Dubinsky is the teams/Torts GO TO GUY in this situation, and he does it QUITE WELL matching up head to head against some of the toughest guys in the league, that's a FACT. I don't care what your math problems claim to tell me. Tell me how often a center taking a faceoff "maintains possession" of the puck off the faceoff. I'm being serious, give me THAT advanced statistic.

- Wennberg had much better results on the PK. You can't give Dubinsky credit for it. We had the best PK because the other team hardly ever scored when Cam and Wenny were on the ice.

Can you explain to me what opposing PP units Jenner and Dubinsky primarily played against in relation to Wennberg? Also, can you explain to me why Wennberg is gifted the tag team partner and much more impactful player, Atkinson, in your evaluations of individual players?

- Dubi was back down to five minutes a night after the great Riley Nash was injured (I say "great" facetiously but he was actually carrying Dubi). A year ago in the playoffs Dubi didn't get any full shifts, it was faceoff and off.

Nash wasn't carrying Dubinsky, the same way Vanek and Cole weren't carrying the team. Nash and Dubinsky's game just seem to mesh well and they have a bit of chemistry. Also, when the team is healthy, there will simply be a better player playing down lower in the linuep, Jenner recently for a big chunk of that time. That WILL AFFECT BOTH how good the 4 line/Dubinsky perform on the ice and how much ice time Torts will give them. Go look back at how much ice time Dubi and the "4th line" was given in the TB series and tell me he didn't play a HUGE PART in winning that series. People disagree with Torts lineup decisions all the time.

Who is, THE TRUE HEALTHY SCRATCH?

 

[thebus88]

What does it mean when the other team scores at a McDavid rate when Dubi is out there? You tell me.

What does it mean? TO ME? Nothing. The same way it mean nothing when you claim these "rates" claim Bobrovsky is as valuable to the CBJ as Tavares would be or is to other teams.

And why do I remember Cam and Wenny frequently being out there against the other clubs top PP unit?

Idk, do you have any "numbers" or "statistics" to back it up? Look at the total TOI numbers. You suspiciously leave Jenner out of all of this.

You should also look this stuff up yourself, it's not that hard. I am on vacation and I don't feel like doing your research for you.

This "stuff" is bogus claims made by you, based on math problems done on calculators, on random sites I don't know, by people with accounting degrees. Congrats, but you clearly have nothing better to do than post negative comments about Brandon Dubinsky online.

My REASEARCH has been done during the ON ICE season of the CBJ, not looking at decimals on line.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I voted no but hope yes.



Exactly how buried do we have to be with Dubi out there for us to stop trucking out this old argument? 40 goals worse? 50? Is there any way he could ever lose his reputation?

He's out there for very few goals for, of course that stat is going to be substantially negative. He's still fine for a fourth line role. If he was making 1 million dollars nobody would complain about him.

 

[Old Guy]

Sedlak......gone
Panarin ........ gone
Duchene ......... probably gone
Dzingle ......... gone

Texier ......... here
Robinson ........ maybe here

from a "NHL players in the system" perspective. I'm not sure who replaces him. I know I'm forgetting somebody.
2 of the Gone guys are centers. The CBJ are still thin at center.

I vote "no" on the buyout.

 

[koteka]

Who plays more games in a CBJ jersey next year, Dubinsky or Wennberg?

Maybe the poll should be who plays the most games in a CBJ jersey next year - Dubinsky, Wennberg, or Murray. You’ve got to throw Murray into any “who plays more” polls.

 

[EspenK]

I voted yes because that is what I hope happens. If Torts is going to limit his time and if he is a "goals against sieve" when he does play, why should he be on the team? Save $4mm and put someone else in his spot.

 

[JacketsDavid]

Nope although he is not an offensive force he is a Torts style player.
Also the CBJ seemed to be featuring him and the Captain a lot last week during Memorial Tournament, and if a player is on way out they typically avoid that.
Could it happen - certainly but as others have noted we don't need the cap space. THat could change, but right now for a team wanting to "keep guys who want to be here" would look very bad to buy out a Columbus/Dublin resident.

 

[EspenK]

These arguments to keep him seem to be we can afford him, he wants to be here and he's a face of the Jackets. Yikes. For him being a Torts player, he sure didn't get a lot of TOI that suggests that Torts loves him.

Hell, keep Wennberg for another year and buyout Dubi. Wennie still qualifies for the 1/3 buyout after next season. He can produce more than Dubi will.

 

[Maylo]

I want him to be bought out, just so Torts couldn't put him in lineup. But that's won't happen unfortunately.