Do you think that Peladeau would be a better owner?

[CDN24]

I think he is too volatile a personality.

Generally those types don't make for great owners.

Exactly, just look down the 40/417 to see how PKP would function as a owner.

 

[BenchBrawl]

Give us your opinion......do you not agree that actions speak louder than words? I think if Gillette stayed the owner, we would be much better off.

I see nothing Molson did that indicates he doesn't care about winning. He decided to keep Bergevin—get over it, and honestly the direction the team is going right now indicates that Bergevin did deserve a second chance.

It's hard to know whether Bergevin got screwed by the circumstances at some point—with insider problems that both Molson and Bergevin were aware of—so that Molson knew Bergevin couldn't have done anything significantly better with the cards he got dealt.

It's already clear that the main move that triggered so much venom Bergevin's way—namely the Subban-Weber trade—was actually a great trade from Bergevin; not because Weber is so much better than Subban, but because Subban was a problem (whether people like it or not, and to what extent I don't know but enough to ship him out of town in his prime a few days before his NMC activated) and he had a short window to trade him. The fact that Bergevin managed to bring someone of the caliber of Shea Weber in a difficult situation was huge. Bad apple star players got traded for peanuts in the past. Shea brings a good level both on and off the ice. The Subban situation could have turned out so much worse than getting Shea Weber it's not even funny.

So if we abstract this trade, and actually put it as a solid X on the win column for Bergy, then yeah he made other bad moves, but even the Droui-Sergachev trade could turn out good. Drouin might just blow up. It was a chance to bring an exciting french-canadian superstar forward at reasonably low cost (yeah Sergachev is good, but he's not a sure-bet neither). It was a reasonable 1-for-1 gamble.

So if you take all this, and the fact Molson kept Bergevin—how is this not caring about team results? People have pride—not everyone is just a pure greedy gluton. And even among greedy gluton you will find a lot of them also have an ego and aim for glory. It would be extremely surprising if in his inner mind Molson didn't care about winning a cup. Molson was born rich. He knows a part of his legacy is how his teams will perform.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Exactly, just look down the 40/417 to see how PKP would function as a owner.

Even Melnyk never sought the spotlight as much as PKP has.

 

[beowulf]

Yes, PKP at least has dignity. a lot of honor and wants to win. HE also understand how big of a cultural concept Montreal Canadiens are

That's so funny. Dignity? Honor? Hahaha

 

[Vachon23]

Who would you like as President of Hockey Operation ?

 

[BLONG7]

I see nothing Molson did that indicates he doesn't care about winning. He decided to keep Bergevin—get over it, and honestly the direction the team is going right now indicates that Bergevin did deserve a second chance.

It's hard to know whether Bergevin got screwed by the circumstances at some point—with insider problems that both Molson and Bergevin were aware of—so that Molson knew Bergevin couldn't have done anything significantly better with the cards he got dealt.

It's already clear that the main move that triggered so much venom Bergevin's way—namely the Subban-Weber trade—was actually a great trade from Bergevin; not because Weber is so much better than Subban, but because Subban was a problem (whether people like it or not, and to what extent I don't know but enough to ship him out of town in his prime a few days before his NMC activated) and he had a short window to trade him. The fact that Bergevin managed to bring someone of the caliber of Shea Weber in a difficult situation was huge. Bad apple star players got traded for peanuts in the past. Shea brings a good level both on and off the ice.

So if we abstract this trade, and actually put it as a solid X on the win column for Bergy, then yeah he made other bad moves, but even the Droui-Sergachev trade could turn out good. Drouin might just blow up. It was a chance to bring an exciting french-canadian superstar forward at reasonably low cost (yeah Sergachev is good, but he's not a sure-bet neither). It was a reasonable 1-for-1 gamble.

So if you take all this, and the fact Molson kept Bergevin—how is this not caring about team results? People have pride—not everyone is just a pure greedy gluton. And even among greedy gluton you will find a lot of them also have an ego and aim for glory. It would be extremely surprising if in his inner mind Molson didn't care about winning a cup. Molson was born rich. He knows a part of his legacy is how his teams will perform.

We will agree to disagree. No worries, I wont stoop to tell you your post is pure delirium...it's a message board after all. Most of us want the team to succeed, some are ok with the goalposts getting moved 8 years later. Apathy is creeping for alot of people, under Mol$on/Bergevin the Habs no longer sell out.

With ZERO results under Mol$on/Bergevin, most fans are not happy. Mol$on is not a bad owner, he just doesn't really know what he is doing, again that's results based.

 

[BenchBrawl]

We will agree to disagree. No worries, I wont stoop to tell you your post is pure delirium...it's a message board after all. Most of us want the team to succeed, some are ok with the goalposts getting moved 8 years later. Apathy is creeping for alot of people, under Mol$on/Bergevin the Habs no longer sell out.

With ZERO results under Mol$on/Bergevin, most fans are not happy. Mol$on is not a bad owner, he just doesn't really know what he is doing, again that's results based.

I agree team results matter but the circumstances were very unlucky for us. IMO Subban really cost the team a lot, and it's incomprehensible to me why fans like him so much. Yeah, he was an exciting player, but whatever it is he did that got him shipped out of town really screwed the team progression. Then you have Pacioretty, who wasn't that great a leader neither. So we had a team build around Price, Subban and Pacioretty, and it didn't work because two of them didn't have what it takes (for different reasons). Now throw in Galchenyuk who is basically wasting his talent and life, and yeah, that's a bad hand of cards. I think what Bergevin did with this hand is almost a miracle—but the price to pay is a few years of reconstruction, something we avoided for 25 years with glorious results.

As far as I'm concerned the mere fact that Molson and Bergevin are doing a cover-rebuild puts them over anyone since the mid-1990s as a managing duo.

Gillette's superstar employee was Pierre Boivin, who really raised the enthousiasm for the team among the fanbase to unprecedented levels. Gillette made a really nice money "flip" with the club, that's all. Gillette was a great owner from the marketing side because Pierre Boivin did one of the greatest marketing job this country has ever seen in any field. What Boivin did, purely from a business and marketing standpoint, is so underrated. The guy deserved millions and millions of dollars.

 

[BLONG7]

I agree team results matter but the circumstances were very unlucky for us. IMO Subban really cost the team a lot, and it's incomprehensible to me why fans like him so much. Yeah, he was an exciting player, but whatever it is he did that got him shipped out of town really screwed the team progression. Then you have Pacioretty, who wasn't that great a leader neither. So we had a team build around Price, Subban and Pacioretty, and it didn't work because two of them didn't have what it takes (for different reasons). Now throw in Galchenyuk who is basically wasting his talent and life, and yeah, that's a bad hand of cards. I think what Bergevin did with this hand is almost a miracle—but the price to pay is a few years of reconstruction, something we avoided for 25 years with glorious results.

As far as I'm concerned the mere fact that Molson and Bergevin are doing a cover-rebuild puts them over anyone since the mid-1990s as a managing duo.

Gillette's superstar employee was Pierre Boivin, who really raised the enthousiasm for the team among the fanbase to unprecedented levels. Gillette made a really nice money "flip" with the club, that's all. Gillette was a great owner from the marketing side because Pierre Boivin did one of the greatest marketing job this country has ever seen in any field. What Boivin did, purely from a business and marketing standpoint, is so underrated. The guy deserved millions and millions of dollars.

You make some good points, but MB caused alot of the current issues, himself. Wasn't a fan of what he has done, and am of the belief that we would be better without him...again just my 2 cents. He has had one good offseason....one. He has just gone through his 8th.

Would love to be wrong, and see he and Mol$on get us out of the gutter, but his philosophy ( MB ) so flawed, it's hard not to be cynical.

 

[BenchBrawl]

You make some good points, but MB caused alot of the current issues, himself. Wasn't a fan of what he has done, and am of the belief that we would be better without him...again just my 2 cents. He has had one good offseason....one. He has just gone through his 8th.

Would love to be wrong, and see he and Mol$on get us out of the gutter, but his philosophy ( MB ) so flawed, it's hard not to be cynical.

Man...

If you actually look at Bergevin's trade history—the thing he has most control over since free agent signings are dependant on wehether the players want to come here—he has a great track record.

I really don't care about minor trades and the likes.

When I look at his trade record, what I see is this:

—Acquire Jeff Petry for a 2nd and 5th round picks.
—Acquire Phillip Danault for Dale Weise and Tomas Fleischman
—Acquire Shea Weber for P.K. Subban
—Acquire Jonathan Drouin for Mikail Sergachev
—Acquire Max Domi for Alex Galchenyuk
—Acquire Tomas Tatar, Nick Suzuki and a 2nd round pick for Max Pacioretty

For me that's the 6 main trades. Maybe the Eller trade could count but meh. In my eyes, he literally won every single one of those trade with the sole exception of Drouin-Sergachev which is still up for grab depending how each player develop. I mean, Petry, Danault, Domi were added for what is basically a bag of pucks. Pacioretty was done, it's amazing we got Tatar and Suzuki for him, regardless of how Suzuki turn out. He just made the team at age 20—not bad ! Subban had to go, so acquiring Weber for him in such a short window was impressive and a clear win. Even the Drouin trade was well-received at the time.

I fail to see how a GM with this trade record is seen as anything but a pure shark.

 

[salbutera]

If Molson were to move the Habs to a no state tax US market would build a Vegas type contender within 2-3 years, even if he stays on as President...

Is issue is over 70% based on the geographical location hindering the teams ability to lure elite talent via UFA or waiving of NMC/NTC, thus leaving only one option to build...draft (which is the 30% blame the org deserves for not thinking out of the box during Molson’s tenure to be the leader in amateur scouting & player development).

 

[BenchBrawl]

I don't understand why the goverment doesn't just pass a law that don't tax Montreal Canadiens players. It's so ingrained in the culture, it's worth it. Rather have a few championships than the few millions a year this gives us.

 

[GordonGraham]

He keeps saying Bergevin can spend all the money he wants , yet year after year the team is far from the cap, so either he's lying or not putting enough pressure on Bergevin to make the playoffs

 

[The Real Timo]

Hahahahahahha Pierre-Karl

Oooh... and then he can get Pernell Karl back...

 

[HockeyDBspecialist]

That's so funny. Dignity? Honor? Hahaha

way more than Molson, ya

 

[CHwest]

Disagree on that. Everyone wants to win and make money. Maybe you have a leg to stand on if you said he values money more than winning but saying he doesn't care about winning? Sorry, I disagree.

Actions speak louder than words, and by his actions I don't believe he cares. If he did the bin man would be shown the door, he really is beginning to sound and talk like Harold Ballard.
If he does care then he is too afraid that he's going to screw up the next hire that he is frozen. Either way the team is mediocre, just miss the playoffs and brag that if we were in the west we would have made the playoffs. Or the bin mans line, once you make the playoffs anything can happen.

 

[calder candidate]

Molson has is issues, but I think PKP could be worst. I don’t see any quality that I like too see in a owner also I think he either has too much ego or not enough self control...

 

[Toene]

I don't understand why the goverment doesn't just pass a law that don't tax Montreal Canadiens players. It's so ingrained in the culture, it's worth it. Rather have a few championships than the few millions a year this gives us.

Canadian teams are punished by the cap and revenue sharing. The solution is pressuring the NHL. Tell them you wont share shit if you dont get an equal playing field with the southern USA teams. If the Habs bailed from the NHL the league execs would freak out.

But honestly it's my biggest wish as a hockey fan, even if we'll never see it : a Champions-league/Super-league model, no salary cap, the stackedest teams against each other. Im so envious of the top soccer clubs who get to see superstars at each position instead of the shuffling around of sub .5 ppg bums we're forced to watch right now. Maybe Im missing the Olympics but imagine if the Habs would have an olympic-level squad... Why is it we have to put on the brakes in spending just so other small markets can follow... It's good for parity and stuff but for this Habs fan it doesnt make me enjoy the show any more. We havent had an offensive superstar in decades. If we could just throw 20M$ to Matthews/McDavid we would and we wouldnt be stuck watching literal whos on our powerplay.

/rant

 

[Tighthead]

way more than Molson, ya

Specifically how does he have more dignity? I need detail.

 

[ahmedou]

Nooooooooooooooppppppppeeeeeeeee

In which side are you? A Bell fan? A Videotron hater?

 

[1909]

Peladeau is a very rough and tough boss. Just ask his actual and past employees. He is very agressive. Too much for NHL's big brass. And the fact that he is a "separatist", doesn't help him.

 

[hotcarle]

He'd move us to Quebec. I'd say it's a heel turn, but he's already a heel. So it's just a heel doing heel things.

 

[BLONG7]

Man...

If you actually look at Bergevin's trade history—the thing he has most control over since free agent signings are dependant on wehether the players want to come here—he has a great track record.

I really don't care about minor trades and the likes.

When I look at his trade record, what I see is this:

—Acquire Jeff Petry for a 2nd and 5th round picks.
—Acquire Phillip Danault for Dale Weise and Tomas Fleischman
—Acquire Shea Weber for P.K. Subban
—Acquire Jonathan Drouin for Mikail Sergachev
—Acquire Max Domi for Alex Galchenyuk
—Acquire Tomas Tatar, Nick Suzuki and a 2nd round pick for Max Pacioretty

For me that's the 6 main trades. Maybe the Eller trade could count but meh. In my eyes, he literally won every single one of those trade with the sole exception of Drouin-Sergachev which is still up for grab depending how each player develop. I mean, Petry, Danault, Domi were added for what is basically a bag of pucks. Pacioretty was done, it's amazing we got Tatar and Suzuki for him, regardless of how Suzuki turn out. He just made the team at age 20—not bad ! Subban had to go, so acquiring Weber for him in such a short window was impressive and a clear win. Even the Drouin trade was well-received at the time.

I fail to see how a GM with this trade record is seen as anything but a pure shark.

If and only if we could base his performance on his trades, I might think he is pretty saavy also........................but trades are just ONE part of a GM's job. No one will say he hasn't made some nice moves. Not sure why people only want to talk about the good trades, when the bad one's have to also be factored in, just my 2 cents, again.

His flaws outweigh his trades.......if it was based off of trades and trades only, we would have a good team during his reign, and the only time we had a good team during his tenure, was when he first took over. Which of course wasn't his team.

Being a middle team, and not making the playoffs, and literally drafting in the middle 15th overall, the proof is in the pudding.

It's an endless circle of sorts, not sure how you can defend Bergevin for his pi$$ poor results. For me, I am truly tired of rinse and repeat, and no let's not talk about the past, just the new re-set. lol

When asked last week, if the Habs had to be in the playoffs this year, he would not answer it, and kinda sounded like Trudeau out on the campaign trail.

Again, my 2 cents, so we will just agree to disagree. Trader Marc needs to be held accountable for more than just trades. Every other GM is held accountable at some point.

Cheers!

 

[LyricalLyricist]

I don't understand why the goverment doesn't just pass a law that don't tax Montreal Canadiens players. It's so ingrained in the culture, it's worth it. Rather have a few championships than the few millions a year this gives us.

If the habs pay the lost taxes then sure. Otherwise no.

I think it’s unfair to put players on a pedestal like that.

 

[Edgy]

I agree team results matter but the circumstances were very unlucky for us. IMO Subban really cost the team a lot, and it's incomprehensible to me why fans like him so much. Yeah, he was an exciting player, but whatever it is he did that got him shipped out of town really screwed the team progression. Then you have Pacioretty, who wasn't that great a leader neither. So we had a team build around Price, Subban and Pacioretty, and it didn't work because two of them didn't have what it takes (for different reasons). Now throw in Galchenyuk who is basically wasting his talent and life, and yeah, that's a bad hand of cards. I think what Bergevin did with this hand is almost a miracle—but the price to pay is a few years of reconstruction, something we avoided for 25 years with glorious results.

As far as I'm concerned the mere fact that Molson and Bergevin are doing a cover-rebuild puts them over anyone since the mid-1990s as a managing duo.

Gillette's superstar employee was Pierre Boivin, who really raised the enthousiasm for the team among the fanbase to unprecedented levels. Gillette made a really nice "flip", that's all.

Subban wasn't the problem, our handling of him was. The organization did not like him having an image outside the team, he was crafting his "brand" and the organization wanted him to fall in line. MT publicly saying he wants to make Subban a better person" really speaks volumes to how we manage young stars in an ever evolving world. Same with Galchenyuk and Bergevin turning it to a personal and very public one died-feud with him. Calling him out even before the season started, saying he will not play him at center, he has seen enough to determine he's not a fit there. We proceed to put him on the 4th freakin line, a checking line, on the wing so he could "learn to play center". Same with Markov, Radulov and Pacioretty. We went from a world class organization to an all crass organization under Bergevin and co.

Trading Subban for Weber was unnecessary, Subban was under contract and would have simply continued to play.
Trading Galchenyuk would not have been necessary had they actually tried to develop him properly instead of letting MT and Bergevin cradle DD at his expense.
Bergevin clearly learned nothing from his time in Chicago.
Pacioretty wasn't a great leader, I agree. He should have never been named captain and players voted for him my ass.
Trading Sergachev was a stupid move and an obvious PR stunt that has yet to pay off on or off the ice.
Not paying Radulov and extra mil he asked for to keep him was another ego move that backfired.
Not re-signing Markov and not having a replacement in place left us with a gaping hole on LD that has yet to be filled.

He wasn't dealt a bad hand, he didn't know how to play the game and threw away good cards needlessly. Now he's saying the game is hard because he still can't fix what he broke.

 

[dinodebino]

PKP is mentally unstable. You don't want that.